Price of seatbelts £2,247!
Discussion
I have just been reading a write up on a Mclaren 650S Spider and among some eye raising prices for extras from £8,632 for a special paint and carbon mirror arms at £3,505 the one that made me gulp the most was £2,247 for yellow seatbelts! I mean seriously how much are a pair of seatbelts anyway and when you think the car comes with a pair as standard obliviously what you are paying for is only the colour change in the material, that's a serious amount for yellow dye! Does anyone know what other Supercar manufacturers charge for different colours?
On several occasions I have had 6-points made up from scratch to bespoke measurements. The makers were the same guys who supply some of the Formula One grid, so the quality is there. A pair of sets costs, IIRC, IRO £500-600.
It is true that it costs a mass producer of seat belts something additional to introduce a new colour material to the assembly line, but the marginal increase in cost must be small.
I think we know that car makers generate most of their profits on options, finance, servicing, resale, and everything else that is not embedded in the sticker price of the new car itself. A certain car maker charged me £20k to order a custom paint for one new, very expensive new car, and subsequently charged me £8k to order the exact same custom paint for a less expensive new car. It was obvious that the charge was derived from a calculated estimate of what the market would bear, rather than what it would cost the car maker to provide the service.
It is true that it costs a mass producer of seat belts something additional to introduce a new colour material to the assembly line, but the marginal increase in cost must be small.
I think we know that car makers generate most of their profits on options, finance, servicing, resale, and everything else that is not embedded in the sticker price of the new car itself. A certain car maker charged me £20k to order a custom paint for one new, very expensive new car, and subsequently charged me £8k to order the exact same custom paint for a less expensive new car. It was obvious that the charge was derived from a calculated estimate of what the market would bear, rather than what it would cost the car maker to provide the service.
I bought some light grey seat belts for my X19 they cost me £60 for the pair and the actual price of coloured red blue black webbing complying to the automotive spec needed is 85p a metre as shown in PT Winchester's website and several other manufacturers! But what makes me smile is you are already paying for black webbing which is the same price as yellow that Mclaren buy in (I doubt they make their own) yet they want over £2k extra!
Odd, I'm pretty sure for coloured seat belts in the 675 its only £600.
I guess with all these things there are prices, and then there are asking prices, you won't know unless you ask for some discount. I did and managed to get a large sum off of a few options with a bit of negotiating.
I guess with all these things there are prices, and then there are asking prices, you won't know unless you ask for some discount. I did and managed to get a large sum off of a few options with a bit of negotiating.
Kevin-sz0nv said:
I am only repeating what I saw in a write up online I am sure someone on here can clarify the asking price but if I can buy yellow webbing for the same price as black I am pretty sure Mclaren can....
Obviously there is a massive mark-up, but the extra cost of making the belts is not in purchasing the different raw material but rather in interrupting production in order to switch to the new webbing, fitting a different colour thread in the sewing machines, then interrupting a second time to switch back to the standard materials. It is also possible - I'm not sure - that the different colour webbing had to undergo a separate type approval regime, the cost of which would have to be amortised within many fewer units. Again, the price charged is grossly disproportionate to the additional costs incurred, but there are additional costs incurred in production.
Flemke...That's understandable if Maclaren made their own belts but I very much doubt they do and I bet their belts are the same as most other UK manufacturers who will buy them wholesale from a UK company, these companies are advertised on the web and they are the same or very similar price for different colours off the peg. I very much doubt that whoever supplies Maclaren have to stop production so to speak and produce yellow webbing just for their special order! Google seatbelts or yellow seatbelts they really are less than £1 a meter and the same price as black which as I keep pointing out whoever buys a 650 has already paid for black seatbelts in the list price. Also as far as raw material goes surely the only difference will be in the dye that colours the webbing as in black dye or yellow dye? Send your original belts to a company like Safetybelts at Bedford and they will change your belts to any colour so they must make a profit taking your belt apart fitting with another colour and putting the belt back together for less than £50 a belt !
Edited by Kevin-sz0nv on Friday 25th September 15:55
Edited by Kevin-sz0nv on Friday 25th September 15:57
Kevin-sz0nv said:
Flemke...That's understandable if Maclaren made their own belts but I very much doubt they do and I bet their belts are the same as most other UK manufacturers who will buy them wholesale from a UK company, these companies are advertised on the web and they are the same or very similar price for different colours off the peg. I very much doubt that whoever supplies Maclaren have to stop production so to speak and produce yellow webbing just for their special order! Google seatbelts or yellow seatbelts they really are less than £1 a meter and the same price as black which as I keep pointing out whoever buys a 650 has already paid for black seatbelts in the list price. Also as far as raw material goes surely the only difference will be in the dye that colours the webbing as in black dye or yellow dye? Send your original belts to a company like Safetybelts at Bedford and they will change your belts to any colour so they must make a profit taking your belt apart fitting with another colour and putting the belt back together for less than £50 a belt !
I agree, as I think I said, that the cost of raw materials is essentially unchanged.Having had a look at SBS's website, I shall refrain from commenting, apart from asking whether their products are OEM type-approved.
I guess the other thing that I would say is that the belt-making firm with which I have dealt (the one that supplies to Formula One constructors, amongst others) will always decline, as a matter of policy, to take the hardware from a set of used belts and sew it into new webbing. One might say, "We'll, they would have that policy, wouldn't they?", but, in the case of the single most important safety device, it has to make sense to be certain of the provenance of every component in the system.
flemke said:
It is also possible - I'm not sure - that the different colour webbing had to undergo a separate type approval regime, the cost of which would have to be amortised within many fewer units.
Again, the price charged is grossly disproportionate to the additional costs incurred, but there are additional costs incurred in production.
If the different colour webbing has to be retested for type approval is the same as saying a black car was sent for type approval but a yellow one might also have to be sent! Its the same car just a different colour as the belt is the same belt just a different colour. I cannot agree that there are additional costs incurred by the factory fitting a different coloured belt as I have pointed out the makers of these belts don't charge anything extra and you can be sure Maclaren will not pay anymore than Joe Public, at the end of the day whatever Maclaren charge its near enough all profit and some!Again, the price charged is grossly disproportionate to the additional costs incurred, but there are additional costs incurred in production.
flemke said:
Kevin-sz0nv said:
I am only repeating what I saw in a write up online I am sure someone on here can clarify the asking price but if I can buy yellow webbing for the same price as black I am pretty sure Mclaren can....
interrupting production in order to switch to the new webbing, fitting a different colour thread in the sewing machines, then interrupting a second time to switch back to the standard materialsnorthwest monkey said:
flemke said:
Kevin-sz0nv said:
I am only repeating what I saw in a write up online I am sure someone on here can clarify the asking price but if I can buy yellow webbing for the same price as black I am pretty sure Mclaren can....
interrupting production in order to switch to the new webbing, fitting a different colour thread in the sewing machines, then interrupting a second time to switch back to the standard materials
Kevin-sz0nv said:
flemke said:
It is also possible - I'm not sure - that the different colour webbing had to undergo a separate type approval regime, the cost of which would have to be amortised within many fewer units.
Again, the price charged is grossly disproportionate to the additional costs incurred, but there are additional costs incurred in production.
If the different colour webbing has to be retested for type approval is the same as saying a black car was sent for type approval but a yellow one might also have to be sent! Its the same car just a different colour as the belt is the same belt just a different colour. I cannot agree that there are additional costs incurred by the factory fitting a different coloured belt as I have pointed out the makers of these belts don't charge anything extra and you can be sure Maclaren will not pay anymore than Joe Public, at the end of the day whatever Maclaren charge its near enough all profit and some!Again, the price charged is grossly disproportionate to the additional costs incurred, but there are additional costs incurred in production.
Flemke
I think we both did agree that whatever the costs involved the price Mclaren asks is pretty silly, I can understand when you pay for an extra like a carbon part but over £2k for a seatbelt that you have already paid for but in yellow is taking things a bit too far, I don't think MG charged anymore for red belts in the Metro! But hey they can obviously sell them at that price and £2k to me is equivalent to £2 to someone else, everything is relevant. I have been on here since the very early days with Ted (under a different user name)so it's nice to agree to disagree so to speak as is customary on here nowadays when you have a different opinion to someone else it can end up getting personal and silly!
All the best
I think we both did agree that whatever the costs involved the price Mclaren asks is pretty silly, I can understand when you pay for an extra like a carbon part but over £2k for a seatbelt that you have already paid for but in yellow is taking things a bit too far, I don't think MG charged anymore for red belts in the Metro! But hey they can obviously sell them at that price and £2k to me is equivalent to £2 to someone else, everything is relevant. I have been on here since the very early days with Ted (under a different user name)so it's nice to agree to disagree so to speak as is customary on here nowadays when you have a different opinion to someone else it can end up getting personal and silly!
All the best
flemke said:
Kevin-sz0nv said:
Flemke...That's understandable if Maclaren made their own belts but I very much doubt they do and I bet their belts are the same as most other UK manufacturers who will buy them wholesale from a UK company, these companies are advertised on the web and they are the same or very similar price for different colours off the peg. I very much doubt that whoever supplies Maclaren have to stop production so to speak and produce yellow webbing just for their special order! Google seatbelts or yellow seatbelts they really are less than £1 a meter and the same price as black which as I keep pointing out whoever buys a 650 has already paid for black seatbelts in the list price. Also as far as raw material goes surely the only difference will be in the dye that colours the webbing as in black dye or yellow dye? Send your original belts to a company like Safetybelts at Bedford and they will change your belts to any colour so they must make a profit taking your belt apart fitting with another colour and putting the belt back together for less than £50 a belt !
I agree, as I think I said, that the cost of raw materials is essentially unchanged.Having had a look at SBS's website, I shall refrain from commenting, apart from asking whether their products are OEM type-approved.
I guess the other thing that I would say is that the belt-making firm with which I have dealt (the one that supplies to Formula One constructors, amongst others) will always decline, as a matter of policy, to take the hardware from a set of used belts and sew it into new webbing. One might say, "We'll, they would have that policy, wouldn't they?", but, in the case of the single most important safety device, it has to make sense to be certain of the provenance of every component in the system.
Takata use a standard variety of webbing colours, all of which are pre approved before they offer it into the customer.
This, I'm afraid, is McLaren looking to see what it can charge into the market, and pocketing the rest.
Everyone knows they are making a profit, and of course it's there business prerogative to do so, but no one likes to feel like they're being fleeced
There's umpteen examples of this happening in all the premium brand makers, and I think Ferrari rub their hands together every time someone pays a substantial amount on similar things like the shields or £1k to change the stitching colour on a dash leather
It doesn't take a rocket scientist to make a very quick calculation of several of the low cost/high price options, and if you're sensitive to such things, I wouldn't even start to look at how little it costs comparatively to the option price for some of the carbon niceties that Mclaren and Ferrari have on their 'extras' portfolio
I can understand why they do it though, as many of their customers buy with their hearts rather than their heads, but there you go...
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