Employee with an injury - not sustained in work
Discussion
I employ a guy in a manual labour role. Been with the company a long time. Generally not a moaner - but the last few months he has been a bit and generally not interested. I have been expecting a resignation tbh.
He does work at the weekends for other people, I don't mind so long as it does not interfere with work. General DIY type stuff / gardening etc.
A couple of weeks ago he was doing a job for a friend of mine by chance, I called round to see then and he was in the back garden moving some very heavy items. (30-40kg easily if not more - so heavy that my friend commented at the time that the stuff he was moving was crazy heavy and that she was shocked he did not bring a second person with him) He did not see me, I was there a couple of mins - didn't think anything of it other than I can think of better things to do at the weekend.
The next week in work he was complaining of a bad back. I kept my eye on him and he was obviously in pain. After a week he came to me and said he had to go to the hospital etc. He returned the next day and said they told him his back was strained "all over" and that he had to go for physiotherapy plus meds.
He said to me that lifting heavy items in work (max is 20kg) is now too much for him etc etc.
I mentioned perhaps he needs to knock the work at the weekend on the head.... told him about the weekend before... obviously came as a shock to him that I knew!
Last week he was taking it easy, I told him to do so - no problem with that.
Anyway, long story short at the weekend he was back there doing work again. Ok this time not as heavy - but still "heavy" work. Sat and Sun.
Yesterday he came back to me and said his back was still bad and that he was going to see a specialist next week.
I did not comment on me seeing him at the weekend.
Whats the best course of action?
Firstly I don't want to drag my friend into it - but if this guy decides to sue us I might have too? I know the injury was not sustained in work - we have machinery for moving heavy stuff.
Secondly, he ignored my advice about doing any more work at the weekend.
Ideas?
He does work at the weekends for other people, I don't mind so long as it does not interfere with work. General DIY type stuff / gardening etc.
A couple of weeks ago he was doing a job for a friend of mine by chance, I called round to see then and he was in the back garden moving some very heavy items. (30-40kg easily if not more - so heavy that my friend commented at the time that the stuff he was moving was crazy heavy and that she was shocked he did not bring a second person with him) He did not see me, I was there a couple of mins - didn't think anything of it other than I can think of better things to do at the weekend.
The next week in work he was complaining of a bad back. I kept my eye on him and he was obviously in pain. After a week he came to me and said he had to go to the hospital etc. He returned the next day and said they told him his back was strained "all over" and that he had to go for physiotherapy plus meds.
He said to me that lifting heavy items in work (max is 20kg) is now too much for him etc etc.
I mentioned perhaps he needs to knock the work at the weekend on the head.... told him about the weekend before... obviously came as a shock to him that I knew!
Last week he was taking it easy, I told him to do so - no problem with that.
Anyway, long story short at the weekend he was back there doing work again. Ok this time not as heavy - but still "heavy" work. Sat and Sun.
Yesterday he came back to me and said his back was still bad and that he was going to see a specialist next week.
I did not comment on me seeing him at the weekend.
Whats the best course of action?
Firstly I don't want to drag my friend into it - but if this guy decides to sue us I might have too? I know the injury was not sustained in work - we have machinery for moving heavy stuff.
Secondly, he ignored my advice about doing any more work at the weekend.
Ideas?
He seems ok at the moment, but the week before last when it was bad yes he could hardly do anything productive. He is slowly back to normal, which is expected with a back injury - I have been there myself. What worries me is when he goes to see this specialist he will use it as an excuse for a claim against the company - or go off on the sick.
If it were my company I would create a H&S incident stating he was on light duties between date x and y due to injuries sustained outside of his role and ask him to sign it. If he questions it, its needed just for H&S records to show you are meeting your employee's needs.
I'm not an expert though.
I'm not an expert though.
55palfers said:
Make sure all your manual handling assessments are up to date and document a formal 1:1 review of them on a personal capability level for your injured employee.
Document (handwritten notes will do) any discussions you have had with him too.
Yup. You need to start a process. Document (handwritten notes will do) any discussions you have had with him too.
Your employment may not have caused the injury but it may be exacerbating it.
We live in a litigious age. There are companies that will take on his case as it is now.
garyhun said:
andy-xr said:
Betcha he's more engaged and less sick if he's not having to pull foreigners
Not heard that term before. I assume that means working for another employer?We have a bit of that where I work due to tools & equipment at work - mgmt here is fine with it as long as done in your own time.
Jockman said:
garyhun said:
andy-xr said:
Betcha he's more engaged and less sick if he's not having to pull foreigners
Not heard that term before. I assume that means working for another employer?It defo does not mean you are taking a "second job" because the first is not paying enough. Certainly not in this area anyway. It simply means, doing extra work, generally using your companies equipment (van, workshop, tools etc) for your own personal gain.
For some reason it seems difficult to post in this area now without people getting on their high horse and jumping to conclusions. Wish I hadn't bothered asking now.
red_slr said:
It defo does not mean you are taking a "second job" because the first is not paying enough. Certainly not in this area anyway. It simply means, doing extra work, generally using your companies equipment (van, workshop, tools etc) for your own personal gain.
For some reason it seems difficult to post in this area now without people getting on their high horse and jumping to conclusions. Wish I hadn't bothered asking now.
Agreed. I was trying to explain someone else's post to Gary. I actually think the post and my explanation of it are complete bFor some reason it seems difficult to post in this area now without people getting on their high horse and jumping to conclusions. Wish I hadn't bothered asking now.
ks. You ve done nothing wrong but it can be manipulated to say otherwise. You need to look closely at allowing people to take second jobs. Bar work or taxi driving is one thing but a physical job that mirrors the primary job is definitely a conflict in my opinion.
Not an employer so no idea of the legalities but I would be careful drawing on the "I know what you did at the weekend" angle.
Presumably in the eyes of the law your duty of care is exactly the same as if he did it doing the gardening (his own garden) or any other way that is simply not your business.
Presumably in the eyes of the law your duty of care is exactly the same as if he did it doing the gardening (his own garden) or any other way that is simply not your business.
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