Does the UK protect itself from aerial atack
Discussion
When the Gulf war/s were in their infancy there was loads of TV commentary with the inference that to attack Iraq you had to overcome first the surface to air threats from the Iraqis they had SAM and Anti Aircraft Batteries which had to be defeated such as airbases and government buildings. Does the UK protect its infrastructure from enemy airborne attacks.
Don't want the Frogs to get uppity
Don't want the Frogs to get uppity
I doubt you'll be able to find any recent stuff on this tbh
I was looking into something like this as part of a debate at work wth whether need trident as a deterrent, and what would happen is russia or israel etc did nuke us. The only stuff I could find was about 90's systems that could stop some of the warheads, but not enough.
I was looking into something like this as part of a debate at work wth whether need trident as a deterrent, and what would happen is russia or israel etc did nuke us. The only stuff I could find was about 90's systems that could stop some of the warheads, but not enough.
An interesting article on it, http://www.defencesynergia.co.uk/uk-air-defence-a-...
The RAF today only has an effective, active flying force of a few dozen pilots in the UK. Ground-to-air defenses (beyond radar) are largely non-existent outside US airbases and a handful of London, Scotland and Devon sites. The reality is, if Britain ever saw a proper aerial attack from Russia, China, IS, etc. (hopefully not), we'd be fooked.
Yipper said:
The RAF today only has an effective, active flying force of a few dozen pilots in the UK. Ground-to-air defenses (beyond radar) are largely non-existent outside US airbases and a handful of London, Scotland and Devon sites. The reality is, if Britain ever saw a proper aerial attack from Russia, China, IS, etc. (hopefully not), we'd be fooked.
We have army rapier squadrons which no doubt have quite a quick readiness state. We have not bothered with SAM defenses in any military sense other than Navy frigates and short range airfield defense Rapier since the 70's. The Russians would just swarm attack at Mach 2 and launch standoff nuclear or conventional cruise missiles at us and so the effort all went into high speed interception and shooting them down 800 miles away. So hence Tornado F2 ADV force.
The Navy frigates are floating SAM sites with excellent radars so we position them as and when we might need specific short term ground based air defense such as fir the London Olympics or more permanently down near the Falklands.
SAMs don't really matter much to us. If someone is overflying us and dropping bombs on our cities and airbases then we would fire a UGM133 with a conventional warhead as a warning shot and 12 hours later another one with a low yield nuclear warhead package and 12 hours later if they still persisted then they can have four warheads at a time eight times bigger than Nagasaki. Rinse and repeat a dozen more times.
Most countries don't have that option.
The Navy frigates are floating SAM sites with excellent radars so we position them as and when we might need specific short term ground based air defense such as fir the London Olympics or more permanently down near the Falklands.
SAMs don't really matter much to us. If someone is overflying us and dropping bombs on our cities and airbases then we would fire a UGM133 with a conventional warhead as a warning shot and 12 hours later another one with a low yield nuclear warhead package and 12 hours later if they still persisted then they can have four warheads at a time eight times bigger than Nagasaki. Rinse and repeat a dozen more times.
Most countries don't have that option.
Let's hope submarines aren't neded since currently none is operational. The old ones are too old to work and the new ones are too new too work.
If anyone wanted to invade I expect they they could land at Dover with amphibious vehicles and drive straight up Pall Mall.
ETA Actually they'd get stuck in traffic.
If anyone wanted to invade I expect they they could land at Dover with amphibious vehicles and drive straight up Pall Mall.
ETA Actually they'd get stuck in traffic.
Edited by Simpo Two on Saturday 11th February 09:29
This whole thing about Subs is arse about face. The silent service is in quite good shape. The Astutes are new and modern and a good design. The weapon and sensor fits are world class. The Vanguard replacement has got the green light. Barrow in Furness is busy busy busy.
It so happens that the US Navy had a three week carrier gap a month ago with none at sea over half the globe. They are really busy with new build Ford class and loads of refit and maintenance work on the surface fleet so they aren't doing much with their subs. Hence the USN is well placed to come over and help the RN out and perform some of its tasks.
There's an awful lot of cooperation under the sea between the RN and USN.
The Navy is going to have more fire power than at any time in its history by the end of next year. You just don't see much of it.
It so happens that the US Navy had a three week carrier gap a month ago with none at sea over half the globe. They are really busy with new build Ford class and loads of refit and maintenance work on the surface fleet so they aren't doing much with their subs. Hence the USN is well placed to come over and help the RN out and perform some of its tasks.
There's an awful lot of cooperation under the sea between the RN and USN.
The Navy is going to have more fire power than at any time in its history by the end of next year. You just don't see much of it.
ecsrobin said:
We have army rapier squadrons which no doubt have quite a quick readiness state.
They're only short range point defence weapons though. The UK has no layered AD although it has some very good (but fixed location) radar sites. We're too reliant on the RAF Typhoon (limited numbers) and the RN Type 45 guarding just off the coast (limited numbers & not tactically sound), but since the demise of the V-Force the UK has never really been interested in having a SAM/Gun based layered AD system so nothing really has changed much in 50+ years (I know Bloodhound stood-down in '91 but it hadn't been effective since the mid 70's).The new CAMM seems to be another relatively short ranged system (ER version out to 45km - probably more) but I don't think we'll have a Patriot 150km+ style system in the UK.
Don't forget that for a Russian force to get here it would have to get past several NATO areas of interest before it made it to out airspace. In that time we could scramble a reasonable Fast Jet fleet and prepare ground forces too.
But the reality is that at this time it's not considered a major threat.
But the reality is that at this time it's not considered a major threat.
Re Bloodhound.
I was about 12. My father had recently bought a building in Limehouse from the National Stevedores & Dockers Union, who were winding down, due to containerisation. I was lending a hand to clear out the papers they had left after they had vacated their offices.
One of the items I came across was a line drawing on blue paper of what I thought was 'a rocket'. I'll never forget that the drawing was headed, "Bloodhound".
I binned it.
I was about 12. My father had recently bought a building in Limehouse from the National Stevedores & Dockers Union, who were winding down, due to containerisation. I was lending a hand to clear out the papers they had left after they had vacated their offices.
One of the items I came across was a line drawing on blue paper of what I thought was 'a rocket'. I'll never forget that the drawing was headed, "Bloodhound".
I binned it.
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