Maternity Leave Problem - putting the screws on employer
Discussion
Bit of strange one for car forum I know (not Mumsnet!), but I've got some great impartial advice from here before.
My wife and I had a little girl 9 months ago. My wife has taken 12 months maternity leave from her job as an estate agent. Their maternity package was pretty poor, she was a very well regarded employee prior to taking maternity leave.
She made an application for flexible working hours to allow her to collect el bambino from childcare at 6pm and would start an hour earlier to compensate for this and would like to work from home 1 day per week. This was backed up with a reasonably convincing business case.
This application has been refused, she has also been told that he hours will be extended from 8am to 7.30pm, as will other members of staff in her office.
Cards on the table, she is only going back long enough so she can get maternity pay for when child 2 hopefully comes along and then she wont work after that.
Very difficult to know what to do, with the proposed extended working hours, it really cant work for her going back to work on that basis. She wont see the baby which will kill her.
I'm tempted to recommend that she appeals the decision on flexible hours and if that fails, just go full nightmare employee - get signed of sick with stress first week back, employment tribunal etc.
If anyone has any experience, it would be great to hear.
My initial thoughts
My wife and I had a little girl 9 months ago. My wife has taken 12 months maternity leave from her job as an estate agent. Their maternity package was pretty poor, she was a very well regarded employee prior to taking maternity leave.
She made an application for flexible working hours to allow her to collect el bambino from childcare at 6pm and would start an hour earlier to compensate for this and would like to work from home 1 day per week. This was backed up with a reasonably convincing business case.
This application has been refused, she has also been told that he hours will be extended from 8am to 7.30pm, as will other members of staff in her office.
Cards on the table, she is only going back long enough so she can get maternity pay for when child 2 hopefully comes along and then she wont work after that.
Very difficult to know what to do, with the proposed extended working hours, it really cant work for her going back to work on that basis. She wont see the baby which will kill her.
I'm tempted to recommend that she appeals the decision on flexible hours and if that fails, just go full nightmare employee - get signed of sick with stress first week back, employment tribunal etc.
If anyone has any experience, it would be great to hear.
My initial thoughts
Employees can request flexible working and employers can turn it down as they have
You cant expect a company to tailor their business specifically down to accommodate individual staff members and their lifestyle choices
Ive seen some smaller estate agencies start to struggle against the big online players, hence probably the longer more flexible hours
And TBH "just go full nightmare employee - get signed of sick with stress first week back, employment tribunal etc" makes my skin crawl, its people like you who milk the system for all its worth and make running a small business and employing people a complete utter pain in the arse
You cant expect a company to tailor their business specifically down to accommodate individual staff members and their lifestyle choices
Ive seen some smaller estate agencies start to struggle against the big online players, hence probably the longer more flexible hours
And TBH "just go full nightmare employee - get signed of sick with stress first week back, employment tribunal etc" makes my skin crawl, its people like you who milk the system for all its worth and make running a small business and employing people a complete utter pain in the arse
king hellnichio3478 said:
Bit of strange one for car forum I know (not Mumsnet!), but I've got some great impartial advice from here before.
My wife and I had a little girl 9 months ago. My wife has taken 12 months maternity leave from her job as an estate agent. Their maternity package was pretty poor, she was a very well regarded employee prior to taking maternity leave.
She made an application for flexible working hours to allow her to collect el bambino from childcare at 6pm and would start an hour earlier to compensate for this and would like to work from home 1 day per week. This was backed up with a reasonably convincing business case.
This application has been refused, she has also been told that he hours will be extended from 8am to 7.30pm, as will other members of staff in her office.
Cards on the table, she is only going back long enough so she can get maternity pay for when child 2 hopefully comes along and then she wont work after that.
Very difficult to know what to do, with the proposed extended working hours, it really cant work for her going back to work on that basis. She wont see the baby which will kill her.
I'm tempted to recommend that she appeals the decision on flexible hours and if that fails, just go full nightmare employee - get signed of sick with stress first week back, employment tribunal etc.
If anyone has any experience, it would be great to hear.
My initial thoughts
My wife and I had a little girl 9 months ago. My wife has taken 12 months maternity leave from her job as an estate agent. Their maternity package was pretty poor, she was a very well regarded employee prior to taking maternity leave.
She made an application for flexible working hours to allow her to collect el bambino from childcare at 6pm and would start an hour earlier to compensate for this and would like to work from home 1 day per week. This was backed up with a reasonably convincing business case.
This application has been refused, she has also been told that he hours will be extended from 8am to 7.30pm, as will other members of staff in her office.
Cards on the table, she is only going back long enough so she can get maternity pay for when child 2 hopefully comes along and then she wont work after that.
Very difficult to know what to do, with the proposed extended working hours, it really cant work for her going back to work on that basis. She wont see the baby which will kill her.
I'm tempted to recommend that she appeals the decision on flexible hours and if that fails, just go full nightmare employee - get signed of sick with stress first week back, employment tribunal etc.
If anyone has any experience, it would be great to hear.
My initial thoughts
Fully understand your position.
Had the flexible working been turned down, that's one thing. Twinned with an extension of working hours without commensurate pay increase, I don't think that is equitable.
The question was what to do about this, as a new mum, your not particularly employable so going elsewhere is not really an option.
My comment about going full nightmare employee is not what we want to do, but we are facing a situation where fundamental life things don't work.
Had the flexible working been turned down, that's one thing. Twinned with an extension of working hours without commensurate pay increase, I don't think that is equitable.
The question was what to do about this, as a new mum, your not particularly employable so going elsewhere is not really an option.
My comment about going full nightmare employee is not what we want to do, but we are facing a situation where fundamental life things don't work.
Really not sure what you would expect to happen at a tribunal?
Employer says 'We're changing everyone's working hours to XYZ'. Assuming they go about it in the correct manner, are you expecting a tribunal to say that it's fine for everyone else to have to do it but because your wife is a mother they will say that she doesn't?
That's not how it works.
Employer says 'We're changing everyone's working hours to XYZ'. Assuming they go about it in the correct manner, are you expecting a tribunal to say that it's fine for everyone else to have to do it but because your wife is a mother they will say that she doesn't?
That's not how it works.
nichio3478 said:
Fully understand your position.
Had the flexible working been turned down, that's one thing. Twinned with an extension of working hours without commensurate pay increase, I don't think that is equitable.
The question was what to do about this, as a new mum, your not particularly employable so going elsewhere is not really an option.
My comment about going full nightmare employee is not what we want to do, but we are facing a situation where fundamental life things don't work.
Stop whingeing , plan for it before hand or live within your meansHad the flexible working been turned down, that's one thing. Twinned with an extension of working hours without commensurate pay increase, I don't think that is equitable.
The question was what to do about this, as a new mum, your not particularly employable so going elsewhere is not really an option.
My comment about going full nightmare employee is not what we want to do, but we are facing a situation where fundamental life things don't work.
Why should your wife's employer bend over so much for her for her only to leave?
Before you moan further, ive a 2 year old and 3 kids in total, so I am more than aware how difficult things can be , I also have to spend my days dealing with employees who think the world owes them a favour.
nichio3478 said:
She has also been told that he hours will be extended from 8am to 7.30pm, as will other members of staff in her office.
That's constructive dismissal. Serious breach of contract to change working hours without consultation and agreement with employee. Ask for whats been said in writing to start with.https://www.gov.uk/dismissal/unfair-and-constructi...
Foliage said:
That's constructive dismissal. Serious breach of contract to change working hours without consultation and agreement with employee.
If they can't reach agreement, the employer can give notice then terminate the original contract and provide a new one.The employee could try to claim unfair dismissal from the original contract but they may well lose and end up paying the employer's costs.
Nichio, your mistake was saying you'd potentially leverage the situation to your advantage on a website populated by well build company directors!
However, your wife has rights. The employer cannot fundamentally change the terms of her job while she's on maternity leave - ie increase her hours. You don't mention how much of an increase / reduction in pay this is though.
As the previous poster suggests it's worth looking into further and, given the employer seems willing to play fast and loose with employee rights I wouldn't be too concerned about the employer tbh
However, your wife has rights. The employer cannot fundamentally change the terms of her job while she's on maternity leave - ie increase her hours. You don't mention how much of an increase / reduction in pay this is though.
As the previous poster suggests it's worth looking into further and, given the employer seems willing to play fast and loose with employee rights I wouldn't be too concerned about the employer tbh
PorkInsider said:
Really not sure what you would expect to happen at a tribunal?
Employer says 'We're changing everyone's working hours to XYZ'. Assuming they go about it in the correct manner, are you expecting a tribunal to say that it's fine for everyone else to have to do it but because your wife is a mother they will say that she doesn't?
That's not how it works.
Actually, it could potentially work like that due to indirect discrimination.Employer says 'We're changing everyone's working hours to XYZ'. Assuming they go about it in the correct manner, are you expecting a tribunal to say that it's fine for everyone else to have to do it but because your wife is a mother they will say that she doesn't?
That's not how it works.
Foliage said:
nichio3478 said:
She has also been told that he hours will be extended from 8am to 7.30pm, as will other members of staff in her office.
That's constructive dismissal. Serious breach of contract to change working hours without consultation and agreement with employee. Ask for whats been said in writing to start with.https://www.gov.uk/dismissal/unfair-and-constructi...
Hackney said:
However, your wife has rights. The employer cannot fundamentally change the terms of her job while she's on maternity leave - ie increase her hours. You don't mention how much of an increase / reduction in pay this is though.
I read it that this was a company wide change, and not just for his wife? nichio3478 said:
Fully understand your position.
Had the flexible working been turned down, that's one thing. Twinned with an extension of working hours without commensurate pay increase, I don't think that is equitable.
The question was what to do about this, as a new mum, your not particularly employable so going elsewhere is not really an option.
My comment about going full nightmare employee is not what we want to do, but we are facing a situation where fundamental life things don't work.
How about dont have kids before you can afford them you knobber..Had the flexible working been turned down, that's one thing. Twinned with an extension of working hours without commensurate pay increase, I don't think that is equitable.
The question was what to do about this, as a new mum, your not particularly employable so going elsewhere is not really an option.
My comment about going full nightmare employee is not what we want to do, but we are facing a situation where fundamental life things don't work.
nichio3478 said:
My comment about going full nightmare employee is not what we want to do, but we are facing a situation where fundamental life things don't work.
Smacks of 'entitlement'. Of course 'fundamental life things' will work, you just have to fund them yourself rather than expect your wife's employer to foot the bill.
A couple of other options:
- shared parental leave, may only provide a solution very short term.
- make an alternative suggestion
- you as the father make a flexible working arrangement to cover all of your requirement or a mix and match of requests from both mother and father to the respective employers.
- shared parental leave, may only provide a solution very short term.
- make an alternative suggestion
- you as the father make a flexible working arrangement to cover all of your requirement or a mix and match of requests from both mother and father to the respective employers.
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