Turbo Timers??

[polrules]

Apologies if I'm going over old ground but I need an argument settled.

My new car has a turbo timer fitted (R33 Skyline incidentally) which takes over once the ignition is switched to 'off'. It's a more advanced unit which will sense how I'm driving and adjust subsequent idle time to suit.

Now usually it only goes for something like 40secs-1min which I usually spend removing stereo/putting on jacket etc so I don't leave the car until the engine has gone off. But following a 'spirited' drive recently the countdown began for 4mins 30 secs to which I though 'sod that ' I'm not hanging about for this. My question - is it illegal to leave the car with the engine going (despite being locked with alarm active) and if so what could I expect if caught??

Cheers all

Paul.

[MR2Mike]

Leaving a motor vehicle engine running whilst stationary is an offence under Regulation 98 of the Construction and Use Regulations with the following exemptions:


Where a vehicle is stationary `owing to the necessities of traffic’ – eg when vehicles are queuing at traffic lights;

Where an engine is being run so that a defect can be traced and rectified – eg when a disabled vehicle is being attended to by a breakdown / recovery agent;

Where machinery on a vehicle requires the engine to be running – eg where the engine powers refrigeration equipment or the compaction equipment in a refuse vehicle;

Where a vehicle is propelled by gas produced by the functioning of plant carried on the vehicle.


Furthermore, leaving a vehicle unattended with the engine running is in contravention of Regulation 107.

So I'd have to say that it is quite definately naughty to use a turbo timer unless you wait until ther engine stops running before leaving the car.

[aka keith]

IIRC, I was on the understanding that you also had to leave the car with the handbrake off for the offence to occur. That is, if you leave the handbrake on and the car is locked then no offence committed even if the engine is running

I would be happy to be proven wrong and I await comment from the BIB's and DVD.

Cheers
aka keith

[Mr E]

Indeed. I also have a TT, and I usually sit in the car waiting for it to sort itself out.

Except when it's on my drive at home, then I'll go into the house and faff about.

[tycho]

MR2Mike said:

Where machinery on a vehicle requires the engine to be running – eg where the engine powers refrigeration equipment or the compaction equipment in a refuse vehicle;

Couldn't this cover the situation? The engine is powering the cooling system and requires the engine to be on in order to work.

[MR2Mike]

tycho said:

MR2Mike said: Where machinery on a vehicle requires the engine to be running – eg where the engine powers refrigeration equipment or the compaction equipment in a refuse vehicle; Couldn't this cover the situation? The engine is powering the cooling system and requires the engine to be on in order to work.

I think the intent of this is to cover separate pieces of machinery that are dependant on the engine rather than the normal components of the vehicle. You could use the same argument about the radio, the aircon or the power steering pump.

[GreenV8S]

Aren't emergency vehicles routinely left unattended with the engines running?

[fer]

GreenV8S said:

Aren't emergency vehicles routinely left unattended with the engines running?

Gone mentioned ages ago they have something called "Run Stop" as they need the engine to run the lights, etc. But if you try and drive off it would die straight away. (Might have been when he was still Mad )

[supraman2954]

MR2Mike said:

tycho said: MR2Mike said: Where machinery on a vehicle requires the engine to be running – eg where the engine powers refrigeration equipment or the compaction equipment in a refuse vehicle; Couldn't this cover the situation? The engine is powering the cooling system and requires the engine to be on in order to work. I think the intent of this is to cover separate pieces of machinery that are dependant on the engine rather than the normal components of the vehicle. You could use the same argument about the radio, the aircon or the power steering pump.

I guess it depends on how you define dependant (or strictly speaking: ‘requires’):

needs engine running to operate, or
needs engine running to prevent damage from occurring.

The radio, power steering and aircon (etc) fit in to the former category, the turbo(s) in the latter.

Same applies when you want to use the car on a frosty morning: is it illegal to leave engine running to demist/defrost the windows via the heaters?

[MR2Mike]

supraman2954 said:

Same applies when you want to use the car on a frosty morning: is it illegal to leave engine running to demist/defrost the windows via the heaters?

If the car is unattended then I believe so. However, I would like to hear a BIB's interpretation of the C&U regs.

[colonel_smith]

MR2Mike said:

Leaving a motor vehicle engine running whilst stationary is an offence under Regulation 98 of the Construction and Use Regulations with the following exemptions:

I should forward this to the muppets over the road from where I work.There is a lorry and trailer outside on the road which has been running for 2 hours.It is not the first time they have done it,I have thought about moving it but then remember I can`t drive a 40ft lorry...Nicking the keys may make me laugh for a while.....

[^Slider^]

There is an offence of Quitting. Which is to leave a motorvehicle running whilst untattended.
Also Negligent use of a motor vehicle could apply.

Gareth

[GreenV8S]

fer said:

GreenV8S said: Aren't emergency vehicles routinely left unattended with the engines running? Gone mentioned ages ago they have something called "Run Stop" as they need the engine to run the lights, etc.

Yeah, but that only seems relevant from the point of view of the vehicle being knicked. It's still there with the engine running, and as I understand it that is all the law cares about. (As an aside, does this mean there's no corresponding offense for abandoning an electric vehicle?)

[Mr E]

You can't nick a car with a turbo timer.

Mine is locked while running, and if you get in and drop the handbrake it will kill the engine and set the alarm off.

[Mr Whippy]

A law probably made when cars had crap handbrakes and weird transmissions when they could set off at will if unattended.

Where is a car going to go? Clutch up, handbrake on...

Would require some seriously weird circumstances to "drive" away, lol.

Not sure how automatics would fare though, or new SMG type things... since they could in theory change gear by mechanical fault.

However, a manual clutch isn't going to suddenly decide to disengage, the gearbox go into a gear and then the clutch come back in so that the car doesn't stall and set off with the handbrake on!?!?

Law to protect the stupid from doing something daft?

Dave

[MR2Mike]

Mr Whippy said:

However, a manual clutch isn't going to suddenly decide to disengage, the gearbox go into a gear and then the clutch come back in so that the car doesn't stall and set off with the handbrake on!?!?

It's conceivable that a manual gearbox could fail in such a way as to effectively engage a gear, i.e. if a synchro hub seized onto the third motion shaft due to lubrucation breakdown. I agree it's unlikely though.

I suspect the laws are there more to reduce pollution and nuisance factors to MOP's from the noise of an engine running in a stationary vehicle.

[sadako]

Where would I stand leaving the engine running on the driveway, say, to close the garage door?

[pesty]

lol I had a wale of a time with mine

I usualy sat in the car but sometimes I would get out and wait by the drivers door. Just in case I was always paranoid that if I left it it would never turn off

The number of times some irate bloke would come up and start having a go only for it to turn itself off at the end of his rant Id just smile and they would go purple mu ha ha.

Once pulled uo next to a cop car in a car park in wales. timer was on 20 seconds so I got out and locked it. PC went mad but only got a couple of words out just got in his car and went.

[polrules]

Agree with much that has been said, however my tubby timer will kill the engine if the car starts to move (I think most of them do this) - surely this is to get round the laws mentioned above - the car cannot move. If it somehow 'fell' into gear the engine would be killed and the car would be stuck there in-gear.

Would be interesting to find out what our resident BiB would have done had they come across my car idling away happily to itself.....

[deeps]

Similarly, I can start my car from upto 250 yards away using a button on the remote. By the time I get in the heaters warm and already de-misted the windows. Have to remember not to leave it in gear tho!