Army Phase 1 Training- getting my son through...
Discussion
Hi all,
I'm hoping for some advice from people who have recently gone through Phase 1 training or anyone with Army experience I guess.
My son, who is 18, started Phase 1 training en route to (hopefully) a career in Signals. Within 3 weeks he was having trouble owing to his own immaturity and lack of willingness, which resulted in him almost being kicked out but they eventually back trooped him to the beginning. He really knuckled down after his Mum and I gave him a stern talking to, and to his credit he has got all the way through to Week 12, so just two weeks left.
However, last week he failed a field admin test, which basically is a one hour test in which the recruit has to clean themselves, cook breakfast and clean their rifle out in the field. This was a retest as he failed the original test a few weeks back owing to his rifle being unacceptable. To cut a long story short, he has been told the only thing holding him back is his admin skills (specifically cleaning his rifle and some of the less enjoyable ironing jobs) so having been one of the top recruits at marksmanship, fitness, drill, etc. he is being told he is being back trooped again back to Week 7.
He is coming home for 3 weeks next week, it will great to see him, but I am incredibly frustrated that basically an inability to recognise what constitutes a clean rifle has cost him 5 weeks of training. I will say he is a different kid to the one who got back trooped first time round - the amount of confidence and maturity the army has given him is amazing, but I'm just wondering what can be done. He isn't the sort of guy who asks for help which I have told him is a huge mistake.
To his credit, he has told me he can't wait to get back and show them he can do it, but this will surely be his last chance and I wonder if there is any external help available for these three weeks such as cadets or reserve where he can practice?
The army have been fantastic so far, and like I say the immature, doubting boy we dropped off at the beginning of the year has changed to a confident, mature, almost robotic young man and that is great to see, but it's a huge worry for us that his dream keeps getting curtailed.
Thanks for reading.
I'm hoping for some advice from people who have recently gone through Phase 1 training or anyone with Army experience I guess.
My son, who is 18, started Phase 1 training en route to (hopefully) a career in Signals. Within 3 weeks he was having trouble owing to his own immaturity and lack of willingness, which resulted in him almost being kicked out but they eventually back trooped him to the beginning. He really knuckled down after his Mum and I gave him a stern talking to, and to his credit he has got all the way through to Week 12, so just two weeks left.
However, last week he failed a field admin test, which basically is a one hour test in which the recruit has to clean themselves, cook breakfast and clean their rifle out in the field. This was a retest as he failed the original test a few weeks back owing to his rifle being unacceptable. To cut a long story short, he has been told the only thing holding him back is his admin skills (specifically cleaning his rifle and some of the less enjoyable ironing jobs) so having been one of the top recruits at marksmanship, fitness, drill, etc. he is being told he is being back trooped again back to Week 7.
He is coming home for 3 weeks next week, it will great to see him, but I am incredibly frustrated that basically an inability to recognise what constitutes a clean rifle has cost him 5 weeks of training. I will say he is a different kid to the one who got back trooped first time round - the amount of confidence and maturity the army has given him is amazing, but I'm just wondering what can be done. He isn't the sort of guy who asks for help which I have told him is a huge mistake.
To his credit, he has told me he can't wait to get back and show them he can do it, but this will surely be his last chance and I wonder if there is any external help available for these three weeks such as cadets or reserve where he can practice?
The army have been fantastic so far, and like I say the immature, doubting boy we dropped off at the beginning of the year has changed to a confident, mature, almost robotic young man and that is great to see, but it's a huge worry for us that his dream keeps getting curtailed.
Thanks for reading.
My only advice would be to keep him to a strict routine.
Have him do all of the ironing, plan some meals and cook them, polish all the house shoes, etc. No guns I guess, but how about buying some cheap weathered copper pots or similar and have him polish those up with brasso, etc?
Add in some reward for doing it well.
Essentially, don't let him get too comfortable at home.
Have him do all of the ironing, plan some meals and cook them, polish all the house shoes, etc. No guns I guess, but how about buying some cheap weathered copper pots or similar and have him polish those up with brasso, etc?
Add in some reward for doing it well.
Essentially, don't let him get too comfortable at home.
It's got to come from him. He's got to want it. Just impress on him that a few weeks of hard work and effort can shape his entire future/career.
Admin is easy though. Get organised and prioritise his time. Do as you're told, don't take short cuts. If he's ever got "spare time" during training he's slacking or hasn't done something as well as he could do!
They aren't asking anything that's impossible.
Admin is easy though. Get organised and prioritise his time. Do as you're told, don't take short cuts. If he's ever got "spare time" during training he's slacking or hasn't done something as well as he could do!
They aren't asking anything that's impossible.
Echo what DurAce says. Incredibly hard for you I know, but you MUST project an aura of calculated indifference; "your life to f*ck up son" type of thing. This will help him in the immediate term to realise that he - and he alone - has to get his sh*t together and in the longer term to foster the self-reliance he'll need to get anything out of an army career.
The only thing that you could potentially do is get him a job flipping burgers/doing night shift cleaning/on the bins for your local authority for the three weeks he's home and keep in his ribs about that's what he's consigning himself to a life of if he f*cks up again.
So easy to say when you're not the kid's old man of course......
The only thing that you could potentially do is get him a job flipping burgers/doing night shift cleaning/on the bins for your local authority for the three weeks he's home and keep in his ribs about that's what he's consigning himself to a life of if he f*cks up again.
So easy to say when you're not the kid's old man of course......
My lad joined at 16 for junior soldier training, he went through tough times at Harrogate and Catterick, especially after a weekend at home having to go back to camp. All we could do was to talk to him about his options if he left / quit etc. Basically it was zero, no industries left locally, didnt get great exam results, so what ever he did instead of the Army he was looking at min wage jobs. That helped focus his mind but at the end of the day its down to him.
In your case it sounds like he needs some tough love from you, bit of a reality check for him and a basic 'pull your finger out'.
My lad is now at Tidworth in the Fusiliers , and we went down there yesterday for the Changing of the Colours parade which was great but you still worry about them fitting in / making friends etc, but he did get through the hard times (he cant operate a tin opener so how the f
k he can handle a rifle is beyond me lol)
In your case it sounds like he needs some tough love from you, bit of a reality check for him and a basic 'pull your finger out'.
My lad is now at Tidworth in the Fusiliers , and we went down there yesterday for the Changing of the Colours parade which was great but you still worry about them fitting in / making friends etc, but he did get through the hard times (he cant operate a tin opener so how the f
k he can handle a rifle is beyond me lol)This routine will sort him out.
05:00-07:00 - Beasting.
07:00-07:15 - Breakfast.
07:15-11:00 - Beasting.
11:00-11:45 - High Intensity Beasting.
11:45-12:30 - Lunch.
12:30-14:30 - Post Modern Beasting.
14:30-17:00 - Beasting.
17:00-18:00 - Cooking and Eating Evening Meal.
18:00-21:00 - Beasting.
05:00-07:00 - Beasting.
07:00-07:15 - Breakfast.
07:15-11:00 - Beasting.
11:00-11:45 - High Intensity Beasting.
11:45-12:30 - Lunch.
12:30-14:30 - Post Modern Beasting.
14:30-17:00 - Beasting.
17:00-18:00 - Cooking and Eating Evening Meal.
18:00-21:00 - Beasting.
dudleybloke said:
This routine will sort him out.
05:00-07:00 - Beasting.
07:00-07:15 - Breakfast.
07:15-11:00 - Beasting.
11:00-11:45 - High Intensity Beasting.
11:45-12:30 - Lunch.
12:30-14:30 - Post Modern Beasting.
14:30-17:00 - Beasting.
17:00-18:00 - Cooking and Eating Evening Meal.
18:00-21:00 - Beasting.
Bit of a late start with these light mornings 05:00-07:00 - Beasting.
07:00-07:15 - Breakfast.
07:15-11:00 - Beasting.
11:00-11:45 - High Intensity Beasting.
11:45-12:30 - Lunch.
12:30-14:30 - Post Modern Beasting.
14:30-17:00 - Beasting.
17:00-18:00 - Cooking and Eating Evening Meal.
18:00-21:00 - Beasting.
Sounds to me like he doesn't really want it and is only there due to your pressure on him to stay. What is he really interested in as a career as a signals operator would bore me to tears.
I guess this field test is where they take them out for the day/night with a bit of blank firing and then have to do their admin? Above all he has to do everything in this order: your rifle, your kit, yourself. That's not to say you can't put your scran on while your cleaning your rifle etc. After a while you also learn the spots where the rifle rusts so you make sure these areas are spotless. Immediately after taking it out of the armoury absolutely coat the fker in OX8
I guess this field test is where they take them out for the day/night with a bit of blank firing and then have to do their admin? Above all he has to do everything in this order: your rifle, your kit, yourself. That's not to say you can't put your scran on while your cleaning your rifle etc. After a while you also learn the spots where the rifle rusts so you make sure these areas are spotless. Immediately after taking it out of the armoury absolutely coat the f
ker in OX8Admin is the easy bit, he just needs to knuckle down. If he is struggling to motivate himself for Phase 1 then he is going to struggle with Phase 2. Never did the signals side of things but infantry phase 2 made phase 1 look like a day at a play centre.
Thing you need to tell him is that after all this time in he can't leave and if he is wanting to be kicked out it will take a long, long time to achieve that, so he may as well just get on with it.
Thing you need to tell him is that after all this time in he can't leave and if he is wanting to be kicked out it will take a long, long time to achieve that, so he may as well just get on with it.
Could be the trade he's chosen and having second thoughts, not too late to change. Sigs would bore the st out of me but some love it.
If he's struggling with ironing just get him to iron everything when he's home, takes practice to get right. Really wants to nail this or he'll be on show every morning until he's sorted and it's a ball ache!!! I still use the same ironing method I got taught 20 years ago by a psychotic Coldstream L/Sgt
Fieldcraft he'll pick up overtime but is a biggy so needs to prioritize everything and get used to doing a few things at once, really needs to get the admin side sorted though, if he's been back squaded already then he should (in theory) be better than the rest in his new platoon.
Sounds like he doesn't want it though....
t out of me but some love it.If he's struggling with ironing just get him to iron everything when he's home, takes practice to get right. Really wants to nail this or he'll be on show every morning until he's sorted and it's a ball ache!!! I still use the same ironing method I got taught 20 years ago by a psychotic Coldstream L/Sgt
Fieldcraft he'll pick up overtime but is a biggy so needs to prioritize everything and get used to doing a few things at once, really needs to get the admin side sorted though, if he's been back squaded already then he should (in theory) be better than the rest in his new platoon.
Sounds like he doesn't want it though....
Thanks all for the comments. Some really helpful advice, and yes I have considered a proper beasting while he is home.
It's definitely not a motivation issue, he could withdraw himself any time, and in his own words he can't wait to get to Phase 2 and do his trade as its what he has always wanted to do. The big issue is that he is just such a relaxed character, and everything is done at a relaxed pace which just doesn't work when you're against the clock on things like the admin test.
Bear in mind he has passed everything else they have to thrown at him, some of them (in my mind) a lot tougher so it's just so frustrating that something so basic is in the way. Of reaching the end.
I will certainly try to make his time at home slightly uncomfortable, but I have no doubts he wants to go back and get through. No doubts at all.
Thanks for the advice re: coating the rifle, that was my advice a few weeks back - I also said try and fire it less and keep it dry (!) so it's not as dirty.
It's definitely not a motivation issue, he could withdraw himself any time, and in his own words he can't wait to get to Phase 2 and do his trade as its what he has always wanted to do. The big issue is that he is just such a relaxed character, and everything is done at a relaxed pace which just doesn't work when you're against the clock on things like the admin test.
Bear in mind he has passed everything else they have to thrown at him, some of them (in my mind) a lot tougher so it's just so frustrating that something so basic is in the way. Of reaching the end.
I will certainly try to make his time at home slightly uncomfortable, but I have no doubts he wants to go back and get through. No doubts at all.
Thanks for the advice re: coating the rifle, that was my advice a few weeks back - I also said try and fire it less and keep it dry (!) so it's not as dirty.
I use a small plastic spray bottle that you get in cosmetics shops to spray oil on then work it around using flannalette. Coating the gas parts is usually a no no as it creates smoke which can give away your position. For blank firing and exercises coast them right up! Helps if the rifle was previously spotless as cleaning layers of carbon takes time.
If he has to use cam cream and then clean it off tell him to use only a little black or not bother with black at all. In training I was responsible for my bivvy partners facial cleanlyness and if his face was dirty then I would have a strike against my name. 3 strikes in total equaled going on the flank and getting thrashed at the end of the muster. I told him not to bother using black as it was a bd to remove but he still coated himself in it regardless. I'd get my revenge the following morning by scrubbing the st out of his freshly cold shaven skin!
He could eat cold food saving the admin of cleaning mess tins but hot wets are the way forward. So is shaving with hot water and eating hot rations.
If he has to use cam cream and then clean it off tell him to use only a little black or not bother with black at all. In training I was responsible for my bivvy partners facial cleanlyness and if his face was dirty then I would have a strike against my name. 3 strikes in total equaled going on the flank and getting thrashed at the end of the muster. I told him not to bother using black as it was a b
d to remove but he still coated himself in it regardless. I'd get my revenge the following morning by scrubbing the st out of his freshly cold shaven skin!He could eat cold food saving the admin of cleaning mess tins but hot wets are the way forward. So is shaving with hot water and eating hot rations.
ClaphamGT3 said:
Echo what DurAce says. Incredibly hard for you I know, but you MUST project an aura of calculated indifference; "your life to f*ck up son" type of thing. This will help him in the immediate term to realise that he - and he alone - has to get his sh*t together and in the longer term to foster the self-reliance he'll need to get anything out of an army career.
The only thing that you could potentially do is get him a job flipping burgers/doing night shift cleaning/on the bins for your local authority for the three weeks he's home and keep in his ribs about that's what he's consigning himself to a life of if he f*cks up again.
So easy to say when you're not the kid's old man of course......
This. I phoned my dad up halfway through my first term at Sandhurst at the same age. I begged him to come and get me. He was very clear that he would collect me, but not to expect any help and not to form the delusion he would be proud of my efforts.The only thing that you could potentially do is get him a job flipping burgers/doing night shift cleaning/on the bins for your local authority for the three weeks he's home and keep in his ribs about that's what he's consigning himself to a life of if he f*cks up again.
So easy to say when you're not the kid's old man of course......
I hated him at the time, but he was spot on. If he'd sympathised with me I'd have jacked on the spot. Good man manager my old man. I can thank him for my commission.
One other thought; pretend to be interested when he tells you he difference between an aerial and an antennae (I'm sure the Signals do teach other things, but this does seem to be the opening conversational gambit for all scaleys).
Good luck!
No help at all to the OP, I suppose, but FWIW I joined straight from school at 16 and went off to Dover to begin my training.
Words of wisdom and encouragement from my dad? "You'll be back within three months - you won't hack it."
25 years and one month later I was set free with an immediate pension. I'd hated training. Watching Full Metal Jacket was like watching an episode of PlaySchool after recruit training. For that first year and a bit I only kept at it because I wasn't going to let my old man have the satisfaction of saying "Ha! I told you so!" when I came home with my tail between my legs. But FFWD to discharge time, and I didn't really want to go - I'd have stayed on if they'd have allowed me to.
Like I say, though, not much help to the OP. Training NCOs got away with far more back then, and it genuinely was harder. Plus the way that the training regime is organised and delivered is hugely different now. Back then there were "Junior Leaders" regiments to 'school' recruits under 17½ years old for a whole year, followed by adult (or 'Phase 2') training of (I think) about 8 weeks, and there was a long wait in a field unit before you were even considered for 'trade' training.
Horrible moments remembered from that first year...
Watching the key turn in the lock of the store room door, as all our civilian clothes, duvets, towels and radios, etc were placed out of bounds "Until term 3 at least, and then only if you earn them back"
When sent to the Guard Room for a punishment beasting in the quad, we'd be PT'd at high intensity until exhausted. When asked if you wanted to rest, you had a choice. The "rest" position (now recognised as a form of torture I think) - thighs and arms parallel to the ground, lower legs and back vertical, back against the wall, until we begged to continue exercising - Or - Decline the rest, and continue with press-ups 'til you couldn't get your face off the deck. All administered by a sadistic fat bd in a peaked cap who you had to address as "Staff" and who looked like he hadn't seen the inside of a gym in 20 years.
'Failing' a room inspection and being punished with a "show parade" in the quad. The whole troop having to hump their beds, and lockers, along with all the contents, down three flights of stairs, and set everything up perfectly as though it were in the barrack rooms still.
Being turned out of our beds and told to parade in 2's down outside the duty bunk when one of our section commanders was on duty NCO overnight. At 2am we were lined up in a narrow corridor, dressed in our best kit, marking time for about 15 minutes. Whereupon the Cpl in question came out of his bunk and gave the order "Troop. Troop, Halt!" Then he stepped toward a window, now completely steamed up, and wrote his name with his index finger, spelling it out loud as he did so. "T - I - M - Tim!" he said, then fell us out and yelled for us to "Get away!" to our beds.
Having to parade our "best boots" on the windowsills of our rooms during room inspections. Then praying that you wouldn't be asked how fast you could run. The sash windows in our 1930s era barrack rooms were always open at the bottom. No matter what your answer to "How fast can you run?" you knew that what was coming next was your boots being lifted by the toe and tipped out of the window, while you were sent running down three flights of stairs and round the back of the block to "Catch the bloody things then! Whoops. Too slow..."
I can't say whether it made me a better person. Or even a better soldier. But it was a pretty damned horrible way to treat a fellow human being. Although it did have the desired effect of beating individuality out of us and molding us into a team.
Words of wisdom and encouragement from my dad? "You'll be back within three months - you won't hack it."
25 years and one month later I was set free with an immediate pension. I'd hated training. Watching Full Metal Jacket was like watching an episode of PlaySchool after recruit training. For that first year and a bit I only kept at it because I wasn't going to let my old man have the satisfaction of saying "Ha! I told you so!" when I came home with my tail between my legs. But FFWD to discharge time, and I didn't really want to go - I'd have stayed on if they'd have allowed me to.
Like I say, though, not much help to the OP. Training NCOs got away with far more back then, and it genuinely was harder. Plus the way that the training regime is organised and delivered is hugely different now. Back then there were "Junior Leaders" regiments to 'school' recruits under 17½ years old for a whole year, followed by adult (or 'Phase 2') training of (I think) about 8 weeks, and there was a long wait in a field unit before you were even considered for 'trade' training.
Horrible moments remembered from that first year...
Watching the key turn in the lock of the store room door, as all our civilian clothes, duvets, towels and radios, etc were placed out of bounds "Until term 3 at least, and then only if you earn them back"
When sent to the Guard Room for a punishment beasting in the quad, we'd be PT'd at high intensity until exhausted. When asked if you wanted to rest, you had a choice. The "rest" position (now recognised as a form of torture I think) - thighs and arms parallel to the ground, lower legs and back vertical, back against the wall, until we begged to continue exercising - Or - Decline the rest, and continue with press-ups 'til you couldn't get your face off the deck. All administered by a sadistic fat b
d in a peaked cap who you had to address as "Staff" and who looked like he hadn't seen the inside of a gym in 20 years.'Failing' a room inspection and being punished with a "show parade" in the quad. The whole troop having to hump their beds, and lockers, along with all the contents, down three flights of stairs, and set everything up perfectly as though it were in the barrack rooms still.
Being turned out of our beds and told to parade in 2's down outside the duty bunk when one of our section commanders was on duty NCO overnight. At 2am we were lined up in a narrow corridor, dressed in our best kit, marking time for about 15 minutes. Whereupon the Cpl in question came out of his bunk and gave the order "Troop. Troop, Halt!" Then he stepped toward a window, now completely steamed up, and wrote his name with his index finger, spelling it out loud as he did so. "T - I - M - Tim!" he said, then fell us out and yelled for us to "Get away!" to our beds.
Having to parade our "best boots" on the windowsills of our rooms during room inspections. Then praying that you wouldn't be asked how fast you could run. The sash windows in our 1930s era barrack rooms were always open at the bottom. No matter what your answer to "How fast can you run?" you knew that what was coming next was your boots being lifted by the toe and tipped out of the window, while you were sent running down three flights of stairs and round the back of the block to "Catch the bloody things then! Whoops. Too slow..."
I can't say whether it made me a better person. Or even a better soldier. But it was a pretty damned horrible way to treat a fellow human being. Although it did have the desired effect of beating individuality out of us and molding us into a team.
Gassing Station | Jobs & Employment Matters | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff