Insurance, who's fault?
Discussion
So after buying a used car, it breaks down a week later and is returned to the dealer for repair and he kindly lends me a car to use. Being diligent, I checked to see if this loan car was legal to drive. It is taxed and has MOT according to the DVLA. However, when I checked the MID, it isn't insured.
I immediately ring the trader and tell him this car he's lent me isn't insured and therefore my insurance policy won't cover me to drive it. He assures me it is insured on a traders policy. I do some more digging and find that this is irrelevant - every car on the road must be on the MID. I call him again to tell him I'm still not happy. He gets a little annoyed and once again assures me there is nothing to worry about.
Inevitably, two days later I am pulled and issued a £300 ticket along with 6 points. The BIB let me continue driving as I explained the situation and showed him I am covered to drive loan cars. He tells me that he will tear up the ticket if I can get the trader to prove I am covered.
The trader has duly emailed his traders policy to the officer which shows I am insured. He informs the police he has owned the vehicle for roughly 2 weeks and only recently added it to the MID. I am now waiting to hear back off the police - the officer dealing returns to work on Tuesday. Anyone had a similar experience and can tell me a likely outcome? I don't think I could have done more to check my insurance status on the loan vehicle.
I immediately ring the trader and tell him this car he's lent me isn't insured and therefore my insurance policy won't cover me to drive it. He assures me it is insured on a traders policy. I do some more digging and find that this is irrelevant - every car on the road must be on the MID. I call him again to tell him I'm still not happy. He gets a little annoyed and once again assures me there is nothing to worry about.
Inevitably, two days later I am pulled and issued a £300 ticket along with 6 points. The BIB let me continue driving as I explained the situation and showed him I am covered to drive loan cars. He tells me that he will tear up the ticket if I can get the trader to prove I am covered.
The trader has duly emailed his traders policy to the officer which shows I am insured. He informs the police he has owned the vehicle for roughly 2 weeks and only recently added it to the MID. I am now waiting to hear back off the police - the officer dealing returns to work on Tuesday. Anyone had a similar experience and can tell me a likely outcome? I don't think I could have done more to check my insurance status on the loan vehicle.
Simple answer - your fault, as you weren't insured.
More complex answer (IANAL) lies somewhere in the middle : http://www.motordefencelawyers.co.uk/motoring-news... On one hand, you asked him, he reassured you. On the other, you asked, got an answer back that made you go Hmmm, and drove it anyway.
Unless the nice policeman says "OK" to the proffered paperwork, you're off to argue with the magistrates.
More complex answer (IANAL) lies somewhere in the middle : http://www.motordefencelawyers.co.uk/motoring-news... On one hand, you asked him, he reassured you. On the other, you asked, got an answer back that made you go Hmmm, and drove it anyway.
Unless the nice policeman says "OK" to the proffered paperwork, you're off to argue with the magistrates.
bmw535i said:
So after buying a used car, it breaks down a week later and is returned to the dealer for repair and he kindly lends me a car to use. Being diligent, I checked to see if this loan car was legal to drive. It is taxed and has MOT according to the DVLA. However, when I checked the MID, it isn't insured.
I immediately ring the trader and tell him this car he's lent me isn't insured and therefore my insurance policy won't cover me to drive it. He assures me it is insured on a traders policy. I do some more digging and find that this is irrelevant - every car on the road must be on the MID. I call him again to tell him I'm still not happy. He gets a little annoyed and once again assures me there is nothing to worry about.
Inevitably, two days later I am pulled and issued a £300 ticket along with 6 points. The BIB let me continue driving as I explained the situation and showed him I am covered to drive loan cars. He tells me that he will tear up the ticket if I can get the trader to prove I am covered.
The trader has duly emailed his traders policy to the officer which shows I am insured. He informs the police he has owned the vehicle for roughly 2 weeks and only recently added it to the MID. I am now waiting to hear back off the police - the officer dealing returns to work on Tuesday. Anyone had a similar experience and can tell me a likely outcome? I don't think I could have done more to check my insurance status on the loan vehicle.
You got issued with 6 points and a £300 fine at the roadside? I immediately ring the trader and tell him this car he's lent me isn't insured and therefore my insurance policy won't cover me to drive it. He assures me it is insured on a traders policy. I do some more digging and find that this is irrelevant - every car on the road must be on the MID. I call him again to tell him I'm still not happy. He gets a little annoyed and once again assures me there is nothing to worry about.
Inevitably, two days later I am pulled and issued a £300 ticket along with 6 points. The BIB let me continue driving as I explained the situation and showed him I am covered to drive loan cars. He tells me that he will tear up the ticket if I can get the trader to prove I am covered.
The trader has duly emailed his traders policy to the officer which shows I am insured. He informs the police he has owned the vehicle for roughly 2 weeks and only recently added it to the MID. I am now waiting to hear back off the police - the officer dealing returns to work on Tuesday. Anyone had a similar experience and can tell me a likely outcome? I don't think I could have done more to check my insurance status on the loan vehicle.
After getting this ticket for no insuramce and awarding you a penalty and fine that only a court can impose, they then let you carry on driving the car uninsured. Double
You didn't believe that you were insured, but continued to drive the car. I think that answers whose fault it may be if this happened.
Edited by snorky782 on Sunday 20th March 16:32
Read it again, this story makes absolutely no sense
Either you were covered to drive the car under your own policy or not, if you showed the police that you were and they let you keep the car and carry on driving, they can't give you a ticket for being uninsured.
The offence under continuous insurance enforcement is against the keeper, not the driver, and is non endorsable.
Either you were covered to drive the car under your own policy or not, if you showed the police that you were and they let you keep the car and carry on driving, they can't give you a ticket for being uninsured.
The offence under continuous insurance enforcement is against the keeper, not the driver, and is non endorsable.
ging84 said:
There are a lot of myths around about cars needing it's own policy for drive any cover to apply.
Which company are you insured with?
Post the exact wording of the drive any can cover on your insurance certificate. Not the policy document, just the insurance certificate.
I am insured to drive any car lent to me undergoing repair approved by my insurer. I showed the traffic officer this. He said that the car had to have its own insurance for this to be effectiveWhich company are you insured with?
Post the exact wording of the drive any can cover on your insurance certificate. Not the policy document, just the insurance certificate.
ging84 said:
Read it again, this story makes absolutely no sense
Either you were covered to drive the car under your own policy or not, if you showed the police that you were and they let you keep the car and carry on driving, they can't give you a ticket for being uninsured.
The offence under continuous insurance enforcement is against the keeper, not the driver, and is non endorsable.
I can only tell you what happened. I was given a yellow ticket with the offence of driving uninsured. I then continued my journey. I can only assume if they do pursue it then I will hear off the court. Either you were covered to drive the car under your own policy or not, if you showed the police that you were and they let you keep the car and carry on driving, they can't give you a ticket for being uninsured.
The offence under continuous insurance enforcement is against the keeper, not the driver, and is non endorsable.
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bmw535i said:
I am insured to drive any car lent to me undergoing repair approved by my insurer. I showed the traffic officer this. He said that the car had to have its own insurance for this to be effective
That is some assumption by the traffic cop.Who is your Insurer?
On your CERTIFICATE OF INSURANCE does it state that the other car needs to be insured next to where it says you're covered to drive courtesy cars.
bmw535i said:
ging84 said:
There are a lot of myths around about cars needing it's own policy for drive any cover to apply.
Which company are you insured with?
Post the exact wording of the drive any can cover on your insurance certificate. Not the policy document, just the insurance certificate.
I am insured to drive any car lent to me undergoing repair approved by my insurer. I showed the traffic officer this. He said that the car had to have its own insurance for this to be effectiveWhich company are you insured with?
Post the exact wording of the drive any can cover on your insurance certificate. Not the policy document, just the insurance certificate.
Whereas your case is completely different as there is wording in policies to say you can drive a vehicle lent to you by the garage under your OWN insurance and it's effectively your car if you have an accident.
dacouch said:
That is some assumption by the traffic cop.
Who is your Insurer?
On your CERTIFICATE OF INSURANCE does it state that the other car needs to be insured next to where it says you're covered to drive courtesy cars.
Adrian fluxWho is your Insurer?
On your CERTIFICATE OF INSURANCE does it state that the other car needs to be insured next to where it says you're covered to drive courtesy cars.
It says the other car needs to be insured unless the loan car is given due to a repair on my vehicle under the terms of my insurance policy - it wasn't. It had broken down.
dacouch said:
Incidently Motor Traders are expected to upload relevant vehicles to the MID "Immediately" however depending on the exact circumstances, a court may deem that up to 14 days is acceptable
The copper said that if the trader had the car for more than 14 days, I would be getting done. He also said that he would report the trader to trading standardsbmw535i said:
Adrian flux
It says the other car needs to be insured unless the loan car is given due to a repair on my vehicle under the terms of my insurance policy - it wasn't. It had broken down.
Are you quoting the Driving other cars terms or the loan car terms AND does it specify the requirement for other insurance on the certificate?It says the other car needs to be insured unless the loan car is given due to a repair on my vehicle under the terms of my insurance policy - it wasn't. It had broken down.
Does any such requirement have any terms as to what type of cover is required as some policies will use wording to the effect that the vehicle must have it's own private car insurance?
dacouch said:
Are you quoting the Driving other cars terms or the loan car terms AND does it specify the requirement for other insurance on the certificate?
Does any such requirement have any terms as to what type of cover is required as some policies will use wording to the effect that the vehicle must have it's own private car insurance?
That is a quote from my insurance certificate. The traders policy definitely covers me to drive any car he lends me but the car he lent me hadn't been named on his certificate or MIDDoes any such requirement have any terms as to what type of cover is required as some policies will use wording to the effect that the vehicle must have it's own private car insurance?
bmw535i said:
Adrian flux
It says the other car needs to be insured unless the loan car is given due to a repair on my vehicle under the terms of my insurance policy - it wasn't. It had broken down.
Adrian flux is a brokerIt says the other car needs to be insured unless the loan car is given due to a repair on my vehicle under the terms of my insurance policy - it wasn't. It had broken down.
Who is the actual insurer
And what is the exact wording on the certificate.
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