Living and working in Amsterdam, Berlin or Zürich?
Discussion
It is time 2016 and time for a change. My wife and I have lived in NYC for 7 years now and fancy living in Europe again. She is American (but very well traveled) and should be able to keep working for the same consulting company, just remotely. I have a somewhat specialist job building Artificial Intelligence systems, so would need to be somewhere with a thriving startup/tech scene. Visa's should not be a problem.
London is out as I used to live there. The same is true of Italy. Nothing wrong with either, just looking for a new adventure.
Amsterdam, Berlin and Zürich are currently on the shortlist, but open to all ideas. No children yet, but working on it...
For those who are living in Europe, where do you recommend or advise us to think about? Good food, culture and a healthy lifestyle all a must.
London is out as I used to live there. The same is true of Italy. Nothing wrong with either, just looking for a new adventure.
Amsterdam, Berlin and Zürich are currently on the shortlist, but open to all ideas. No children yet, but working on it...
For those who are living in Europe, where do you recommend or advise us to think about? Good food, culture and a healthy lifestyle all a must.
OP: If you're an EU citizen/passport holder, living/working in the EU for your wife, so long as you're working too, won't be such an issue. (I've an Australian colleague who was able to live and work in Lux as he lived here with his Belgian wife.)
Switzerland, I've learned from others who've lived/continue to live in/around Zurich, is less welcoming to foreigners.
If I had a choice from those 3 cities then, Zurich wouldn't be #1 choice. Amsterdam 1st, Berlin 2nd.
Zutrich and it's surrounding areas are just so effing expensive too.
Switzerland, I've learned from others who've lived/continue to live in/around Zurich, is less welcoming to foreigners.
If I had a choice from those 3 cities then, Zurich wouldn't be #1 choice. Amsterdam 1st, Berlin 2nd.
Zutrich and it's surrounding areas are just so effing expensive too.
I've worked in all three at one time or another. It's worth mentioning that I speak French & German (plus a couple of other languages) but not Dutch. For me Zurich would be first choice, followed by Berlin. Zurich and Geneva are great places to live & work, if a little expensive. Berlin is also very vibrant. Amsterdam / Amstelveen by contrast aren't as enjoyable to live in - Amsterdam centre gets regularly invaded by drunken tourists, and can be quite intimidating in places. Zurich & Geneva aren't scary at night, parts of Amsterdam can be.
I'm working in The Hague at the moment and I reckon the beer's better in Holland than most of the other places you mentioned, however for motoring enthusiasts the roads are s
t. The stretch of Holland from Rotterdam to north of Amsterdam is a bit of an urban sprawl and Den Haag to Amsterdam is only about 40 mins on the train, with trains running about every 10 minutes, so you might want to consider a wider area than just Amsterdam. I'm not a townie but I'm starting to quite like Den Haag, small city a decent selection of shops/restaurants/theatres/etc and only 15 minutes from the beach. big advantage of Holland is everyone speaks English so no language barrier when you first start, although it makes learning it a bit harder.
There are Netherlands, Germany and Swiss subforums in the International PHers section that have a fair few ex-pats and locals so worth asking in there
t. The stretch of Holland from Rotterdam to north of Amsterdam is a bit of an urban sprawl and Den Haag to Amsterdam is only about 40 mins on the train, with trains running about every 10 minutes, so you might want to consider a wider area than just Amsterdam. I'm not a townie but I'm starting to quite like Den Haag, small city a decent selection of shops/restaurants/theatres/etc and only 15 minutes from the beach. big advantage of Holland is everyone speaks English so no language barrier when you first start, although it makes learning it a bit harder.There are Netherlands, Germany and Swiss subforums in the International PHers section that have a fair few ex-pats and locals so worth asking in there
Edited by RizzoTheRat on Tuesday 5th January 11:29
I've lived in Zurich the past 5 years and loved every minute. Great little city with fantastic quality of living, although can be a bit sleepy on a Sunday. If you like the outdoors that's not so much of a problem as its a 1-2hr train ride to the Alps for some hiking/skiing, otherwise you've got the lake in Summer and dedicated bike routes to explore.
One thing I would say is the food/cuisine isn't great but then that's probably down to me being spoilt with the variety of London. Yes, it is very expensive in Switzerland but local salaries should help adjust for that.
If you've any questions feel free to ask
One thing I would say is the food/cuisine isn't great but then that's probably down to me being spoilt with the variety of London. Yes, it is very expensive in Switzerland but local salaries should help adjust for that.
If you've any questions feel free to ask
I've lived in Zürich for two years now and I think it's a great place to live as an ex-pat, especially with kids.
We actually live 10 miles outside the city next to the lake and although the cost of living isn't cheap the rent isn't too bad, and is certainly a bit cheaper than London. Have a look at homegate.ch to get an idea of what it costs to rent somewhere here, public transport is excellent so living outside the city and commuting in is easy to do, there's a big ex-pat community in the area along the western side of the lake from Kilchberg down to Wädenswil.
Where you live impacts on your tax rate, both the canton and the town make a noticeable difference, again homegate.ch has a calculator to see what you're likely to pay. Schindellegi, Wollerau and Feusisberg are very low tax, as are Baar and Zug, while still being commutable to the city.
As above, the food is average and expensive compared to London or New York but the other elements make up for that in my view.
Health insurance is compulsory. expect to pay at least 300CHF per month each for basic insurance and more if you want to go private. At the end of the day though you're still going to be better off because of the low income tax rates.
Everything is clean and works properly, there is almost no crime, you can ski in winter and cycle or swim in summer and there are great connections from Zürich airport if you need to travel, so I think it's a great choice if you're planning a family.
We actually live 10 miles outside the city next to the lake and although the cost of living isn't cheap the rent isn't too bad, and is certainly a bit cheaper than London. Have a look at homegate.ch to get an idea of what it costs to rent somewhere here, public transport is excellent so living outside the city and commuting in is easy to do, there's a big ex-pat community in the area along the western side of the lake from Kilchberg down to Wädenswil.
Where you live impacts on your tax rate, both the canton and the town make a noticeable difference, again homegate.ch has a calculator to see what you're likely to pay. Schindellegi, Wollerau and Feusisberg are very low tax, as are Baar and Zug, while still being commutable to the city.
As above, the food is average and expensive compared to London or New York but the other elements make up for that in my view.
Health insurance is compulsory. expect to pay at least 300CHF per month each for basic insurance and more if you want to go private. At the end of the day though you're still going to be better off because of the low income tax rates.
Everything is clean and works properly, there is almost no crime, you can ski in winter and cycle or swim in summer and there are great connections from Zürich airport if you need to travel, so I think it's a great choice if you're planning a family.
Thank you for all advice, it is all well received. I still have my British passport so a visa for Europe should not be a problem although obviously Switzerland is a different matter. At the moment I am working as an independent consultant for US-based clients so will need to work out if it will be practical to keep them, or would need to find brand-new clients.
No matter where we end up, we are both want to learn the local language and make a point of fitting in. I have missed driving in Europe and some of the scenery.
No matter where we end up, we are both want to learn the local language and make a point of fitting in. I have missed driving in Europe and some of the scenery.
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