Nutrition or Legs on longer rides.
Discussion
Good Afternoon,
Recently jumped on the bike again having only cycled ca. 700miles last year. Looking to do a few thousand this year and have signed up to Lionheart 100mi in Mid April as a kick starter!
Anyway, started my training properly a couple weeks back and am trying to do a long ride each weekend. Last weekend I did 45miles, did 60miles on Sunday and am looking to add 5-10miles each week!
On the last two rides I have been OK, but with 10miles to go on each ride I have really started to struggle, the old pedal for 30secs, rest for 10 and so on!
I am trying to understand whether this is me running out of energy (as my food intake isn't up to scratch), or whether this is simply my legs reaching their limits for the day!
I have never done a huge amount of long distance stuff, always did regular fast 10-30mile blasts, so dont really have a huge idea on what to do food wise. But for the 60mile ride on Sunday I did the following: Banana as I was getting ready, cereal bar after 1hr and then High5 Energy gels every 30mins until completion. I started the ride at 6am and had a typical meal the night before...
Is my food consumption completely off and I should be eating more?
OR
Does my food intake sound sensible and its just my legs struggling to keep up and they will return with more training.
If it makes any difference I am a typical well built director
28yrs old weighing in at an almighty 101kg! My 60mi ride took 3:40 (16.4mph) with 2000ft. I have done 100mi once before when I was relatively fit, which took 5:30 (18mph) with 4500ft - both solo.
Thanks in advance.
Recently jumped on the bike again having only cycled ca. 700miles last year. Looking to do a few thousand this year and have signed up to Lionheart 100mi in Mid April as a kick starter!
Anyway, started my training properly a couple weeks back and am trying to do a long ride each weekend. Last weekend I did 45miles, did 60miles on Sunday and am looking to add 5-10miles each week!
On the last two rides I have been OK, but with 10miles to go on each ride I have really started to struggle, the old pedal for 30secs, rest for 10 and so on!
I am trying to understand whether this is me running out of energy (as my food intake isn't up to scratch), or whether this is simply my legs reaching their limits for the day!
I have never done a huge amount of long distance stuff, always did regular fast 10-30mile blasts, so dont really have a huge idea on what to do food wise. But for the 60mile ride on Sunday I did the following: Banana as I was getting ready, cereal bar after 1hr and then High5 Energy gels every 30mins until completion. I started the ride at 6am and had a typical meal the night before...
Is my food consumption completely off and I should be eating more?
OR
Does my food intake sound sensible and its just my legs struggling to keep up and they will return with more training.
If it makes any difference I am a typical well built director
28yrs old weighing in at an almighty 101kg! My 60mi ride took 3:40 (16.4mph) with 2000ft. I have done 100mi once before when I was relatively fit, which took 5:30 (18mph) with 4500ft - both solo.Thanks in advance.
Can of worms, open, everywhere.
Be prepared for those that say eat as much as you can stomach and those that ride a century on a bowl of porridge and one bidon of water.
I personally prefer solid food to gels, stuff like malt loaf, flapjacks, good complex carbs with a bit of sugar.
Pre-ride I make an oats, milk and peanut butter shake, typically 50g oats and 300ml milk. Gives you a good starter of energy, then having a little nibble of something every hour, keep hydrated too.
Be prepared for those that say eat as much as you can stomach and those that ride a century on a bowl of porridge and one bidon of water.
I personally prefer solid food to gels, stuff like malt loaf, flapjacks, good complex carbs with a bit of sugar.
Pre-ride I make an oats, milk and peanut butter shake, typically 50g oats and 300ml milk. Gives you a good starter of energy, then having a little nibble of something every hour, keep hydrated too.
I would say it is a little bit of both. Your nutrition seems a bit low to me, how long did the ride take? I've stopped taking the gels except as an emergency, I've gone back to proper food.
If I was heading out for an 80 mile ride, I would have porridge before (you can get the little pots you just add water to) and then after 2 hours maybe a flapjack or a jam sandwich, or some fig rolls, and then possibly a gel with an hour to go. I developed an allergic reaction to bananas, I think I was eating about 10 a week!
It would take me 5 hours minimum, and I need to eat something every two hours or so. On a longer ride I'd have a proper sandwich or maybe even a pub meal. I would also get through at least one 750ml bottle of water at this time of year, probably 2 when it gets hotter.
If you're used to 10-30 mile "sprints" then as you go further you will feel the strength going from your legs with the effort, not just the lack of nutrition.
If I was heading out for an 80 mile ride, I would have porridge before (you can get the little pots you just add water to) and then after 2 hours maybe a flapjack or a jam sandwich, or some fig rolls, and then possibly a gel with an hour to go. I developed an allergic reaction to bananas, I think I was eating about 10 a week!
It would take me 5 hours minimum, and I need to eat something every two hours or so. On a longer ride I'd have a proper sandwich or maybe even a pub meal. I would also get through at least one 750ml bottle of water at this time of year, probably 2 when it gets hotter.
If you're used to 10-30 mile "sprints" then as you go further you will feel the strength going from your legs with the effort, not just the lack of nutrition.
Oh yeah, a half pint of milk after the ride to help recovery. I used to take the SIS recovery powders but milk is just plain nicer and supposedly as effective.
It is very much a personal thing and you'll find out what works for you by trial and error. I took a mini pork pie on Ridelondon one year, helped me up Wimbledon Hill! Stuff you can unwrap is good. Jelly babies and wine gums are firm favourites.
It is very much a personal thing and you'll find out what works for you by trial and error. I took a mini pork pie on Ridelondon one year, helped me up Wimbledon Hill! Stuff you can unwrap is good. Jelly babies and wine gums are firm favourites.
Daveyraveygravey said:
I would say it is a little bit of both. Your nutrition seems a bit low to me, how long did the ride take? I've stopped taking the gels except as an emergency, I've gone back to proper food.
If I was heading out for an 80 mile ride, I would have porridge before (you can get the little pots you just add water to) and then after 2 hours maybe a flapjack or a jam sandwich, or some fig rolls, and then possibly a gel with an hour to go. I developed an allergic reaction to bananas, I think I was eating about 10 a week!
It would take me 5 hours minimum, and I need to eat something every two hours or so. On a longer ride I'd have a proper sandwich or maybe even a pub meal. I would also get through at least one 750ml bottle of water at this time of year, probably 2 when it gets hotter.
If you're used to 10-30 mile "sprints" then as you go further you will feel the strength going from your legs with the effort, not just the lack of nutrition.
60miles with 2000ft took me 3:40, so about 16.4mph. Last time I did 100mi it took 5:30 (ca. 18mph) with 4500ft - both rides solo. If I was heading out for an 80 mile ride, I would have porridge before (you can get the little pots you just add water to) and then after 2 hours maybe a flapjack or a jam sandwich, or some fig rolls, and then possibly a gel with an hour to go. I developed an allergic reaction to bananas, I think I was eating about 10 a week!
It would take me 5 hours minimum, and I need to eat something every two hours or so. On a longer ride I'd have a proper sandwich or maybe even a pub meal. I would also get through at least one 750ml bottle of water at this time of year, probably 2 when it gets hotter.
If you're used to 10-30 mile "sprints" then as you go further you will feel the strength going from your legs with the effort, not just the lack of nutrition.
I think its just going to be a case of getting up a little earlier, maybe getting bowl of porridge in me. Then hooking up a kids trailer full of food and see how I get on. I'll try eating a lot more than I usually do and see how I feel at the end....
TwistingMyMelon said:
Have a propper breakfast, sod riding anything past 30 miles on just a banana, b
ks to all this exercising on empty stomachs past 20 miles
Remember legs tire before lungs, ride an easy gear and keep cadence high, so your muscles dont tire
Keep fluids up
Yup that what I generally do, always aim for 90rpm or so on a longer ride. I'll eat more next time and see how I get on....ks to all this exercising on empty stomachs past 20 miles Remember legs tire before lungs, ride an easy gear and keep cadence high, so your muscles dont tire
Keep fluids up
I think you are probably over stretching yourself a bit, but I would up the food and see
Seen mate struggle when they start riding further and then say "I never eat before or during a ride" I Forced a big meal down them and they did another 50 miles fine!
Decent sized breakfast (cereal and toast) and snacks every 20 miles
Some might say its overkill, but at least it then means you've covered having enough to eat
Seen mate struggle when they start riding further and then say "I never eat before or during a ride" I Forced a big meal down them and they did another 50 miles fine!
Decent sized breakfast (cereal and toast) and snacks every 20 miles
Some might say its overkill, but at least it then means you've covered having enough to eat
You need to eat something proper before, a bit of fruit is not going to cut it for someone new to riding.
Generally if I was going out without stopping and going to be riding with a bit of effort, it would be something proper beforehand, like a decent sized bowl of porridge, forget the stty ready made ones, they're far too small. And then I would eat something every half hour, a gel every half hour is fine. Obviously being as large as you are and going at speeds which don't sound terrible means you're going to be burning a fair few cals.
I cannot comment on the distance thing, but certainly its not just a given that you should be able to up it every week without noticing it.
Generally if I was going out without stopping and going to be riding with a bit of effort, it would be something proper beforehand, like a decent sized bowl of porridge, forget the s
tty ready made ones, they're far too small. And then I would eat something every half hour, a gel every half hour is fine. Obviously being as large as you are and going at speeds which don't sound terrible means you're going to be burning a fair few cals.I cannot comment on the distance thing, but certainly its not just a given that you should be able to up it every week without noticing it.
okgo said:
You need to eat something proper before, a bit of fruit is not going to cut it for someone new to riding.
Generally if I was going out without stopping and going to be riding with a bit of effort, it would be something proper beforehand, like a decent sized bowl of porridge, forget the stty ready made ones, they're far too small. And then I would eat something every half hour, a gel every half hour is fine. Obviously being as large as you are and going at speeds which don't sound terrible means you're going to be burning a fair few cals.
I cannot comment on the distance thing, but certainly its not just a given that you should be able to up it every week without noticing it.
I'm not new to riding, I have just never been inclined to do long distances - I find it pretty boring plugging away for 3-5hrs! Generally if I was going out without stopping and going to be riding with a bit of effort, it would be something proper beforehand, like a decent sized bowl of porridge, forget the s
tty ready made ones, they're far too small. And then I would eat something every half hour, a gel every half hour is fine. Obviously being as large as you are and going at speeds which don't sound terrible means you're going to be burning a fair few cals.I cannot comment on the distance thing, but certainly its not just a given that you should be able to up it every week without noticing it.
But I'll give some more food a go and hopefully I'll smash it. I'm not worried about the increase in mileage each week as I'm putting in at least an hour a day on the spin bike and gym it 5/6 mornings a week anyway, (That 101kg isn't fat!)
Thanks for all your help.
russy01 said:
I'm not new to riding, I have just never been inclined to do long distances - I find it pretty boring plugging away for 3-5hrs!
But I'll give some more food a go and hopefully I'll smash it. I'm not worried about the increase in mileage each week as I'm putting in at least an hour a day on the spin bike and gym it 5/6 mornings a week anyway, (That 101kg isn't fat!)
Thanks for all your help.
New to proper riding, i.e distance - 101kg is considerable.But I'll give some more food a go and hopefully I'll smash it. I'm not worried about the increase in mileage each week as I'm putting in at least an hour a day on the spin bike and gym it 5/6 mornings a week anyway, (That 101kg isn't fat!)
Thanks for all your help.
As said, people on this planet overeat every day, inc me, so at least if you eat too much you've covered that base.
Not sure that I'm qualified in any way to give advice on this.
But hey, my 2p worth...
I think I'm an 'average' cyclist. Not fast, but not super-slow neither. I'm big into longer rides, probably due to my pace (or lack thereof). It's far more ego-massaging to get back home and upload a 13.8mph average speed if the ride was 110 miles and 6,000ft of climbing. Shorter rides would see me struggling to get far above 16mph average, even at (my perception of) "balls to the wall" effort.
Typically I don't really look forward to rides of much below 40 miles. The ratio of pre-ride faff to actual riding is to high. The longer I'm out, the less time (proportionally speaking) I 'waste' poncing about preparing my kit and getting dressed. I like to ride for two to three hours ideally, as a minimum. So I'm pretty much coming at cycling from the opposite direction to you, OP.
As for 'fuelling' a long ride? Proper food is the answer for me. My first century was fuelled by home-made fishcakes and chips from a traditional chippy/chinese takeaway for lunch, and a tuna mayo sandwich from a garage forecourt. Other big rides I've taken sandwiches in a jersey pocket (wrapped, obviously ), especially when I'm going to be heavily rural and can't guarantee access to a shop/cafe. Surrey Hills trips I tend to build around potential cafe stops too. And have a proper plate of food when I stop too. This is what works for me, because like I say, I enjoy the time/distance stuff, and I'm not worrying about pace too much. If I need to 'go easy' to allow lunch to settle, then I'll do that. Additionally I stuff my pockets with Kelloggs 'Breakfast Bake' or Jordans 'Frusili' bars, and one (out of date) energy gel for dire emergencies. Fluids is two 710ml bottles of supermarket own brand "no added sugar" squash, occasionally backed up by a bottle of still Lucozade Sport in a pocket.
I'm not saying a I get it right, because my pacing is erratic further into a ride and that might be through eating in 'blocks' rather than spreading it out 'little and often'. But I mostly manage to get back in a state where I could usefully perform most domestic tasks, so I'm not "Bonking" on a regular basis. As far as it being "the legs" is concerned? If you cycle regularly it shouldn't be that. I'm well aware that I've plateaued in terms of fitness, and that it is my lack of motivation to train to a plan that holds back any improvement in pace or climbing power. I'm comfortable with that because my personal priority is to enjoy every mile on the bike, rather than letting it become a task that requires a strict timetable and constant pain and suffering. I tried the energy gels/bars guff, along with 'scientifically developed sports drinks' but these things were simply not for me. As a result I spend less per mile on complicated and expensive "nutrition solutions" than I once did. And as someone who isn't currently working that bit is important.
Like I said at the beginning, this isn't advice, just observations based on experience. But enjoy those long rides. Look up, look around, and actually experience where you are, rather than engaging in a 5-hour shouting match with your legs whilst staring at the stem a la Chris Froome. Seriously. Your ultimate destination is death - don't be in such a hurry to get there that you fail to enjoy the journey...
But hey, my 2p worth...
I think I'm an 'average' cyclist. Not fast, but not super-slow neither. I'm big into longer rides, probably due to my pace (or lack thereof). It's far more ego-massaging to get back home and upload a 13.8mph average speed if the ride was 110 miles and 6,000ft of climbing. Shorter rides would see me struggling to get far above 16mph average, even at (my perception of) "balls to the wall" effort.
Typically I don't really look forward to rides of much below 40 miles. The ratio of pre-ride faff to actual riding is to high. The longer I'm out, the less time (proportionally speaking) I 'waste' poncing about preparing my kit and getting dressed. I like to ride for two to three hours ideally, as a minimum. So I'm pretty much coming at cycling from the opposite direction to you, OP.
As for 'fuelling' a long ride? Proper food is the answer for me. My first century was fuelled by home-made fishcakes and chips from a traditional chippy/chinese takeaway for lunch, and a tuna mayo sandwich from a garage forecourt. Other big rides I've taken sandwiches in a jersey pocket (wrapped, obviously
), especially when I'm going to be heavily rural and can't guarantee access to a shop/cafe. Surrey Hills trips I tend to build around potential cafe stops too. And have a proper plate of food when I stop too. This is what works for me, because like I say, I enjoy the time/distance stuff, and I'm not worrying about pace too much. If I need to 'go easy' to allow lunch to settle, then I'll do that. Additionally I stuff my pockets with Kelloggs 'Breakfast Bake' or Jordans 'Frusili' bars, and one (out of date) energy gel for dire emergencies. Fluids is two 710ml bottles of supermarket own brand "no added sugar" squash, occasionally backed up by a bottle of still Lucozade Sport in a pocket. I'm not saying a I get it right, because my pacing is erratic further into a ride and that might be through eating in 'blocks' rather than spreading it out 'little and often'. But I mostly manage to get back in a state where I could usefully perform most domestic tasks, so I'm not "Bonking" on a regular basis. As far as it being "the legs" is concerned? If you cycle regularly it shouldn't be that. I'm well aware that I've plateaued in terms of fitness, and that it is my lack of motivation to train to a plan that holds back any improvement in pace or climbing power. I'm comfortable with that because my personal priority is to enjoy every mile on the bike, rather than letting it become a task that requires a strict timetable and constant pain and suffering. I tried the energy gels/bars guff, along with 'scientifically developed sports drinks' but these things were simply not for me. As a result I spend less per mile on complicated and expensive "nutrition solutions" than I once did. And as someone who isn't currently working that bit is important.
Like I said at the beginning, this isn't advice, just observations based on experience. But enjoy those long rides. Look up, look around, and actually experience where you are, rather than engaging in a 5-hour shouting match with your legs whilst staring at the stem a la Chris Froome. Seriously. Your ultimate destination is death - don't be in such a hurry to get there that you fail to enjoy the journey...
Yea fair enough Yellowjack.....you are just as qualified to respond to anybody else on here!
But this is where we differ we have a completely different approach to cycling. I see cycling as purely exercise, I see it as me against the numbers and trying to strengthen myself. I have played sport all my life and am fiercely competitive. I dont faff around to go out on the bike, I simply chuck on my dhb gear, grab my bike and pedal as hard as I can for the distance I have set myself... for what I am after I can gain more from an all out 20mile 1hr ride than most blokes could on a gentle 80mile Sunday jaunt with a group...
But I now understand that they are most likely out on the bike for different reason! I am simply short of time, have a family at home Id rather be spending time with and just want to blast the st out of it....
None of this means mean I dont enjoy cycling, I have learned to love it, but dont get me wrong Id replace it with a game of football hands down! But injuries from 10 really hard years of various sports has left its scars and cycling is the only sport I can push myself and come back relatively pain free! A 30min run sees me limping for a week...
So as I have said above, I simply need to adjust to longer activities. Whilst I have been incredibly fit in the past my fitness is not tip top at the moment, I am strong and fairly muscular (hence the 100kg) but my muscles are not used to working hard for anything much more than an hour (which doesn't really require any extra food). So, I will start by going out this weekend aiming to do my 70miles and will take lots of grub! In the hope that I feel stronger in the 2nd half...
If I dont, then Ill have to give my legs hell during the week!
Cheers.
But this is where we differ we have a completely different approach to cycling. I see cycling as purely exercise, I see it as me against the numbers and trying to strengthen myself. I have played sport all my life and am fiercely competitive. I dont faff around to go out on the bike, I simply chuck on my dhb gear, grab my bike and pedal as hard as I can for the distance I have set myself... for what I am after I can gain more from an all out 20mile 1hr ride than most blokes could on a gentle 80mile Sunday jaunt with a group...
But I now understand that they are most likely out on the bike for different reason! I am simply short of time, have a family at home Id rather be spending time with and just want to blast the s
t out of it....None of this means mean I dont enjoy cycling, I have learned to love it, but dont get me wrong Id replace it with a game of football hands down! But injuries from 10 really hard years of various sports has left its scars and cycling is the only sport I can push myself and come back relatively pain free! A 30min run sees me limping for a week...
So as I have said above, I simply need to adjust to longer activities. Whilst I have been incredibly fit in the past my fitness is not tip top at the moment, I am strong and fairly muscular (hence the 100kg) but my muscles are not used to working hard for anything much more than an hour (which doesn't really require any extra food). So, I will start by going out this weekend aiming to do my 70miles and will take lots of grub! In the hope that I feel stronger in the 2nd half...
If I dont, then Ill have to give my legs hell during the week!
Cheers.
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