What is the Aston Martin Vantage's flappy paddle like?

[BakerBoy3000]

Today whilst at school my mate collard me, the conversation went as follows:
'Hey James, my Dad has bought a V8 Vantage!'
'Awesome!' i said 'what's the age and gearbox?'
'oh its 2008 and the flappy paddle'
'NOOOOO! The awful Sportshift, eurgh isnt it horribly slow!'
I now come to think, was I right to acuse the 'box of such faults or is it actually quite good?
Obviously the manual is better, but whats it like as an auto?
Thanks,
James

Edited by BakerBoy3000 on Friday 11th November 23:09

[JetskiJezz]

Honest answer - it's awful, no other word for it.

I drove a 2008 vantage roadster. I was given the keys and given the car for an extended test drive - 30 mins later I returned it.......
A friend has just got,(this week) a v12 vantage S with the sports shift 3, again I was handed the keys - to my horror it was still awful - how to kill a great car.

This is from a man who has owned and been happy with M3s with SMGs (E46 and E90) and Porsche DSGs, but the Aston box just feels bad.

[CSK1]

This has been discussed in numerous threads, the more recent one today: http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...

[chuds285]

I would have had it straight back to the dealer for a software update. I have owned a Manual Vantage and two sportshifts and in my humble opinion there is no comparison. Of course it's not a automatic, it's jerky in town and the earlier s/s is a bit of a pain at slow speeds but get it on the open road it's a whole world of difference.

The later version is great and does exactly what I ask it to do, and as a bonus I do not get a stiff left leg! For me the sportshift is the way to go!

Ian.

[JKay]

Marmite

Some hate it some love it.

I like it, lift off the accelerator when you change gear and it's lovely, smooth as.

Nothing like a seamless twin clutch like in a Huracan ....

[JKay]

JetskiJezz said:

Honest answer - it's awful, no other word for it.

I drove a 2008 vantage roadster. I was given the keys and given the car for an extended test drive - 30 mins later I returned it.......
A friend has just got,(this week) a v12 vantage S with the sports shift 3, again I was handed the keys - to my horror it was still awful - how to kill a great car.

This is from a man who has owned and been happy with M3s with SMGs (E46 and E90) and Porsche DSGs, but the Aston box just feels bad.

The E90 series (M cars) and Porsches have twin clutch systems, totally totally Different to the astons hydraulically actuated manual

[JetskiJezz]

JKay said:

The E90 series (M cars) and Porsches have twin clutch systems, totally totally Different to the astons hydraulically actuated manual

I guess that's why they feel totally different. I just don't think they feel comfortable in anyway regardless of how are you liftoff throttle or with you manually change with the paddles all the gearbox do it own thing.

Like everything in life, everyone has their own opinion on these things and mine is that I wouldn't touch one with a bargepole.
I remember however when I owned my first E46 SMG twin clutch system I had driven the manual and the paddle shift back to back and struggled to decide which one I preferred as both have their own merits. In the end I had 12 months with a paddle shift and then 12 months with a manual and loved both.
I remember having a long conversation with the guy in the pub who had a very strong opinion about how a paddle shift gearbox was awful idea and were terrible to drive, when I asked if you driven one, it turns out that he didn't even have a driving license........

[J12KJR]

As has been said we all have our own opinion the sport shift box personally I like it and I have had all 3 versions.
I actually thought SSII was the best as it required more interaction to get a good shift, SSIII is almost too good for me but I love the V12S for its engine etc so it gets forgiven.
IMHO AM should never have put the "D" button on the SS cars as it gives the impression you will get slush box changes which is so far from the case.
Having had 2 PDK equipped cars, 981S & 991C4S as well as a daily driver with a twin clutch box I prefer the SS box. PDK/twin clutch boxes feel too smooth for me personally but each to their own.
I don't however see the point in saying that the twin clutch boxes are crap just because they don't suit me.

[JKay]

JetskiJezz said:

I guess that's why they feel totally different. I just don't think they feel comfortable in anyway regardless of how are you liftoff throttle or with you manually change with the paddles all the gearbox do it own thing.

Like everything in life, everyone has their own opinion on these things and mine is that I wouldn't touch one with a bargepole.

Totally agree. The Aston SS isn't for everyone and I can totally understand why. Plus the world would be a boring place if we all liked the same thing wouldn't it

[JKay]

J12KJR said:

.
Having had 2 PDK equipped cars, 981S & 991C4S as well as a daily driver with a twin clutch box I prefer the SS box. PDK/twin clutch boxes feel too smooth for me personally but each to their own.
I don't however see the point in saying that the twin clutch boxes are crap just because they don't suit me.

I too EnJoy the "engagement" required with the SS on the Aston. Makes me have to do a little work to get it right and it's rewarding. I couldn't find a manual car which ticked all my boxes which is why I opted For a SS and I couldn't be happier

[V8Staffie]

I drove an SS1 and opted for a 911 C4S which was great but I found it a bit soulless and the affair lasted 6 months.
Had 2 Vantage V8's SS2 and once I had been shown to drive them to their strengths was hooked. Curling that big toe on the accelerator is all it took. Never use the D button either and get the fuse 15 bypass switch fitted and all is great.
V8 went in for a service and was given a V12S Roadster for a week! I will let you fill in the gaps what happened next! I was warned! Never listened and was in my own V12 S Roadster inside 4 weeks. SS3 is a huge improvement on SS2 and will defend the sport shift gearbox all the time. Then I picked up my manual GT8 yesterday and the experience has shifted my thinking again. Not too one is better than the other but they are just different I don't find them as clinical as other boxes but I don't want that. I am looking forward to getting both on track next year and will be interesting to see which one I post the best times in?

[BamfordMike]

V8Staffie said:

I am looking forward to getting both on track next year and will be interesting to see which one I post the best times in?

In the hands of a pro in GT4 the manual is quicker on account the inevitable ASM miss shift ruining a lap time and often not being able to ram it in the gear wanted because of software limiting 'ramming into gear' at too high rpm like can be done in manual. In hands of non pro the ASM will be quicker because the driver doesn't have to think about gear changing and can focus on other race craft

[BamfordMike]

JetskiJezz said:

I guess that's why they feel totally different. I just don't think they feel comfortable in anyway regardless of how are you liftoff throttle or with you manually change with the paddles

.... I wouldn't touch one with a bargepole.

Mini Metro CVT is a gearbox not to touch with bargepole, SS1 Aston ASM isn't quite that, but it has foibles, which can be tweaked or lived with, it certainly is not don't touch with bargepole territory and even considering foibles, shouldn't be labelled as such.

[HBradley]

Sportshift is a 'box you have to learn how to use properly, getting better every time you drive it, that's the fun. When you've cracked it it rewards in spades! Want lightning shifts without any thought, buy a DSG Audi or a PDK Porsche.

[Jon39]

If any Sportshift 1 buyers were like me, at the very start of my Aston Martin journey, they might have chosen the SS option with little knowledge of the subject.

I thought the paddles were very cool, just like a Formula One car, and those always change gear quickly. How little I knew. DSG, twin clutch, etc., I had never heard of all that.

After looking at a few Vantage reviews, I was surprised to repeatedly hear, "Buy the manual". That was the clue for me, to think more and try to understand what these paddle shift systems really are.

I eventually bought a manual car, and after five years am quite happy with my choice.

Shiny sports cars, a showroom and lack of knowledge, - well you know.

Edited by Jon39 on Saturday 12th November 15:05

[Brital]

It's like driving most other good cars properly. Be sensitive and aware, learn and adapt your technique to the car and it is usually very rewarding. Endless debate on forums about the original NP Vanquish paddle shift. Go about it like a bull in a china shop and assume one technique fits all (a la Clarkson) and you will be disappointed. It's no different to adapting to the narrow gate say on a manual Ferrari or hustling a DB4 around Goodwood with no power steering. Once you've gotten used to it, it is usually great. These cars have all been extensively tested by well qualified drivers be fore they hit the streets remember. I think it was Octane that suggested a survey to see what the correlation was between men who were unadaptive in how they drove different cars and divorce rates because they were as unadaptive in how they made love! Perhaps it's a good thing we haven't yet got speaking cars - or a new stat for data logging - or some flappy paddles might not be getting up the creek!!

[Evocati443]

BamfordMike said:

V8Staffie said:

I am looking forward to getting both on track next year and will be interesting to see which one I post the best times in?

In the hands of a pro in GT4 the manual is quicker on account the inevitable ASM miss shift ruining a lap time and often not being able to ram it in the gear wanted because of software limiting 'ramming into gear' at too high rpm like can be done in manual. In hands of non pro the ASM will be quicker because the driver doesn't have to think about gear changing and can focus on other race craft

can you explain what you mean by this? I believe I am experiencing similar thing. 2009 Vantage ASM1 here. just got the car 3 months ago and put about 2500 miles on it already. I noticed that the car's upshift is wonky above 6K rpm. anything 6K and below shifts pretty consistently fast like around half second to 3/4 of a second or so (I am just estimating here). but at about 6500 rpm and above sometimes it's fast but other times it has a short delay, so takes up to a full second. for a while I thought maybe the RPM was falling beyond the normal realm, so I did countless tests and 2nd to 3rd and 3rd to 4th rpm needle all fall roughly about 1500rpm, so it's pretty consistently normal. so it just seems that sometimes the RPM falls slower than usual when you're above 6K, so if you're unlucky to hit that unusual delay, you get that slamming thrust gear engagement after you have already floored the pedal and the car catches up and thrusts you forward.

(clutch seems to be fine, engagement is smooth, and no slip when flooring in low speed high gear, daily multiple clutch learns).

[dalecan]

I've always been a manual guy. However, my V8VS has the sportshift II and I love it.

[nickv8]

Good thread.

Just trading my manual V8V to a 2016 Sportshift V8VS because my left shoulder isn’t man enough

Have always hated the thought of autos mainly from experiences of driving in the US and waiting... waiting... for shifts to take place. Slightly unfair as hire cars aren’t exactly like for like what we’re talking about here.

Lumped for the SS as there wasn’t much choice. I wanted to stay with the V8 Vantage.

But after the test drive, I found it a revelation! Shifts were very smooth when driving normally. When pressing on, they were more theatrical, especially downshifts.

The best bit is that it will take some skill and time to finess a technique to get the best from it. Sounds like it suits the Vantage!

AM got so much stick regarding the Vantage’s SS in the press, I’d like to give it some months and write what I think later as a newbie to the SS.

[Evocati443]

macdeb said:

Evocati443 said:

can you explain what you mean by this? I believe I am experiencing similar thing. 2009 Vantage ASM1 here. just got the car 3 months ago and put about 2500 miles on it already. I noticed that the car's upshift is wonky above 6K rpm. anything 6K and below shifts pretty consistently fast like around half second to 3/4 of a second or so (I am just estimating here). but at about 6500 rpm and above sometimes it's fast but other times it has a short delay, so takes up to a full second. for a while I thought maybe the RPM was falling beyond the normal realm, so I did countless tests and 2nd to 3rd and 3rd to 4th rpm needle all fall roughly about 1500rpm, so it's pretty consistently normal. so it just seems that sometimes the RPM falls slower than usual when you're above 6K, so if you're unlucky to hit that unusual delay, you get that slamming thrust gear engagement after you have already floored the pedal and the car catches up and thrusts you forward.

(clutch seems to be fine, engagement is smooth, and no slip when flooring in low speed high gear, daily multiple clutch learns).

When you change those high revs', are you lifting the throttle? As for quick shifts you need 90% throttle or so I'm lead to believe and it works for me.

yeah i am always lifting when i shift. i tried hypershift, it only works well up to about 5500rpm. after that ASM 1 doesn't cut throttle when you flip the paddle, so you could be flooring the gas at 7K, and it just bounces off the rev limiter up and down until you let off the throttle. with ASM 2 i know it cuts throttle the moment the + shift paddle is flipped, so no need to lift the accelerator peddle. hence some folks mentioned that ASM 2 is preferred because it always allow you to do full throttle shift at whatever RPM. but i am more concerned about what MIke meant when he said it that at high rpm the computer doesn't like you jamming the gear.