Alloy comeback... Alloy vs carbon..

[PorkRind]

Has anyone recently noticed the trend in road race / endurance bikes going towards Alloy instead of carbon? I've seen some glowing reports on the caad12 / specialized bikes and thinking that instead of getting a carbon frame (as a larger guy 17st) it'd be more beneficial and easier going on the bike to stick to alloy, or do carbon frames have the strength to put up with that sort of frame?

I only ask as my Bianchi c-tech carbon frame is starting to show some worrying signs, - paint cracking around the seat stay alloy inserts and am reevaluating what materials best for me !

[Matt_N]

What kind of riding you do should be a good start to working out what frame material you want your next bike to be made of.

Aluminium alloy frames do tend to produce a stiff, buzzy and sometimes harsh ride, the latter is one of the main points manufacturers try to design out with alloy frames. But if you're riding crits etc then a responsive and stiff alloy frame is a good bet.

If you're looking for all day comfort then it's probably best to stick with carbon, steel or even ti.

[Barchettaman]

At your weight I would be looking at a steel-framed bike and a hand-built wheelset, with enough frame clearance for 622/28 tyres.

[TwistingMyMelon]

Its difficult comparing the two as there are so many variables, heres my 10p of waffle:

Ive just bought another Alloy road bike to commute on , retailed new @ around £1k,

I also own a Carbon bike, that say cost around £1800

The alloy is maybe a touch lighter , probably a bit less aero, but if anything I am almost quicker on it

Trouble with the Alloy frame is the ride is a lot harsher on broken up back lanes, I hit a small pot hole the other day and everything go thrown out my pockets! Ive got used to it, but blimey it can be hard work on British roads. Also After a long 70+ mile ride I get "vibrating" in my hands when i stop riding on the alloy frame!

I never realised how much more compliant my carbon frame is, its only a basic Wilier XP frame, but even on firm worn 23c tyres it soaks up road imperfections really well, feels really "solid" on the road and comfortable over poor surfaces. My Alloy frame is really bouncy and buzzy, Ive had a few alloy road bikes and they have been similar

I'm not knocking Alloy, on smooth nice roads, like for example you get in warmer climates they would be great, often the issues in the UK are that horrible top layer dressing they put on roads, which then gets broken away

I also have a steel road bike, which again is different

You can fit bigger/softwer tyres and better bar tape to help

After all that I really like my new Alloy frame, I just find for me my carbon bike seems more suitable for British roads March - October, during the winter I use my steel frame as I can bend the frame back when I crash it!

[PorkRind]

Thanks for your input, that makes sense re alloy being buzzy.. I think I need to borrow my cousins Specialised alloy road bike to get an idea as to how buzzy it is compared to my carbon.

[Big Rod]

I'm your weight and I've just bought a full carbon bike and am gobsmacked at how smooth it is compared to my alloy cross bike.

It's a Trek with some kind'a ISO-Speed thing built into the frame so it's intended to be flexible.

I don't think it's that much lighter and it sounds funny but it makes riding the crappy roads around here more than bearable.

[Matt_N]

Carbon fibre inherently dampens noise, vibration and harshness as a core material property so it's no surprise most CF bikes ride smoother than alloy, a lot of alloy bikes will come with a CF fork for this reason.

Comparing a CX bike is not really apples for apples either as they have quite different geometry to a normal road bike.

The same can be said for one bike to another, a lot of how a bike feels will come from the contact points, so tyres and tubes which make a big difference, then bars, stem and seat post and even tape. My Colnago Dream has big fat stays and tube diameters, it is a harsh but very direct ride, I'm sure I could dance it down a bit with CF finishing kit but that would cost £500-600 for decent stuff!

[47p2]

Treat yourself to a nice steel frame, buttery smooth over rough surfaces

[Big Rod]

swerni said:

You should try steel or titanium, you'll realise just how crap carbon is on our roads.
I sold my only carbon bike as I hated the harsh ride and buzziness.
All my bikes are now steel or Ti

Well, I'm only a year into this 'serious' riding thing so I'm still feeling my way.

I like the carbon bike a lot even though I hadn't actually considered a carbon bike before due to my heft.

I appreciate that there may be better alternatives but the carbon frame is a revelation to me right now.

[TwistingMyMelon]

Ive got a Steel bike and TBH I prefer my Carbon frame!

[Barchettaman]

Matt_N said:

Comparing a CX bike is not really apples for apples either as they have quite different geometry to a normal road bike.

This is incorrect. The geometry differences are generally minor, with a few exceptions (the Ti Pickenflick has a very slack HT angle, for example)

[Matt_N]

Barchettaman said:

This is incorrect. The geometry differences are generally minor, with a few exceptions (the Ti Pickenflick has a very slack HT angle, for example)

CX bikes generally have longer wheelbases, higher bottom brackets, longer chainstays, and slacker headtube angles than road bikes do, that's quite different in my view.

[snotrag]

Matt_N said:

Barchettaman said:

This is incorrect. The geometry differences are generally minor, with a few exceptions (the Ti Pickenflick has a very slack HT angle, for example)

CX bikes generally have longer wheelbases, higher bottom brackets, longer chainstays, and slacker headtube angles than road bikes do, that's quite different in my view.

Agreed. There are many differences between a proper CX bike and a proper road ('race') bike.

[Barchettaman]

Matt_N said:

CX bikes generally have longer wheelbases, higher bottom brackets, longer chainstays, and slacker headtube angles than road bikes do, that's quite different in my view.

Well, they maybe had a bigger bottom bracket drop ´back in the day´ when riders used toeclips, but that difference has closed up massively these days.

Wheelbase and chainstays are slightly longer - to accommodate CX tyres, but this doesn´t really change effective geometry.

HT angles will maybe be a 1° difference, but (as I´m sure you know) HTA is just one part of how the steering ´feels´, as fork offset and trail are also part of that ´system´.

The geometry differences are minor and anyone riding a CX bike back-to-back with a road bike, shod with similar-sized road rubber, would be hard pressed to tell the difference.

Have a great afternoon!

[Big Rod]

Barchettaman said:

Well, they maybe had a bigger bottom bracket drop ´back in the day´ when riders used toeclips, but that difference has closed up massively these days.

Wheelbase and chainstays are slightly longer - to accommodate CX tyres, but this doesn´t really change effective geometry.

HT angles will maybe be a 1° difference, but (as I´m sure you know) HTA is just one part of how the steering ´feels´, as fork offset and trail are also part of that ´system´.

The geometry differences are minor and anyone riding a CX bike back-to-back with a road bike, shod with similar-sized road rubber, would be hard pressed to tell the difference.

Have a great afternoon!

Not meaning to be argumentative but I did't think I'd notice much a difference but they do ride considerably differently.

Came as quite a surprise.

[Barchettaman]

Big Rod said:

Not meaning to be argumentative but I did't think I'd notice much a difference but they do ride considerably differently.

Came as quite a surprise.

Just a discussion, really.

My Quantec Race CX bike rides and handles like any other aluminium-framed road bike I´ve had, not surprising really as its geometry is very similar to road geometry, like the majority of CX bikes. Obviously there are ´outliers´ and YMMV.



Apologies for the crappy pic.

I also have two hybrids that I have converted to drop-bar commuters. Their steering response is quite different, they´re slower and more stable (not that this is a bad thing!)

[Jimbo.]

PorkRind said:

Has anyone recently noticed the trend in road race / endurance bikes going towards Alloy instead of carbon? I've seen some glowing reports on the caad12 / specialized bikes and thinking that instead of getting a carbon frame (as a larger guy 17st) it'd be more beneficial and easier going on the bike to stick to alloy, or do carbon frames have the strength to put up with that sort of frame?

I only ask as my Bianchi c-tech carbon frame is starting to show some worrying signs, - paint cracking around the seat stay alloy inserts and am reevaluating what materials best for me !

Any trend you're noticing (can't say I have) could well be to manufacturers wanting to expand their range and offer cheaper bikes. There's nothing wrong with CF. I'll be find for what you need. Wheel strength, tyre size, tyre pressures, the length of your hair and the colour of your shorts matters more here than what the frame is made out of. The testing the frames go through in order to be approved for sale will make your eyes water...

[PorkRind]

Jimbo. said:

Any trend you're noticing (can't say I have) could well be to manufacturers wanting to expand their range and offer cheaper bikes. There's nothing wrong with CF. I'll be find for what you need. Wheel strength, tyre size, tyre pressures, the length of your hair and the colour of your shorts matters more here than what the frame is made out of. The testing the frames go through in order to be approved for sale will make your eyes water...

OK, good points.

Based purely on looks, i want either a Oltre Xr1 or a BMC roadmachine, in green !