Distance selling / right to cancel

[Phateuk]

Hi,

I recently signed up for a conveyancer service which was recommended by the estate agent selling the property I've buying. The initial form a filled out was very confusing with the pricing, but as I thought I would be dealing with their in house lawyer it would make the purchase of my first house simple.

On Monday (30th) the documents came through with an exact price, I also realised it was just a remote online company (not the estate agents employee), which the estate agent obviously gets commission from referring. Having looked online the cost was almost double the average of other companies (£1900 rather than £1000) so I want to move to a different conveyancer.

In the documents sent to me there's a right to cancel section which states I can send them a letter or email within 14 days and receive all money back, even for items described as non refundable.

Yesterday I did this (2nd), didn't get a response. Today I spoke to them on the phone and was told because they already carried out searches I have to pay £400 to cover this (which has already been taken from my credit card).

They forwarded the searches results and said i can keep them, they are all dated yesterday which makes me think they saw my email and still did them anyway to try and now keep my money.

Help?

[catman]

If you have 14 days to cancel, they'd have a hard time in court enforcing that.

Tim

[Phateuk]

I've sent them an email reminding them of the 14 days, I don't want to do anything via phone so it all stays in writing. I'm guessing they're just trying it on, but it's a bit concerning nonetheless.

[herewego]

If the 14 days applies then it means they would not be able to start for 14 days. Are you sure you didn't sign a waiver?

[Phateuk]

herewego said:

If the 14 days applies then it means they would not be able to start for 14 days. Are you sure you didn't sign a waiver?

I didn't get a copy of the initial form, he estate agent has this - I'm going there to pick this up tomorrow.

If the cancellation option didn't apply would it still be inclued in the docs I received? Is it possible to sign away those rights? I was under the impression that's part of consumer rights in general not just this specific contract?

[herewego]

http://www.which.co.uk/consumer-rights/advice/how-...

[PorkInsider]

The conveyancing solicitor I used last year insisted that they wouldn't start work until 14 days after I contracted them as I could cancel during that period and be entitled to a refund.

I had to put in writing that I waived the 14 day cooling off period as I was in a rush and wanted them to start work immediately.

Did this conveyancing service you're using perhaps manage to get you to accidentally waive your rights with regard to cooling off?

ETA: just realised I've pretty much said the same as herewego.

Edited by PorkInsider on Saturday 4th February 09:51

[Phateuk]

Thank's for the replies, I went to the EA today to pick up the carbon copy of what we signed. The person we're dealing with wasn't there but they gave me a blank copy. I'll scan that in if it helps me. I'm still waiting for a response from my email.

It says clearly on the form that we can cancel within 7 days and get all money back which it was only 4 days.

I'm suprised they debited 400 from my card the day we signed, the new solicitor had a statement like above where we explicitly have to sign away our 14 day rights else they don't carry out any work until that time has expired.

I'm struggling to see a scenario other than, Monday receive application form,instantly charge 400 to card (form stated only 60 initial fee). Thurs receive email from me to cancel, ignore email and quickly apply for searches (all searches dated Thursday), Friday respond to my second email chasing up a reply stating the 400 has "been spent" as the searches have already been done.

[Phateuk]

Here's both sides of the form we filled out. I really appreciate any advice This is the only thing we've sent to them. The bold sentence above the signature fields on the bottom of page one suggests we should get all money back as it's still within 7 days?

Front:


Back:

[s55shh]

Countrywide are owned by Bridgefords aren't they. Tried giving me the hard sell years ago.

[PorkInsider]

It appears to say, quite clearly that you'll be refunded. Not sure how they could refuse, given your automatic rights and what's written in their contract.

[Tom_C76]

I suspect the 60 quid fee is refundable, but the disbursements for searches aren't. Which would seem reasonable as they have to pay out for them.

[ou sont les biscuits]

Tom_C76 said:

I suspect the 60 quid fee is refundable, but the disbursements for searches aren't. Which would seem reasonable as they have to pay out for them.

But that isn't an issue surely, as the search results can be sent on to whichever firm of solicitors or conveyancers the OP chooses in the end. You need to pay for the searches whatever happens.. Unless you are not having a mortgage and feel brave

Edited to add that when we went through all this last year, the solicitor we used didn't shell out anything for things like searches, management packs, whatever, until we had put them in funds first.

Edited by ou sont les biscuits on Sunday 5th February 14:48

[Tom_C76]

OP says they've given him copies of searches, and giving a debit card authorisation does put them in funds. He's been charged for the searches he's been given and can forward them to his new chosen conveyancer.

[anonymous-user]

Shouldn't be an issue, the cost of the searches just gets passed on to you whatever happens and is separate to the rest of the fees. Just let your new solicitors know the searches are done and forward them on - job done, you won't be charged for them again.

Is this a sale and purchase or just one side of the transaction? I ask because £1000 seems very cheap for a sale and purchase combined, just be careful you don't end up getting some useless box ticker. Conveyancing has become just another commodity purchase but if you have a crap solicitor it's extremely stressful, personally I'd go on recommendations not price.

[Phateuk]

ou sont les biscuits said:

Tom_C76 said:

I suspect the 60 quid fee is refundable, but the disbursements for searches aren't. Which would seem reasonable as they have to pay out for them.

But that isn't an issue surely, as the search results can be sent on to whichever firm of solicitors or conveyancers the OP chooses in the end. You need to pay for the searches whatever happens.. Unless you are not having a mortgage and feel brave

Edited to add that when we went through all this last year, the solicitor we used didn't shell out anything for things like searches, management packs, whatever, until we had put them in funds first.

Edited by ou sont les biscuits on Sunday 5th February 14:48

I realise the searches can be sent to our next solicitors, my issue is I believe they carried these out *after* I emailed to cancel so they could attempt to keep the money. Also, they charged 400 for these searches where my next one chargers 250, so I'm down 150, not the end of the world but I do feel like from the documents, plus the distance selling laws that I'm entitled to that money back either way?

[Phateuk]

charltjr said:

Shouldn't be an issue, the cost of the searches just gets passed on to you whatever happens and is separate to the rest of the fees. Just let your new solicitors know the searches are done and forward them on - job done, you won't be charged for them again.

Is this a sale and purchase or just one side of the transaction? I ask because £1000 seems very cheap for a sale and purchase combined, just be careful you don't end up getting some useless box ticker. Conveyancing has become just another commodity purchase but if you have a crap solicitor it's extremely stressful, personally I'd go on recommendations not price.

It's purchase only, the numbers I posted exclude a couple of the items which are standard, the total price inc SDLT was ~£6900 with countrywide, and ~£6000 with the new company.

In terms of recommendations, a friend warned me against countrywide (after I'd signed up) as he was similarly "recommended" them by an estate agent and they turned out to be awful. All the EA wants is their £200 referal money

[ou sont les biscuits]

Phateuk said:

ou sont les biscuits said:

Tom_C76 said:

I suspect the 60 quid fee is refundable, but the disbursements for searches aren't. Which would seem reasonable as they have to pay out for them.

But that isn't an issue surely, as the search results can be sent on to whichever firm of solicitors or conveyancers the OP chooses in the end. You need to pay for the searches whatever happens.. Unless you are not having a mortgage and feel brave

Edited to add that when we went through all this last year, the solicitor we used didn't shell out anything for things like searches, management packs, whatever, until we had put them in funds first.

Edited by ou sont les biscuits on Sunday 5th February 14:48

I realise the searches can be sent to our next solicitors, my issue is I believe they carried these out *after* I emailed to cancel so they could attempt to keep the money. Also, they charged 400 for these searches where my next one chargers 250, so I'm down 150, not the end of the world but I do feel like from the documents, plus the distance selling laws that I'm entitled to that money back either way?

I'm no expert on this - only as a recent end user of a conveyancer - but the cost for the searches is fixed by the local authority or other entities providing them, and all the solicitors do is to pass on the cost that they get charged. There is (AFAIK) no profit element in the charge for the conveyancer.

There are different kinds of searches though - local authority, water etc etc and they are all paid for separately. So the difference between the two numbers you have might be down to one including more searches than the other. It should be easy enough to check though - you have the searches from the first firm, so you can see what is there, then make sure the second firm has quoted for exactly the same searches.

[anonymous-user]

Phateuk said:

It's purchase only, the numbers I posted exclude a couple of the items which are standard, the total price inc SDLT was ~£6900 with countrywide, and ~£6000 with the new company.

In terms of recommendations, a friend warned me against countrywide (after I'd signed up) as he was similarly "recommended" them by an estate agent and they turned out to be awful. All the EA wants is their £200 referal money

I can relate to that......

We were sold on one of the bigger box ticker companies (not CW) and they were a disaster, we had to constantly chase them, correct their errors and they actually let us complete on the sale without a critical piece of paperwork in place which meant we didn't get paid for several days after completion. Luckily we didn't need the money for a purchase straight away.

Much happier with our current solicitors who are now dealing with the purchase side of the transaction and seem (so far) to be both responsive and competent.

[Phateuk]

Thought I'd follow up this thread with the conclusion.

After quite a few emails back and forth with them trying to get out of refunding me, I finally ran out of patience and said I'd just refer it to the card company if it couldn't be resolved amicably. Two minutes later the reply was that they would refund all money paid, this came through yesterday!

Funnily enough everyone I've spoken to about this have said to avoid countrywide as they're a nightmare, plus countless 1 star reviews on google. Just wish I'd done more research beforehand, but live/learn as they say.

Now to move forward with the purchase