Redundancy

[Spydaman]

Had a nice surprise yesterday where I was informed my position was at risk of being made redundant. I’ve been with the company 23 years in various guises and it was only a couple of weeks ago I got a pay rise and a bonus but clearly that doesn’t count for anything.
I’ve been summoned to a meeting with HR and my boss on Tuesday but never having been in this situation before I’m not sure what to expect or what I want. As far as I know they offer any alternate open positions and tell me what the redundancy package will be. What else should I want to know?

[randlemarcus]

What enhanced terms you might get for going early and without fuss? 23 years at a reasonable enhancement might be a nice payoff. Don't go buying into a pub, or anything daft.

[Spydaman]

That's what I was thinking. The statutary redunancy is capped at £475/week and 20 years service so wont get much but I'm on 3 months notice so could get that in lieu of notice if I go quietly. Is it reasonable to expect more?

[andburg]

Get a copy of your contract dug out, check what you are contractually entitled to in terms of redundancy / severance

[Jasandjules]

Ask for an enhanced reference....Do you believe it is a genuine redundancy situation?

[Hughesie]

First £30k is tax free as well !

[DanL]

Spydaman said:

That's what I was thinking. The statutary redunancy is capped at £475/week and 20 years service so wont get much but I'm on 3 months notice so could get that in lieu of notice if I go quietly. Is it reasonable to expect more?

Yes. My company isn't particularly generous, but pays a week's salary per year worked, with no cap. Unless you happen to earn less than the statutory caps, I'd be unhappy that they're paying as little as they can get away with. At the very least, I'd hope for the extra three week's pay!

I'd also want payment in lieu of notice anyway - however, this won't form part of your redundancy payment and will be taxed. Any other benefits (car allowance, etc) should also be paid, along with holiday accrued but not yet taken.

At the end of the meeting, if I were you I would want to know:
Time scale for the redundancy process.
Payments for redundancy, and total payment they are proposing you would leave with.
What support is available to find a new job (training, CV and interview consultancy, etc.).
What other roles are available in the company for you to apply to, and how you find out about other internal roles that may be of interest.

Good luck!

[Jefftav]

Sorry to hear about your situation.

Read through the gov.uk websites for information about the processes involved and what you should be entitled too. Things like time off for interviews or retraining as well as payments.

At your consultation meeting take another person in with you as you may not take in all that is being said.

Hope it works out well and stay positive.

[Vaud]

You can call ACAS as well for free advice.

[Monkeylegend]

Look on it as an opportunity to get out of the routine you must be in after 23 years, and do something new. Many people say after the event that redundancy was the kick up the pants they needed, and it was the best thing that had happened to them.

[Sheepshanks]

Spydaman said:

Is it reasonable to expect more?

Often companies ask for volunteers first and the terms are usually much more generous than the basic amount.

[mike9009]

Is your position/ role shared by other people with the same title? Are they wanting to reshuffle people? .... so are there a load of other roles being advertised at the same time?

I have had this in the past where the general management wanted to rearrange (more or less) the entire management team and so put every ones job at risk of redundancy. It was a really crap way to do it and I suspect they wanted to get rid of one role (person??) and have a reshuffle. Created a load of stress over Xmas and New Year a few years ago.

Hope it all goes well for you.... let us know what is said in the meeting.


Mike

[williaa68]

Your local citizens advice bureau is a good source of advice if you aren't in a union. If you are, call them!

[cat with a hat]

I wouldn't know what to do either, thinking about that sweet redundancy payout

[Spydaman]

Thanks for the replies. In response to some of the comments and questions:
- While I should get a reasonable payout it will quickly get swallowed up. I won't be on the breadline as my wife works but it has scuppered my plans for an early retirement unless a I get a really good payout.
- I'm not in a union but looks like a call to CAB and ACAS is in order.
- I'm in a department with 4 others with similar roles and titles. My responsibilities will be divided up between those that remain. This isn't a re-shuffle but a cost cutting exercise.
- These aren't voluntary redundancies so no oportunity for enhanced packages.
- Agreed this could be the kick up the bum I need to finish all the outstanding projects and sell them then build the 904 replica I've always wanted.
- I don't think I'll need another person with me and it's a bit short notice to get anyone. I don't expect to get emotional and I wont be rushed. I'll be more annoyed that the HR girl is younger than most of my cars.
- Definitely will be after payment in lieu of notice and my car allowance. Not sure what else I can get but if I do get put on gardening leave I'll be down the dentist, optitian, chiropractor to use up my health insurance.

[ben5575]

Monkeylegend said:

Look on it as an opportunity to get out of the routine you must be in after 23 years, and do something new. Many people say after the event that redundancy was the kick up the pants they needed, and it was the best thing that had happened to them.

Absolutely this.

[Vaud]

". I'll be more annoyed that the HR girl is younger than most of my cars."

Why???

[mike9009]

Spydaman said:

- I'm not in a union but looks like a call to CAB and ACAS is in order.
- I'm in a department with 4 others with similar roles and titles. My responsibilities will be divided up between those that remain. This isn't a re-shuffle but a cost cutting exercise.
- These aren't voluntary redundancies so no oportunity for enhanced packages.

If the roles/ job titles are the same, the company cannot make a single person redundant - they have to make the role redundant. Which, given the limited information we have, means the other four people should also be at risk of redundancy. Next there should be a quantifiable scoring system to determine which person is made redundant (based, for example, upon, absence, skills, performance (not age or length of service)

Getting some decent advice at this stage would be good, as this is purely from personal experience rather than hard and fast law.

[DanL]

Spydaman said:

- Definitely will be after payment in lieu of notice and my car allowance. Not sure what else I can get but if I do get put on gardening leave I'll be down the dentist, optitian, chiropractor to use up my health insurance.

On the subject of what else you could get - do you have any form of clause in your contract preventing you from working for a competitor? I ask as they're quite common. If so, get them to agree to waive their right to enforce that - with 23 years at a company, I imagine the easiest way to find another job quickly would be to apply to firms who do much the same thing.

Medical cover, as you mention that - they've probably already paid for the year. It might be worth seeing if they'll allow that to run for the rest of the term to cover you (assuming you want it!).

As mentioned, if there are four other roles doing the same, they can't just put you at risk. However, if the roles are "similar" but not the same I'm not so sure - you'd need some advice from someone qualified to give it there, and that's not me!

[Murph7355]

If they're keeping some of the positions open I'd be taking a slightly different stance. Your posts are a bit "them and us" and if you go in with that approach it's unlikely to help matters. The people delivering the initial messages are unlikely to have much choice in what they're doing, and taking a "stance" might not endear you to them. If there are, say, three positions out of four to remain, it might not help you secure one of them if that's what you want.

Think hard about what it is you would like to happen. And think about how best to position yourself for it. If you want to keep your position, think carefully about what you can note (either at this session or later) that makes you the preferable resource to retain.

At the session, be calm. If you're not told automatically, ask what the position is with the roles , the reason for the redundancy, how many more are happening across the company (I think if there are > 20 or so the rules around how they play it are different in terms of how much "consultation" is needed...which changes your negotiating position), process and overall timeframes, what you need to do to put in a constructive application for a role etc.

Take as much info away from the session as you can. Don't bang the drum and be demanding. Then come away and think again about what you really want and formulate your strategy from there. I am sure the process will involve a number of other meetings where you will have opportunity to start being more firm if required.