Can you be to old to start a business?
Discussion
46 to be exact, with no previous knowledge of ever starting and running my own business, (I know.)
I have always been employed and for most of my working life in a driving capacity, 22 years as a truck driver some of which was in very specific fields, and the last 2 years have been as a private family chauffeur.
I am "thinking" and it really is just thinking at the mo of looking into if it is possible/viable to have a go at becoming a self employed chauffeur. Primarily it would be in the more general field of chauffeuring for both business and private clients mainly in London and the South East, but I do have a more long term idea that I would like to pursue within the same industry which is much more niche but to get to this level I think I need to concentrate on the more bread and butter type work first. Small acorns and all that.
Driving has been my working life, and even after all these years for some reason I still really enjoy it and I like to think I'm 'reasonably' good at it. I know there are countless companies and individuals already out there in this field but do I let this stop me looking into this any further?
Pretty fed up with working for others and not really achieving anything especially for the amount of effort I put in, so why not channel these efforts into going it alone so to speak? I am under no illusions that it will be tough but I have always liked a challenge and have always given anything I've done 110%.
Monday to Friday 9am-5pm has never really been something I have done, so working very long hours, 7 days a week is never going to be an issue for me especially if it is more for my own benefit in the long run, than someone elses.
Last years chauffeuring role, (employed) consisted of mainly 6 day weeks, often 7 at on average 75-80 hours per week.
I have the likely option coming up soon to go and do the chauffeur role again that I have done for the previous 2 summers for a large private family. Its bloody hard work and long hours but would give me the chance to get some decent savings to plough into the business idea later in the year should it be viable.
It would also enable me to do some research in specific fields and possibly make some decent contacts should the ideas in my head progress onto actually giving it a go. I suppose its the 'taking the plunge' bit that scares me the most having never done it before.
What have I got to lose other than the said savings I would plough into the business idea, and I'd much rather regret something I did try over something I didn't try.
I know there is so much more to consider and look into before I even think about giving it ago, writing a business plan, relevant bank account, advertising, 'networking' (hate that term) sole trader, ltd company, tax, v.a.t, accountant, etc,etc,etc,etc. The list just goes on and on but it is certainly something I am more than happy to invest time and effort into rather than just sit here in 20 years thinking, what if?
I know early days it will probably be bloody hard, but any profit made would be split between putting say 20% aside for tax purposes, day to day living costs, and then the rest being ploughed back in to the business hopefully for the long term good.
As a side note, if I do try this I would be able to continue working via an agency on an ad hoc basis so that I still have some finances coming in whilst trying to get the business up and running.
Sorry for the long post, (which I very nearly didn't post) but I do often value the opinions on PH,
TIA for any thoughts or input, good and bad.
I have always been employed and for most of my working life in a driving capacity, 22 years as a truck driver some of which was in very specific fields, and the last 2 years have been as a private family chauffeur.
I am "thinking" and it really is just thinking at the mo of looking into if it is possible/viable to have a go at becoming a self employed chauffeur. Primarily it would be in the more general field of chauffeuring for both business and private clients mainly in London and the South East, but I do have a more long term idea that I would like to pursue within the same industry which is much more niche but to get to this level I think I need to concentrate on the more bread and butter type work first. Small acorns and all that.
Driving has been my working life, and even after all these years for some reason I still really enjoy it and I like to think I'm 'reasonably' good at it. I know there are countless companies and individuals already out there in this field but do I let this stop me looking into this any further?
Pretty fed up with working for others and not really achieving anything especially for the amount of effort I put in, so why not channel these efforts into going it alone so to speak? I am under no illusions that it will be tough but I have always liked a challenge and have always given anything I've done 110%.
Monday to Friday 9am-5pm has never really been something I have done, so working very long hours, 7 days a week is never going to be an issue for me especially if it is more for my own benefit in the long run, than someone elses.
Last years chauffeuring role, (employed) consisted of mainly 6 day weeks, often 7 at on average 75-80 hours per week.
I have the likely option coming up soon to go and do the chauffeur role again that I have done for the previous 2 summers for a large private family. Its bloody hard work and long hours but would give me the chance to get some decent savings to plough into the business idea later in the year should it be viable.
It would also enable me to do some research in specific fields and possibly make some decent contacts should the ideas in my head progress onto actually giving it a go. I suppose its the 'taking the plunge' bit that scares me the most having never done it before.
What have I got to lose other than the said savings I would plough into the business idea, and I'd much rather regret something I did try over something I didn't try.
I know there is so much more to consider and look into before I even think about giving it ago, writing a business plan, relevant bank account, advertising, 'networking' (hate that term) sole trader, ltd company, tax, v.a.t, accountant, etc,etc,etc,etc. The list just goes on and on but it is certainly something I am more than happy to invest time and effort into rather than just sit here in 20 years thinking, what if?
I know early days it will probably be bloody hard, but any profit made would be split between putting say 20% aside for tax purposes, day to day living costs, and then the rest being ploughed back in to the business hopefully for the long term good.
As a side note, if I do try this I would be able to continue working via an agency on an ad hoc basis so that I still have some finances coming in whilst trying to get the business up and running.
Sorry for the long post, (which I very nearly didn't post) but I do often value the opinions on PH,
TIA for any thoughts or input, good and bad.
no issues at all - we often work with clients of that age or older setting up their first business...
don't be afraid to ask questions
get a good accountant
focus on customer service and building the business
think about how each customer can help find others (discount / referral / etc.) - customer acquisition tends to be the hardest bit in any business
make sure you have every single cost understood and itemised - set your rates against what it will cost you / allow you to make a profit - don't spend your life trying to undercut others that is a race to the bottom - instead focus on giving a better quality service at a higher price
have fun - running your own business is great!
don't be afraid to ask questions
get a good accountant
focus on customer service and building the business
think about how each customer can help find others (discount / referral / etc.) - customer acquisition tends to be the hardest bit in any business
make sure you have every single cost understood and itemised - set your rates against what it will cost you / allow you to make a profit - don't spend your life trying to undercut others that is a race to the bottom - instead focus on giving a better quality service at a higher price
have fun - running your own business is great!
Cant advise on the trade itself but following redundancy (for the 3rd time in the same industry over 15 years) I decided to go it alone 2 1/2 years ago. Initially it was was tough mentally being 40 at the time with a mortgage and 3 kids but its worked out and my wife now also works with me doing the admin side of things.
At the time I was approached and offered a new job the day I was put on gardening leave but all I could think was it would be short term stability for the same to happen again a few years later and if I didnt do it now I jever would.
Best decision I made
Best of luck whichever way you go.
At the time I was approached and offered a new job the day I was put on gardening leave but all I could think was it would be short term stability for the same to happen again a few years later and if I didnt do it now I jever would.
Best decision I made
Best of luck whichever way you go.
akirk said:
no issues at all - we often work with clients of that age or older setting up their first business...
don't be afraid to ask questions
get a good accountant
focus on customer service and building the business
think about how each customer can help find others (discount / referral / etc.) - customer acquisition tends to be the hardest bit in any business
make sure you have every single cost understood and itemised - set your rates against what it will cost you / allow you to make a profit - don't spend your life trying to undercut others that is a race to the bottom - instead focus on giving a better quality service at a higher price
have fun - running your own business is great!
Thanks.don't be afraid to ask questions
get a good accountant
focus on customer service and building the business
think about how each customer can help find others (discount / referral / etc.) - customer acquisition tends to be the hardest bit in any business
make sure you have every single cost understood and itemised - set your rates against what it will cost you / allow you to make a profit - don't spend your life trying to undercut others that is a race to the bottom - instead focus on giving a better quality service at a higher price
have fun - running your own business is great!
Customer service would certainly be key and I like to think I'm quite good at it. I always did well in the rock n roll job because I was very good at what I did, (that's not meant to sound big headed) and always went the extra mile. I always adapted well to working with all the different people in the industry, from fellow truck drivers, to local crew, roadies, production managers and even the band. Treat everyone with respect, be good at your job, go the extra mile, and you always got asked back onto the next tour.
I put the same work ethic into the chauffeur role. When all the family are in residence there are 17 of them, over 3 generations with 10 vehicles. At any given time they all expect their vehicle ready to go, in tip top condition and for you to be there stood on the door waiting for them at any time of the day or night. Each family member has their own special ways and needs, its knowing them and adapting to them accordingly. Flexibility, and the ability to adapt to ever changing needs were par for the course, and I expect this to be exactly the same if I were working for myself in the future.
Be smart and professional, make the customer/client feel safe and relaxed and hopefully they will want to come back/recommend time and time again.
I agree 100% with the not cutting rates thoughts. I've seen it in the trucking game many times and a few other industries also, it certainly does seem like a race to the bottom, peanuts and monkeys.....
The trucking company I worked for on the tours charged well above the going rate and yet the work continued to just come to them. They still to this day have no website as such, but because they are so well established and very,very good at what they do in a very niche market, the bands and their management go to them.
This is my thinking on the niche thing I would look into should I be able to get up and running, after starting in the more general field.
Thanks all for the input.
Edited by chilistrucker on Thursday 6th April 22:45
Inc.com (business publication) just ran a series of articles on "older" entrepreneurs. Helpfully can only find one article right now, but there are tonnes on there if you do some digging: https://www.inc.com/ilan-mochari/experienced-entre...
Upshot - no you are not too old, and some incredibly successful entrepreneurs only started in their 40s, 50s, or 60s.
Upshot - no you are not too old, and some incredibly successful entrepreneurs only started in their 40s, 50s, or 60s.
46 is not too old. I started at 43. I didn't have a business plan, or an accountant, or any money, and working in a field I had no previous knowledge of. Doomed to failure in retrospect. But the first 3 years were the (about) most fun I've had in my career. Now heading towards year 7, we are looking at franchising our brand and skills across Europe. Everything has come to me through hard work, a good customer focus, and an empathy people on the other side of the conversation. (At least that's what I think and hope). My company is not the cheapest, but we do offer outstanding service, and a genuine desire to try and help if we can.
This year we will probably turn over about 1/2 million pounds, and this is from a start where if I received £500 in a month I was doing really well.
Go for it - persistence and hard work, and a genuine desire to make it, will see you right.
All in my opinion of course, and I am not a financial or business consultant
This year we will probably turn over about 1/2 million pounds, and this is from a start where if I received £500 in a month I was doing really well.
Go for it - persistence and hard work, and a genuine desire to make it, will see you right.
All in my opinion of course, and I am not a financial or business consultant
Personal energy and cost-control are what make or break most businesses for over-40s. If you still have the enthusiasm and hunger of a 25-yearold, and nickle-and-dime every bit of spending to the last penny, you should do well.
Use chauffeur services in and around London quite a bit, between airports, meetings, etc. Tend to find most of the limo-type chauffeurs are self-employed -- but, and it's a big but, the chauffeurs often report to a "central controller" (or two) who runs a firm that aggregates bookings and then dish them out to self-employed drivers... who eventually end up hanging on their controller's every word and begging for work when times are light... infact, a bit like being employed and answering to a boss, but without the certainty of pension, sickpay, etc.
Use chauffeur services in and around London quite a bit, between airports, meetings, etc. Tend to find most of the limo-type chauffeurs are self-employed -- but, and it's a big but, the chauffeurs often report to a "central controller" (or two) who runs a firm that aggregates bookings and then dish them out to self-employed drivers... who eventually end up hanging on their controller's every word and begging for work when times are light... infact, a bit like being employed and answering to a boss, but without the certainty of pension, sickpay, etc.
Yipper said:
Personal energy and cost-control are what make or break most businesses for over-40s. If you still have the enthusiasm and hunger of a 25-yearold, and nickle-and-dime every bit of spending to the last penny, you should do well.
Use chauffeur services in and around London quite a bit, between airports, meetings, etc. Tend to find most of the limo-type chauffeurs are self-employed -- but, and it's a big but, the chauffeurs often report to a "central controller" (or two) who runs a firm that aggregates bookings and then dish them out to self-employed drivers... who eventually end up hanging on their controller's every word and begging for work when times are light... infact, a bit like being employed and answering to a boss, but without the certainty of pension, sickpay, etc.
Luckily I do still have the enthusiasm and hunger, I think its that and current run of the mill circumstances that are driving me in this direction. I keep thinking of the what ifs and maybe's but am thinking I'd rather fail at giving It my very best shot over continually just plodding along in my current set of circumstances.Use chauffeur services in and around London quite a bit, between airports, meetings, etc. Tend to find most of the limo-type chauffeurs are self-employed -- but, and it's a big but, the chauffeurs often report to a "central controller" (or two) who runs a firm that aggregates bookings and then dish them out to self-employed drivers... who eventually end up hanging on their controller's every word and begging for work when times are light... infact, a bit like being employed and answering to a boss, but without the certainty of pension, sickpay, etc.
I certainly would need to brush up on my skills of counting every last penny spent as my Mrs says this is a downfall of mine, I;m too generous so that would need to change.
I guess/assume this is where having a great accountant comes in? I would happily pay a good expert in this field, (some on here) to put me right on all things related to this. I'm sure this is an area if done right that pays for itself and would be worth every penny.
I'd make sure that each day the car arrived to pick up the customer with a selection of newspapers on board, as well as fresh water and tissues/wet wipes, I've just got to remember to keep ALL the bloody receipts
for said items. In fact I just need to learn to keep receipts for absolutely everything, as well as times, dates and reasons. I guess its the same if a top accountant wants to get from A to B in comfort and style, with the minimum amount of fuss, they call a professional in that field.
Advertising is another thing I have no knowledge of, how to most effectively market the business, from the very start, and hopefully moving along if and as it progresses. I know I will need a website. Again something that comes up on this forum quite a bit, so I would start researching it here as the advice is often helpful. There are many times that for even random things PH has come up trumps for me, if that fails there is always Google
I will certainly look into utilising Google, Facebook and any other relevant streams that could be of benefit.Last year as an example I was given a task by the family money man to find a specific golf buggy. I had no idea where to source a very specific 8 seater custom stretched golf buggy, and where to get it at very short notice. So I went on Google and started my search, everyone said it couldn't be done in the lead time I was given, in cost and getting a px on the old broken buggy.
Within a week I'd found a specialist in the field, in the UK that could meet all the requirements and turn it around in 14 days. I was chuffed with that. Sadly the families, 'odd' money man didn't choose this route, and went for a different supplier, (not brand leader) with a 5 week turnaround time, and £900 over the price I had got. Delivery extra. The deal I found was with free delivery, setup, and better px, but the money man went down his own route. He was most chuffed, it was just left to me to explain to the family when they arrived why they only had 1 functioning golf buggy and that there was a delay on the new one arriving
I know exactly what you mean in regards to the central controlled chauffeur type scenario and its exactly this type of platform I will avoid like the plague. It has no interest to me, (and my maybe daft ideas.)
I know that early on I will be looking at city runs, airports and the like but would like this to come from self generated business from advertising and contacts that I have. If it means doing city, airport and similar type work in the day, followed by an extra shift at night for a theatre run or similar then that's what I'll do but I really want to strive towards it being my own account work rather than 4th hand through someone else.
Don't get me wrong, I'm happy to grease a palm now and again to move forward, stay consistent, I just want to make sure its the right palm for the right result.
I really do have a lot to learn and that's even before making the idea a reality.
Evening...
All of the stuff you are concerned about can be learnt or bought in...
My experience is people buy from people... need to be able to get on with people - and you certainly can - particularly when you are experienced in the field.
I have no idea on competition - but others are doing it, and successfully. I don't see why you can't at all.
As for age.... b
ks to it....
Not sure I can say that in the Business room....
All of the stuff you are concerned about can be learnt or bought in...
My experience is people buy from people... need to be able to get on with people - and you certainly can - particularly when you are experienced in the field.
I have no idea on competition - but others are doing it, and successfully. I don't see why you can't at all.
As for age.... b
ks to it....Not sure I can say that in the Business room....
surveyor said:
Evening...
All of the stuff you are concerned about can be learnt or bought in...
My experience is people buy from people... need to be able to get on with people - and you certainly can - particularly when you are experienced in the field.
I have no idea on competition - but others are doing it, and successfully. I don't see why you can't at all.
As for age.... bks to it....
Not sure I can say that in the Business room....
Hello mate.All of the stuff you are concerned about can be learnt or bought in...
My experience is people buy from people... need to be able to get on with people - and you certainly can - particularly when you are experienced in the field.
I have no idea on competition - but others are doing it, and successfully. I don't see why you can't at all.
As for age.... b
ks to it....Not sure I can say that in the Business room....
Well I've just realised someone has loaned me a laptop for start up, must sort that
I vaguely remember seeing something on Steve Jobs once, (I think) that he was an ideas man, had all these crazy ideas and if he couldn't do it, he just bought someone in/employed someone that could make it happen. Certainly seemed to make it work.
I have often wondered if I could make a go of something, thought about trucking back in the day but it was just too cut throat and involved a start up that was to big for me back then. Hindsight tells me that it was a good decision.
I agree with you if you are going to do it, best to stick to what you know and I like to think that this is my field and what I'm reasonably good at, now I just need to move it forward to the doing rather than thinking.
Whats the worst that could happen, I just lose the cash investment I put in, it would be a pain in the b
ks but at least I tried.This all hinges on me doing another summer on that chauffeur job to facilitate the funds, but I don't mind if its for the greater good.
Coffee?
The weaknesses in the plan, as I understand it, do not include your age. It's a number of other things. The main one is that you don't know how you are going to get your customers. Then there's the fact that there is only one of you. Let's suppose you find an effective way to advertise your services, and you find a couple of regular clients who like you and your service. What happens when they both want you at the same time?
I was 46 when I set up. We started with £5k. That was 3 years ago. We started with a £35k project (civil engineering) and are now on a £1m project, All from £5k. Well £5k and a boat load of knowledge and skills. It is your brain that is worth the money. The better you use it the better you will do. We have paid ourselves a decent salary from day one and winged it from day one. We are no longer winging it. We have built up a reputation founded on quality work at competitive rates. Once you deliver the quality that clients require they become more flexible on rates. We are now not the cheapest but we aim to be the best and that is the only aim that works. You are only limited by your self belief.
You can do it but you need to keep on top of it. Get a decent accountant obviously but you already know this.
Easiest way to keep track of your money is start a business account and get a credit card. Use the credit card for business expenses only. Pay it off in full each week/month from the business account. This means all your outgoings are in one place not muddled up with your personal money. Your accounts are easy as your credit card statements show your accountant what you've spent.
You can then pay yourself from your business account as well. If you do this from the start you're not getting everything mixed up.
You may need to be a ltd company but you may not. Accountant will advise. There are pros and cons to ltd vs sole trader.
Good luck.
Easiest way to keep track of your money is start a business account and get a credit card. Use the credit card for business expenses only. Pay it off in full each week/month from the business account. This means all your outgoings are in one place not muddled up with your personal money. Your accounts are easy as your credit card statements show your accountant what you've spent.
You can then pay yourself from your business account as well. If you do this from the start you're not getting everything mixed up.
You may need to be a ltd company but you may not. Accountant will advise. There are pros and cons to ltd vs sole trader.
Good luck.
As the OP has a history of domestic employment and presumably references he could consider putting an advert in Lady magazine for a position with a family in need of a chauffeur. There's a good chance he could find a decent job that way and then none of the problems mentioned so far would come into it.
singlecoil said:
The weaknesses in the plan, as I understand it, do not include your age. It's a number of other things. The main one is that you don't know how you are going to get your customers. Then there's the fact that there is only one of you. Let's suppose you find an effective way to advertise your services, and you find a couple of regular clients who like you and your service. What happens when they both want you at the same time?
These are indeed major concerns.Customer wise I know having my own website from the start is key, I think this will be my number 1 priority to generate work and get the business out there and seen I will also look at other ways of generating interest/hits from other outlets and social media. I have no idea how to generate traffic towards myself/website but since starting this topic I can see that with the right help this is possible.
I get on very well with the Arab family I work for, the 3 adult children 40-50 years of age and all in their own right very,very successful in the business world. Between them they now have 5 children who are now in university and I get on just as well with the kids as I do the adult members of the family. They have many friends and links in the business world based full time in London so this is certainly a starting point. I am sure many have their own private family chauffeur but maybe there is leads to follow on the business side of things.
Through my chauffeur role I have also built up a good rapport with the concierges of some big, (expensive) central London hotels, again I'm sure these hotels have their own vehicles but there is no harm in having a chat this summer with the concierges to see if they ever have the need for an extra vehicle at short notice? I think this could be a greasing of palms scenario but give a bit to receive a bit would surely be a good thing? Said concierges are also excellent links for hard to find tickets for top sporting events, theater shows and gigs which could come in very handy at times.
One thing I have learned in this field is that these people, the hotel guests, don't like waiting and when they want or need something they are more than happy to pay a premium for it. They expect a first class service at all times and are happy to pay for it.
I have a friend, my best mate of the last 46 years who is now a Director at Mastercard so he is also top of my list for a chat.
There are 3 guys I know who have their own chauffeur work/businesses, more London and Surrey based but they are all happy to try and help out early days and all have similar contacts in London and Essex/Kent. I know this would mean doing work at a 3rd party level, but early days this could come in very handy.
I also have a few links in the music world that I am very keen to explore further, but this is much more specific to the niche route that I would like to go down at a later date, I have a very clear idea on this side of things but would prefer to keep it under wraps for now
I am indeed worried that if it all takes off and the scenario arises how do I In the beginning put myself in 2 places at once? I suppose I have options of then using 3rd parties for my own benefit perhaps but the worry there is are said 3rd parties going to give exactly the same level of service that I aim to provide?
I just have to make sure I pick the right 3rd parties. The guys I mention above would be ideal.
Who knows maybe, and I know its a big maybe eventually there may be the demand to take on an additional driver, and I know that is a whole other level right there
I do have 1 other person in mind already who would be excellent, get good staff, pay them above the going rate and treat them well should hopefully reap the right rewards.
Trophy Husband
Well done that is very impressive. I would have a similar amount, possibly more for the start up and like to think, (hope) that I also have a vast amount of knowledge/skills.
I know I will have to do some winging it at the start but I do like to think I have the self belief required, not in a big head way, just in regards that if I can get the relevant finances needed I will certainly throw everything I've got into making it succeed, I've always given 110% and have never been shy of the long days and nights if need be so hopefully that will stand me well.
Douglas
Accountant, (good one) is right up there with website and marketing.
I was thinking that a business account and business credit card would be the way forward for all the reasons you have mentioned, thanks. Keeping on top will be key, and keeping it separate from personal account and finances will certainly make this easier.
Limited company v sole trader this is something I need to research more as I currently have no idea which is the way forward for me.
I still have so much to do and consider. Firstly i need that summer job again for my savings/investment. Then I need to research and write up a very good business plan to take to my bank, or any bank for that matter. My fear then is that they look at it, with the limited investment I have and it may just be a point blank no. I have no idea as I have never thought of or been down this route before.
If I fall at the first hurdle, are there other routes I could look into for initial start up help on a financial level?
Sorry for the long post, I do waffle at times but just trying to cover as many bases as possible.
All the input is very much appreciated.
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