Dad got his license back!! How?
Discussion
Try to cut a long story short.
Dad had an operation on his spine back in October last year, he was hospitalised for 2 months.
He can no longer walk unaided (sticks, frame etc.)
Back in January he got back in his car - I was horrified and put a stop to that through his surgeon. Now however, his surgeon has given the OK to drive, he reapplied and DVLA sent him a shiny new license yesterday. He is 80+, reactions dulled with age, partially deaf and has not got full control of his limbs yet his surgeon (edited) has deemed him fit to drive.
I am horrified, he wont listen to me (I am trying to undermine his independence) when I tell him he just isn't capable. He "Pooh-Poohs" the risk involved and is now back in charge of a one-ton weapon.
How can I legally have his license revoked?
Dad had an operation on his spine back in October last year, he was hospitalised for 2 months.
He can no longer walk unaided (sticks, frame etc.)
Back in January he got back in his car - I was horrified and put a stop to that through his surgeon. Now however, his surgeon has given the OK to drive, he reapplied and DVLA sent him a shiny new license yesterday. He is 80+, reactions dulled with age, partially deaf and has not got full control of his limbs yet his surgeon (edited) has deemed him fit to drive.
I am horrified, he wont listen to me (I am trying to undermine his independence) when I tell him he just isn't capable. He "Pooh-Poohs" the risk involved and is now back in charge of a one-ton weapon.
How can I legally have his license revoked?
Edited by NormalWisdom on Wednesday 8th June 17:35
I went through something similar with my dad , he was ill for a while and really would have been an accident waiting to happen, if driving , the result was his doctor told him he considered it unwise to drive in his current condition (after we had a chat with the doc.)
Since then he has gotten his strength back and has talked to his doc. and now is bumbling about in his car again (already had a minor bump) IMO he shouldn't be driving but he hasn't long left and is determined to keep his driving going .
If your dad is the same, you'll have a fight on your hands.
If his doctor see's him fit , maybe you should just relax about it as its been ok'd by a medical professional?
Since then he has gotten his strength back and has talked to his doc. and now is bumbling about in his car again (already had a minor bump) IMO he shouldn't be driving but he hasn't long left and is determined to keep his driving going .
If your dad is the same, you'll have a fight on your hands.
If his doctor see's him fit , maybe you should just relax about it as its been ok'd by a medical professional?
dingg said:
If his doctor see's him fit , maybe you should just relax about it as its been ok'd by a medical professional?
This is where it gets sticky - If he has an accident and there is a fatality, he will probably get locked-up plus, I am not sure any medical professional has been consulted. His Surgeon signed him off (not sure if that's the same as giving the green light to driving again)and that's about it!If he doesn't have full control of his limbs then his consultant, GP or occupational therapist (if he was assigned one) should really have referred him to his nearest driving assessment centre.
You can find the nearest centre at the link below and many accept self referrals.
http://www.mobility-centres.org.uk/find_a_centre/l...
Even people with no legs at all can still drive (with some basic hand controls hooked up to an auto car) so even if your father fails the assessment because his legs aren't quite strong or reactive enough then it's not the end of the world.
However, you say his surgeon has said he's fit to drive - well given this surgeon has experience of dealing with spinal patients I'm sure the decision to give your father the all clear to drive wasn't taken lightly.
You can find the nearest centre at the link below and many accept self referrals.
http://www.mobility-centres.org.uk/find_a_centre/l...
Even people with no legs at all can still drive (with some basic hand controls hooked up to an auto car) so even if your father fails the assessment because his legs aren't quite strong or reactive enough then it's not the end of the world.
However, you say his surgeon has said he's fit to drive - well given this surgeon has experience of dealing with spinal patients I'm sure the decision to give your father the all clear to drive wasn't taken lightly.
NormalWisdom said:
Try to cut a long story short.
Dad had an operation on his spine back in October last year, he was hospitalised for 2 months.
He can no longer walk unaided (sticks, frame etc.)
Back in January he got back in his car - I was horrified and put a stop to that through his surgeon. Now however, his surgeon has given the OK to drive, he reapplied and DVLA sent him a shiny new license yesterday. He is 80+, reactions dulled with age, partially deaf and has not got full control of his limbs yet his GP has deemed him fit to drive.
I am horrified, he wont listen to me (I am trying to undermine his independence) when I tell him he just isn't capable. He "Pooh-Poohs" the risk involved and is now back in charge of a one-ton weapon.
How can I legally have his license revoked?
I think you need to let your Dad live what is left of his life.Dad had an operation on his spine back in October last year, he was hospitalised for 2 months.
He can no longer walk unaided (sticks, frame etc.)
Back in January he got back in his car - I was horrified and put a stop to that through his surgeon. Now however, his surgeon has given the OK to drive, he reapplied and DVLA sent him a shiny new license yesterday. He is 80+, reactions dulled with age, partially deaf and has not got full control of his limbs yet his GP has deemed him fit to drive.
I am horrified, he wont listen to me (I am trying to undermine his independence) when I tell him he just isn't capable. He "Pooh-Poohs" the risk involved and is now back in charge of a one-ton weapon.
How can I legally have his license revoked?
Sorry.
NormalWisdom said:
Now however, his surgeon has given the OK to drive, he reapplied and DVLA sent him a shiny new license yesterday.
OK... So his back isn't a problem for driving.NormalWisdom said:
He is 80+, reactions dulled with age, partially deaf and has not got full control of his limbs yet his GP has deemed him fit to drive.
Now hold on one second... I thought you just said his surgeon? His surgeon won't have considered anything but his back.You need to talk to his GP, not his surgeon, if you think he shouldn't be driving. But nothing you've said about him means he's necessarily inherently unfit to drive.
Ultimately, there's nothing YOU can do to take his licence off him. Just as there's nothing I can do to take YOUR licence off you. He's an adult.
If his driving is bad enough that he has a minor collision or two, you may find that the police come and have a little chat with him, and basically offer him the choice to hand his licence back voluntarily or be prosecuted.
Edited by TooMany2cvs on Wednesday 8th June 16:54
Soov535 said:
NormalWisdom said:
Try to cut a long story short.
Dad had an operation on his spine back in October last year, he was hospitalised for 2 months.
He can no longer walk unaided (sticks, frame etc.)
Back in January he got back in his car - I was horrified and put a stop to that through his surgeon. Now however, his surgeon has given the OK to drive, he reapplied and DVLA sent him a shiny new license yesterday. He is 80+, reactions dulled with age, partially deaf and has not got full control of his limbs yet his GP has deemed him fit to drive.
I am horrified, he wont listen to me (I am trying to undermine his independence) when I tell him he just isn't capable. He "Pooh-Poohs" the risk involved and is now back in charge of a one-ton weapon.
How can I legally have his license revoked?
I think you need to let your Dad live what is left of his life.Dad had an operation on his spine back in October last year, he was hospitalised for 2 months.
He can no longer walk unaided (sticks, frame etc.)
Back in January he got back in his car - I was horrified and put a stop to that through his surgeon. Now however, his surgeon has given the OK to drive, he reapplied and DVLA sent him a shiny new license yesterday. He is 80+, reactions dulled with age, partially deaf and has not got full control of his limbs yet his GP has deemed him fit to drive.
I am horrified, he wont listen to me (I am trying to undermine his independence) when I tell him he just isn't capable. He "Pooh-Poohs" the risk involved and is now back in charge of a one-ton weapon.
How can I legally have his license revoked?
Sorry.
But on saying that, it is the same answer I get when I pose it to some learners. As well as "but it will take away their independence" or "they wouldn't do it if they didn't think they could" or "it will cause a family argument"
When they crash it will be a case of "we knew we should have done something about him/her". TOO LATE
TOPTON said:
Soov535 said:
NormalWisdom said:
Try to cut a long story short.
Dad had an operation on his spine back in October last year, he was hospitalised for 2 months.
He can no longer walk unaided (sticks, frame etc.)
Back in January he got back in his car - I was horrified and put a stop to that through his surgeon. Now however, his surgeon has given the OK to drive, he reapplied and DVLA sent him a shiny new license yesterday. He is 80+, reactions dulled with age, partially deaf and has not got full control of his limbs yet his GP has deemed him fit to drive.
I am horrified, he wont listen to me (I am trying to undermine his independence) when I tell him he just isn't capable. He "Pooh-Poohs" the risk involved and is now back in charge of a one-ton weapon.
How can I legally have his license revoked?
I think you need to let your Dad live what is left of his life.Dad had an operation on his spine back in October last year, he was hospitalised for 2 months.
He can no longer walk unaided (sticks, frame etc.)
Back in January he got back in his car - I was horrified and put a stop to that through his surgeon. Now however, his surgeon has given the OK to drive, he reapplied and DVLA sent him a shiny new license yesterday. He is 80+, reactions dulled with age, partially deaf and has not got full control of his limbs yet his GP has deemed him fit to drive.
I am horrified, he wont listen to me (I am trying to undermine his independence) when I tell him he just isn't capable. He "Pooh-Poohs" the risk involved and is now back in charge of a one-ton weapon.
How can I legally have his license revoked?
Sorry.
But on saying that, it is the same answer I get when I pose it to some learners. As well as "but it will take away their independence" or "they wouldn't do it if they didn't think they could" or "it will cause a family argument"
When they crash it will be a case of "we knew we should have done something about him/her". TOO LATE
Life is a series of calculated risks.
Soov535 said:
His doctor has cleared him. I trust healthcare professionals more than amateurs.
Life is a series of calculated risks.
His surgeon signed him off (not sure if he was cleared to drive, still investigating). However, he was only concerned with the risk posed by his involvement (spinal surgery), not the compounding effect of other shortcomings.........Life is a series of calculated risks.
I agree. Those risks in this case are increasing rapidly due to failing health and immobility. Part of my profession is managing and effectively mitigating risk and I am frustrated that there seems to be no body held accountable, or able to take decisive action, in such instances.
Nothing you've said (apart from the possible mental degradation) renders him unfit to drive. From the back injury point of view, I would guess that the surgeons key criteria is "can he apply sufficient force to the brake pedal in an emergency". If yes, then from the surgeons POV he is fine. We went through this with my wife recently - she had a foot operation, and this was the key criterion for getting back behind the wheel.
Now, it is possible that he is otherwise not fit to drive - in which case the GP should be involved. But "had spinal surgery, walks with a stick" does not mean he is necessarily a menace on the road.
Now, it is possible that he is otherwise not fit to drive - in which case the GP should be involved. But "had spinal surgery, walks with a stick" does not mean he is necessarily a menace on the road.
You can report your father to the DVLA. I did it with mine when I felt he wasn't safe behind the wheel - he was 85, had poor vision and a short fuse. The DVLA wrote to him telling him that he needed to see his GP to determine if he was fit to continue driving. GP decided he wasn't and dad's licence was revoked. He knew he'd been 'shopped' (he thought it was one of my sisters) and was furious for a while but soon came to accept that his driving days were over.
NormalWisdom said:
This is where it gets sticky - If he has an accident and there is a fatality, he will probably get locked-up plus, I am not sure any medical professional has been consulted. His Surgeon signed him off (not sure if that's the same as giving the green light to driving again)and that's about it!
His surgeon is a medical professional. He has pronounced him fit to drive. Neither you nor I can negate that decision as we are not qualified to judge.FFS - is this going the same way of many in SP&L (and elsewhere on here)???
What is legal and a 'right' doesn't always make it right!
My own Father was a total liability on the roads - but medically and mentally 'able' apparently. How many medics had been in the car with him around Hammersmith Broadway or similar - NONE.
He was a DM front page waiting to happen. Absolutely no question. Losing his licence would have 'killed him' and removed every last inch of his independence. In our specific circumstances, I didn't give a flying f**k.
My father was a total liability and would have caused accidents. I was not prepared to allow that on the roads and potentially mount a pavement and kill someone. Something bad would have happened if only a metal/metal big one and no injuries.
We had similar issues and delicacies where we were effectively calling the medic's judgment into question I guess.
I wrote to his Senior GP - Head of Practice - stating my reservations and concerns. I made it very clear that his various ailments when added together in a practical sense meant he should not be on the roads at all/ever. I stressed to the GP that this was the case and we would hold him and the surgery to account if our genuine and practical concerns and personal experience of his driving was not taken into account.
We then asked the GP to put it in writing to us that Dad was fit to drive and acknowledge my letter and concerns re the subject.
Funnily enough, the GP had his licence removed!
Try the above or similar; in these litigious days, no GP will want the hassle etc. I am sure Soovy or someone will explain the legalities of this course of action and the responsibility on the GP's part to take heed of genuine family concerns and warnings??
What is legal and a 'right' doesn't always make it right!
My own Father was a total liability on the roads - but medically and mentally 'able' apparently. How many medics had been in the car with him around Hammersmith Broadway or similar - NONE.
He was a DM front page waiting to happen. Absolutely no question. Losing his licence would have 'killed him' and removed every last inch of his independence. In our specific circumstances, I didn't give a flying f**k.
My father was a total liability and would have caused accidents. I was not prepared to allow that on the roads and potentially mount a pavement and kill someone. Something bad would have happened if only a metal/metal big one and no injuries.
We had similar issues and delicacies where we were effectively calling the medic's judgment into question I guess.
I wrote to his Senior GP - Head of Practice - stating my reservations and concerns. I made it very clear that his various ailments when added together in a practical sense meant he should not be on the roads at all/ever. I stressed to the GP that this was the case and we would hold him and the surgery to account if our genuine and practical concerns and personal experience of his driving was not taken into account.
We then asked the GP to put it in writing to us that Dad was fit to drive and acknowledge my letter and concerns re the subject.
Funnily enough, the GP had his licence removed!
Try the above or similar; in these litigious days, no GP will want the hassle etc. I am sure Soovy or someone will explain the legalities of this course of action and the responsibility on the GP's part to take heed of genuine family concerns and warnings??
The Alzheimer's society have excellent advice on driving. Whilst it relates to dementia it is easily applicable to age generally
https://www.alzheimers.org.uk/site/scripts/documen...
There are also independent centres where you can go for an Independant assessment (not a test). There are links on the Alzheimer's website
https://www.alzheimers.org.uk/site/scripts/documen...
There are also independent centres where you can go for an Independant assessment (not a test). There are links on the Alzheimer's website
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