Parking ticket.- what happens if you don't pay up?.

[natben]

Has anyone ever been taken to court for not paying a parking ticket, had a chat tonight with some friends and no one knows anyone who has been chased for non payment of 1 ticket.

We know a guy who got a ticket last September and just ignored all communication from the council and collection agency, in fact in January he got a letter from the collection agency offering him the option of paying the ORIGINAL fine £60.

He didn't and it looks like they have gone away.

10 mins late on a £2 ticket resulted in a £60 fine he reckons the fine is disproportionate to the original ticket so he ain't paying.

I have always payed my tickets but this got me thinking!

What do you guys reckon will they get him eventually?

[HustleRussell]

I wouldn't take my chances on a proper ticket from the local council.

I do take my chances on private parking company ones though, and haven't been made to pay up yet.

I seem to recall however that a recent supreme court hearing unexpectedly sided with a private parking firm which may have established a bit of a prescedent.

[dacouch]

HustleRussell said:

I wouldn't take my chances on a proper ticket from the local council.

I do take my chances on private parking company ones though, and haven't been made to pay up yet.

I seem to recall however that a recent supreme court hearing unexpectedly sided with a private parking firm which may have established a bit of a prescedent.

What normally happens is you get taken to court, which will increase the cost significantly, if that is not paid they'll have a bailiff turn up demanding circa £300 and generally clamping his car.

Councils are very good at enforcing tickets

[S11Steve]

Council issued tickets don't end up in court as such - it's virtually an automated system of escalation internally, then via Northampton Traffic Enforcement Centre, for an Order of Recovery to be granted, then passed to a proper bailiff company like Newlyn, Marstens or JBW. Its the non-payment of this that can end up in front of magistrate, but relatively rare I believe. If an enforcement dude does turn up on the doorstep it is normally for around £500 by this stage, and they can seize your goods. Transport for London are very quick at pushing through unpaid tickets, local councils, not so quick, but they do eventually.

Private Parking is a whole different scenario - civil law, backed up by a very flaky piece of legislation that allows these predatory scammers to target the registered keeper of the vehicle. They take people to court regularly, like 40,000 cases per year regularly. And due to the outdated information of "just ignore it, they can't do nuffink", people end up with CCJs that they nothing about until they apply for credit. Bailiffs can only be appointed after the CCJ is granted, but they are county court bailiffs, with less authority and rights of entry than HCEO - invariably the CCJ is under £600, so HCEO wont engage.

Here is a FOI detailing 2014-2015 volumes - https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/parking_com...

Private Parking tickets are barely enforceable, but you need to have the right argument, and actually do a little leg work. The vast majority can be batted out on non-compliance of notification (this is where POFA 2012 allows them to hold the RK liable - I've yet to find a company that is fully compliant with this) inadequate signage (the Beavis case confirmed the concept of a "civil penalty" is valid and commercially justifiable, but onlu in certain circumstances where the signage is clear) and most shopping centres/retail parks/supermarkets - the parking shark contract is with the management company, not the true landowner.

But yes, people are being taken to court daily by these charlatans.

Edited by S11Steve on Thursday 10th March 12:00

[anonymous-user]

natben said:

10 mins late on a £2 ticket resulted in a £60 fine he reckons the fine is disproportionate to the original ticket so he ain't paying.

I have always payed my tickets but this got me thinking!

What do you guys reckon will they get him eventually?

Was this more hot air from a bullsting politician or did it actually occur ?
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/government-deli...

[_dobbo_]

S11Steve said:

But yes, people are being taken to court daily by these charlatans.

Funny ain't it - pretty much everyone hates these PPCs, but then on another thread I read this:

Retroman said:

A lot of people my friends know park in PC world across the road. It has cameras that read the plates as they enter and leave. About a dozen or so people have had dozens of tickets (someone said over 100 for a few) over the course of many years, but no court summons yet.

So the PC world car park is being consistently abused - what is a business supposed to do in these circumstances? Genuinely interested, seems like the issue here is that the PPC wouldn't have to exist if massive aholes didn't take the piss, as shown above.

Edit, never noticed that piss doesn't get caught by the PH swear filter. Is piss a nicer word than arse? I'd say not.

[S11Steve]

_dobbo_ said:

So the PC world car park is being consistently abused - what is a business supposed to do in these circumstances? Genuinely interested, seems like the issue here is that the PPC wouldn't have to exist if massive aholes didn't take the piss, as shown above.

Edit, never noticed that piss doesn't get caught by the PH swear filter. Is piss a nicer word than arse? I'd say not.

It depends on the parking company in question - Parking Eye and Civil Enforcement are very keen to issue proceedings, but for a lot of the PPC it is a numbers game - send 100 tickets out, if 25-50% pay without question, they are quids in already. Besides, a few companies have had their arse shown to them on a plate by district judges, so are not keen to repeat the performance. UKPC and SIP spring to mind.

Other companies know that their procedures are blatantly non-compliant, such as VCS at Liverpool John Lennon airport - although they do the occasional court case, they have yet to chance their luck for tickets issued at the airport - mainly because it is classed as "not relevant land" and their tickets are completely unenforceable, but also because they are flouting so many regulations of POFA 2012 it is shameful, and indicative of the seemingly "brown envelope" culture that exists between Speke council, Peel Holdings and VCS

Edited by S11Steve on Thursday 10th March 15:18

[marshalla]

natben said:

Has anyone ever been taken to court for not paying a parking ticket, had a chat tonight with some friends and no one knows anyone who has been chased for non payment of 1 ticket.

Parking eye v. Beavis.

http://www.parkingcowboys.co.uk/parkingeye-vs-beav...
https://www.supremecourt.uk/cases/docs/uksc-2013-0...

[TooMany2cvs]

_dobbo_ said:

So the PC world car park is being consistently abused - what is a business supposed to do in these circumstances? Genuinely interested, seems like the issue here is that the PPC wouldn't have to exist if massive aholes didn't take the piss, as shown above.

Couldn't agree more. Everybody moaned like buggery about clampers in private car parks - so they were banned. Then what's to stop scrotes from dumping their sheds wherever they fancy while they do whatever fills their shallow lives? Clearly not a letter asking them to pay, because that's seen as a terrible infringement of liberty!

Then somebody causes THEM a bit of inconvenience, and it's frozen-sausage-o'clock.

_dobbo_ said:

Edit, never noticed that piss doesn't get caught by the PH swear filter. Is piss a nicer word than arse? I'd say not.

It's OK, arse is allowed, but aholes isn't.

[S11Steve]

TooMany2cvs said:

_dobbo_ said:

So the PC world car park is being consistently abused - what is a business supposed to do in these circumstances? Genuinely interested, seems like the issue here is that the PPC wouldn't have to exist if massive aholes didn't take the piss, as shown above.

Couldn't agree more. Everybody moaned like buggery about clampers in private car parks - so they were banned. Then what's to stop scrotes from dumping their sheds wherever they fancy while they do whatever fills their shallow lives? Clearly not a letter asking them to pay, because that's seen as a terrible infringement of liberty!

Then somebody causes THEM a bit of inconvenience, and it's frozen-sausage-o'clock.

The concession to the parking industry/clampers was that the keeper could be held liable if various criteria could be met. I see thousands of parking tickets each year in my job, and there are only one or two companies I can think of that actually do meet the requirements - NCP being one.

Half the problem is that these companies are not providing a "management service" - either for retail parks , or permit holder sites, they operate on a business model that can only make money if people breach terms. They don't proactively stop bad parking habits, and more often than not the genuine shoppers or residents are targeted for revenue.

[Chrisgr31]

S11Steve said:

I see thousands of parking tickets each year in my job,

So what consequences do the drivers that get these tickets suffer as a result of getting them? Reality is that if people werent getting tickets these companies wouldnt exist.

[Boosted LS1]

^ Those that are scared or ignorant will pay up. The rest of us don't because we know what a racket it is.

[Chrisgr31]

Boosted LS1 said:

^ Those that are scared or ignorant will pay up. The rest of us don't because we know what a racket it is.

Most of us don't get tickets in the first place!

[TooMany2cvs]

Chrisgr31 said:

Most of us don't get tickets in the first place!

• ding*

And, on the rare occasions we do, we're adult enough to realise that it's because we've parked like a wuckfit.

[_dobbo_]

TooMany2cvs said:

Chrisgr31 said:

Most of us don't get tickets in the first place!

• ding*

And, on the rare occasions we do, we're adult enough to realise that it's because we've parked like a wuckfit.

Funny old world. Posting in this thread about piss takers, got home yesterday and there's a ticket from Parking Eye.

The wife went for a birthday breakfast with her mates - them girls can talk. She then went and did a weekly shop in the supermarket. Both these things added up to 3h 10m and so 10m over the allowed time limit.

So although arguably bang to rights, she was legitimately using the facilities that the car park serves. So conflicted!

[Fugazi]

_dobbo_ said:

Funny old world. Posting in this thread about piss takers, got home yesterday and there's a ticket from Parking Eye.

The wife went for a birthday breakfast with her mates - them girls can talk. She then went and did a weekly shop in the supermarket. Both these things added up to 3h 10m and so 10m over the allowed time limit.

So although arguably bang to rights, she was legitimately using the facilities that the car park serves. So conflicted!

Had the same with Parking Eye after my girlfriend overstayed after going shopping in multiple stores in a car park with a two hour limit. Asked for advice on Pepipoo and was given a draft letter more or less explaining that the due to the circumstances and amount spent, with receipts to prove it etc... Sent it off expecting the worst and after a couple of weeks I received an email saying they'd cancelled the ticket! So might be worth that approach?

[S11Steve]

_dobbo_ said:

Funny old world. Posting in this thread about piss takers, got home yesterday and there's a ticket from Parking Eye.

The wife went for a birthday breakfast with her mates - them girls can talk. She then went and did a weekly shop in the supermarket. Both these things added up to 3h 10m and so 10m over the allowed time limit.

So although arguably bang to rights, she was legitimately using the facilities that the car park serves. So conflicted!

She shouldn't have "parked like a wuckfit" then, should she...?


As I may have said once or twice, these charlatans do not "manage" car parks, how can they do that effectively with a pair of unblinking eyes that can do nothing but count minutes? They simply target legitimate customers and residents to earn their revenue. They don't provide security, they don't stop double parking, they don't stop the abuse of disabled bays, they don't improve traffic flow, they are certainly not providing a value added service for either the shoppers, retailers, residents or landlords.

You can either roll over and throw another chip to the dirty seagulls, or you can write two letters and make it go away.

[_dobbo_]

S11Steve said:

She shouldn't have "parked like a wuckfit" then, should she...?

Yeah, I was kind of posting in response to that, because honestly who can say she was being a fkwit in that scenario? She was aware of the 3 hour limit but the queue in Aldi was huge (as usual) should she have just ditched her shopping in the aisle and gone home?

S11Steve said:

You can either roll over and throw another chip to the dirty seagulls, or you can write two letters and make it go away.

The wife's first comment was "I was just going to pay". I suggested it might be worth trying to appeal the ticket first, she is going to do so.

[TooMany2cvs]

_dobbo_ said:

The wife went for a birthday breakfast with her mates - them girls can talk. She then went and did a weekly shop in the supermarket. Both these things added up to 3h 10m and so 10m over the allowed time limit.

So although arguably bang to rights, she was legitimately using the facilities that the car park serves. So conflicted!

_dobbo_ said:

She was aware of the 3 hour limit but the queue in Aldi was huge (as usual)

An Aldi with an in-store cafe...?

If it wasn't an in-store cafe, but she was parked in the store carpark whilst elsewhere for much of that time, then that's a different matter to being in the cafe within the store whose carpark she was using, don't you think?

[_dobbo_]

TooMany2cvs said:

An Aldi with an in-store cafe...?

If it wasn't an in-store cafe, but she was parked in the store carpark whilst elsewhere for much of that time, then that's a different matter to being in the cafe within the store whose carpark she was using, don't you think?

Of course I think, that would indeed be hugely taking the piss and I wouldn't have posted in that case. But that isn't what happened.

The car park that serves a number of stores - Aldi, Frankie and Benny's, M&S, B&Q, sports direct, a carpet store, Costa.

She had breakfast in F&Bs then went to Aldi.

So she was only using the facilities that the car park serves, and it seems to me with that variety of stores it is easily possible to be there for 3 hours plus.

In any event, I understand that in these circumstances if you can prove you were shopping parking eye will cancel the ticket. We'll see!