Kitchen Knife Set and Sharpener
Discussion
Spending more time prepping food & would like to get a decent set of knives & a sharpener.
The best knife I have by far is an old Sabatier Chefs Knife (30 yrs old) but I broke the tip off earlier this year doing something stupid.
The others (all cheap supermarket specials) seem impossible for me to sharpen.
I have one of those knife sharpeners with two slots (one ceramic) but it is useless. The other is a trad steel on which the Sabatier seems to sharpen ok, but also seems to blunt quickly.
May look to buy separately and/or wait for the right bargain.
So please post your suggestions
The best knife I have by far is an old Sabatier Chefs Knife (30 yrs old) but I broke the tip off earlier this year doing something stupid.
The others (all cheap supermarket specials) seem impossible for me to sharpen.
I have one of those knife sharpeners with two slots (one ceramic) but it is useless. The other is a trad steel on which the Sabatier seems to sharpen ok, but also seems to blunt quickly.
May look to buy separately and/or wait for the right bargain.
So please post your suggestions
If you are prepared to look after them and want something that you can keep a really good edge on, consider carbon steel rather than stainless.
We bought knives last time we were back in Japan. As long as you dry them after use they are not too difficult to care for - but can't be left damp/dirty in the way a stainless steel knife can be.
We bought knives last time we were back in Japan. As long as you dry them after use they are not too difficult to care for - but can't be left damp/dirty in the way a stainless steel knife can be.
smifffymoto said:
Over the years we have had Sabatier,Wusthoff and a few others.Last year we bought some cheap,25Euro each Victorinox knives with bright coloured plastic handles,the sort found in abatoirs.Quite frankly they are fantastic,very sharp,easy to keep sharp and light to use.
Good advice. We use these in food factories, it's what you want if you want a knife as a tool and not a status symbol to fit in your £40k Smallbone of Devizes kitchen.Smiler. said:
Spending more time prepping food & would like to get a decent set of knives & a sharpener.
The best knife I have by far is an old Sabatier Chefs Knife (30 yrs old) but I broke the tip off earlier this year doing something stupid.
That's OK, you can fix this with a stone.The best knife I have by far is an old Sabatier Chefs Knife (30 yrs old) but I broke the tip off earlier this year doing something stupid.
Smiler. said:
The others (all cheap supermarket specials) seem impossible for me to sharpen.
Because they are made very hard so they keep an edge. But they are very hard to sharpen unless you have a diamond hone.Smiler. said:
I have one of those knife sharpeners with two slots (one ceramic) but it is useless. The other is a trad steel on which the Sabatier seems to sharpen ok, but also seems to blunt quickly.
Sabatiers are made of soft steel. Easy to sharpen, but quick to go blunt.tokyo_mb said:
If you are prepared to look after them and want something that you can keep a really good edge on, consider carbon steel rather than stainless.
We bought knives last time we were back in Japan. As long as you dry them after use they are not too difficult to care for - but can't be left damp/dirty in the way a stainless steel knife can be.
Modern surgical stainless steel takes just as good an edge as carbon steel IME. They are bloody hard work to live with, however careful you are one day someone will leave it on a damp draining board and you will have a black, rusty blade. It's not worth the pain.We bought knives last time we were back in Japan. As long as you dry them after use they are not too difficult to care for - but can't be left damp/dirty in the way a stainless steel knife can be.
I would avoid Global. They are bone hard and a pig to sharpen even if you do have a diamond hone and know how to use it. They keep an edge but that's the only advantage. They are also bloody expensive. They look fantastic though.
I have this Victorinox set https://www.amazon.co.uk/Victorinox-Cutlery-Knife-...
I have had them for over 10 years and they're still great.
I have had them for over 10 years and they're still great.
Victorinox are awesome,
You don't need many knives, maybe 4 at most, chefs knife, bread knife, paring knife and a boning knife (for clarity, used for preparing meat thats on the bone), plus a steel and a wet stone. I have allsorts of knives, only ever use the same ones.
start with https://www.amazon.co.uk/Victorinox-Chefs-Knife-Br...
and build on it.
You don't need many knives, maybe 4 at most, chefs knife, bread knife, paring knife and a boning knife (for clarity, used for preparing meat thats on the bone), plus a steel and a wet stone. I have allsorts of knives, only ever use the same ones.
start with https://www.amazon.co.uk/Victorinox-Chefs-Knife-Br...
and build on it.
Edited by Foliage on Wednesday 2nd November 16:54
Edited by Foliage on Wednesday 2nd November 16:59
Sabatier isn’t a registered brand name and is used by lots of kitchen knife manufacturers. Most people think it’s a mark of a high-quality knife but the name is not protected so whilst you may get a great knife made in France you’re just as likely to get a cheap mass-produced product of poor quality from anywhere.
Carbon steel taints certain foods, I'd avoid it. Well ground, low alloy stainless will take practically as good of an edge, good enough for the vast majority of people.
The Victorinox range are not pretty and feel a bit cheap but they are good knives.
The Eden knives are popular - http://www.knivesandtools.co.uk/en/ct/eden-quality...
Not sure who found Global to be particularly difficult to sharpen as they're not, hardness isn't the same as wear resistant. I like them but not everyone gets on with the ergonomics.
Steels don't really sharpen but realign the edge so not surprised you find the effects short lives. There are stones on the knives and tools website, it's a skill that takes a little practise but is not enormously difficult. I wouldn't worry about getting something with an enormously high grit. Maybe 600/1000 or something as a combination.
The Victorinox range are not pretty and feel a bit cheap but they are good knives.
The Eden knives are popular - http://www.knivesandtools.co.uk/en/ct/eden-quality...
Not sure who found Global to be particularly difficult to sharpen as they're not, hardness isn't the same as wear resistant. I like them but not everyone gets on with the ergonomics.
Steels don't really sharpen but realign the edge so not surprised you find the effects short lives. There are stones on the knives and tools website, it's a skill that takes a little practise but is not enormously difficult. I wouldn't worry about getting something with an enormously high grit. Maybe 600/1000 or something as a combination.
Edited by gregs656 on Wednesday 2nd November 17:43
Thanks for the replies folks, some interesting points made.
Budget is flexible. Not sure how easy try before buy will be but depends on recommended brands & availability in local shops.
I'm fine with buying separately & even different brands, would rather spend more on a single knife & wait to add another.
Will check out those brands mentioned here after posting this.
I should also add that post illness last year, I've lost a fair degree of dexterity so the ergonomics of the knives I choose are somewhat more important.
Because of the selection of chefs knives mentioned earlier, I know what is good & what is bad from that perspective.
Interesting to read about the type of steel & the hardness, edge & sharpness. The Sabatiers that I currently have were from Boots & they never go in the dishwasher. I've read somewhere that dishwashers shag decent blades. Rust stains show on the cheap stainless knives I have now.
Right, onto sharpening. I have a flat, rectangular stone which I have tried to use a few times but with poor success. I expect that will be down to poor technique though.
Any recommendations for online guides to sharpening with both steel & stone?
Off now to peruse your suggestions.
Budget is flexible. Not sure how easy try before buy will be but depends on recommended brands & availability in local shops.
I'm fine with buying separately & even different brands, would rather spend more on a single knife & wait to add another.
Will check out those brands mentioned here after posting this.
I should also add that post illness last year, I've lost a fair degree of dexterity so the ergonomics of the knives I choose are somewhat more important.
Because of the selection of chefs knives mentioned earlier, I know what is good & what is bad from that perspective.
Interesting to read about the type of steel & the hardness, edge & sharpness. The Sabatiers that I currently have were from Boots & they never go in the dishwasher. I've read somewhere that dishwashers shag decent blades. Rust stains show on the cheap stainless knives I have now.
Right, onto sharpening. I have a flat, rectangular stone which I have tried to use a few times but with poor success. I expect that will be down to poor technique though.
Any recommendations for online guides to sharpening with both steel & stone?
Off now to peruse your suggestions.
Smiler. said:
Right, onto sharpening. I have a flat, rectangular stone which I have tried to use a few times but with poor success. I expect that will be down to poor technique though.
Any recommendations for online guides to sharpening with both steel & stone?
Ray Mears has a YouTube video that is worth watching. He explains sharpening angles well. He does get a bit confused at the end, having spent a lot of effort to generate a polished edge he then turns it back to a ground edge, which is in some ways a retrograde step. Have a think about a polished edge vs ground, you'll understand that a polished edge is what you want for a razor or a butchery knife, but a ground edge is better for vegetables and general use. If you want a ground edge there is little point in polishing it out first.Any recommendations for online guides to sharpening with both steel & stone?
There is YouTube stuff with people polishing edges on old cardboard. It works really well.
I am a keen home cook, and prepare all our meals from scratch. I use two types of knives (I have never bought a set).
My main 'chef's' knife, vegetable knife, and paring knife are plain blades. Baring accidents these are all easily brought back to sharpness with a butcher's steel. In extreme cases, where the blade is damaged, I have reground back to shape using a rotary grinder. You do not need to polish the blade edge or anything like that. I also have a cheap cleaver, which works OK but frankly doesn't get used a huge amount, except for carcass work.
I also have a proper bread knife with big serrations, and a Richardson 7" knife with micro serrations which I use for cutting tomatoes and similar things with soft skins. I have never sharpened this in 15 years, but it does always get put away in a plastic sheath. Don't use any type of serrated blade on raw meat, it just tears the cut surface.
My favourite is an unbranded all stainless chef's knife which I bought over 10 years ago from TK Max. It has great balance, holds an edge well, and because the blade and handle are all one peice stainless, will probably last longer than I have a need for it. In TK Max I didn't get a chance to try before I bought, but at a tenner it was worth the risk.
There's a lot of hocus-pocus and willy waving about knives. Some of the most expensive are more fashion items than tools, stainless is fine, and easier to look after. You won't need a stone.
My main 'chef's' knife, vegetable knife, and paring knife are plain blades. Baring accidents these are all easily brought back to sharpness with a butcher's steel. In extreme cases, where the blade is damaged, I have reground back to shape using a rotary grinder. You do not need to polish the blade edge or anything like that. I also have a cheap cleaver, which works OK but frankly doesn't get used a huge amount, except for carcass work.
I also have a proper bread knife with big serrations, and a Richardson 7" knife with micro serrations which I use for cutting tomatoes and similar things with soft skins. I have never sharpened this in 15 years, but it does always get put away in a plastic sheath. Don't use any type of serrated blade on raw meat, it just tears the cut surface.
My favourite is an unbranded all stainless chef's knife which I bought over 10 years ago from TK Max. It has great balance, holds an edge well, and because the blade and handle are all one peice stainless, will probably last longer than I have a need for it. In TK Max I didn't get a chance to try before I bought, but at a tenner it was worth the risk.
There's a lot of hocus-pocus and willy waving about knives. Some of the most expensive are more fashion items than tools, stainless is fine, and easier to look after. You won't need a stone.
Mino Sharp make good sharpeners.
I have some ss Sabatier knives that are 30 years old, but they are quite tricky to sharpen even with mini sharp. I also have a cheap set of Japanese style knives which take and hold an edge very well, especially the long slim chefs knife and the santoku knife. The latter I use all of the time
I have some ss Sabatier knives that are 30 years old, but they are quite tricky to sharpen even with mini sharp. I also have a cheap set of Japanese style knives which take and hold an edge very well, especially the long slim chefs knife and the santoku knife. The latter I use all of the time
I have a set of ceramic knifes from a French supermarket (have seen similar in Aldi or Lidl) and they're superb for slicing anything without a hard object in them, one has chipped when using on meat with the bone in. But they where cheap and I'm considering disposable when they're blunt/chipped/stained. I can make the thinnest slices of even an over ripe tomato with them.
I love Japanese style knives - and fully admit it's as much about the aesthetic: I just love using them. But mine (various brands) have lasted for years with care.
Recent addition was this. Actually made in China. It is fantastic. Not cheap, but a lovely thing for poncing around the kitchen with.
Mind you, I am someone who also chose white marble for an island worktop, so place a high value on aesthetics, even if they hamper practicality.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0110EKTUU/ref...
So yeah, buy a Victorinox, basically. But the feel of a nice knife in your hand, when cooking - I pay the extra for that.
Recent addition was this. Actually made in China. It is fantastic. Not cheap, but a lovely thing for poncing around the kitchen with.
Mind you, I am someone who also chose white marble for an island worktop, so place a high value on aesthetics, even if they hamper practicality.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0110EKTUU/ref...
So yeah, buy a Victorinox, basically. But the feel of a nice knife in your hand, when cooking - I pay the extra for that.
Smiler. said:
I should also add that post illness last year, I've lost a fair degree of dexterity so the ergonomics of the knives I choose are somewhat more important.
Right, onto sharpening. I have a flat, rectangular stone which I have tried to use a few times but with poor success. I expect that will be down to poor technique though.
I think you may find the utilitarian grips on the larger Victorinox knives suitable if you have lost a bit of dexterity, but their paring knife has quite a small handle. Right, onto sharpening. I have a flat, rectangular stone which I have tried to use a few times but with poor success. I expect that will be down to poor technique though.
Any idea at all on what grit it is? If it is a very low grit for garden tools or something then it may do more harm than good.
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