HAVS (Hand arm vibration syndrome)/White finger - help!
Discussion
Ill open this by saying its probably nothing and will pass, but want some reassurance that’s the case and i don’t need to be seeking treatment asap.
I work in a office, at a desk, but Im no stranger to hard work, I used to be a labourer, I build things every weekend, im always using a drill/chainsaw without issue etc.
However this last week I spent 3 solid days with a jackhammer/SDS chisel drill ripping the old plaster off our old cottage walls, it was proper stuck on, so i was spending about 6-8 hours a day with this machine chiselling it off.
On the 2nd night i woke up in the night with pins and needles, didn’t think much of it, if a little odd, on the 3rd night i was awake proetty much all night with extreme pins and needles/pain in my fingers/hands, after this i googled it and found out about HAVS, id never even heard of it before, i didn’t touch the SDS again after this.
Its now about 5 nights later, and im still waking up every hour or so in SO much pain, the kind of pain where you rock back and forth swearing to yourself, ive not slept properly in about 6 nights.
It mainly happens at night, I dont know if its being horizontal that causes it, because the only thing i can do to ease the pain is siton edge of bed or stand up
Sat back at my desk right this second my thumb and 2 fingers are completely numb and painful.
I just got back from my doctors, who basically laughed in my face and said i should avoid DIY and stick to working in an office, as if i had just told him i was tired, or my muscle ached, so that was 0 help.
some websites say once you have damaged the nerves they are damaged permantly and quick treatment is essential, others say it will pass.
Any advice or thoughts?
yours painfully
Kieran
I work in a office, at a desk, but Im no stranger to hard work, I used to be a labourer, I build things every weekend, im always using a drill/chainsaw without issue etc.
However this last week I spent 3 solid days with a jackhammer/SDS chisel drill ripping the old plaster off our old cottage walls, it was proper stuck on, so i was spending about 6-8 hours a day with this machine chiselling it off.
On the 2nd night i woke up in the night with pins and needles, didn’t think much of it, if a little odd, on the 3rd night i was awake proetty much all night with extreme pins and needles/pain in my fingers/hands, after this i googled it and found out about HAVS, id never even heard of it before, i didn’t touch the SDS again after this.
Its now about 5 nights later, and im still waking up every hour or so in SO much pain, the kind of pain where you rock back and forth swearing to yourself, ive not slept properly in about 6 nights.
It mainly happens at night, I dont know if its being horizontal that causes it, because the only thing i can do to ease the pain is siton edge of bed or stand up
Sat back at my desk right this second my thumb and 2 fingers are completely numb and painful.
I just got back from my doctors, who basically laughed in my face and said i should avoid DIY and stick to working in an office, as if i had just told him i was tired, or my muscle ached, so that was 0 help.
some websites say once you have damaged the nerves they are damaged permantly and quick treatment is essential, others say it will pass.
Any advice or thoughts?
yours painfully
Kieran
Sounds like your doctor needs a bloody good slap!
I once went to my doctor with agonising pains in my back and pelvis, if I stood up for too long. He pulled and poked, told me 'it's just skelotomuscular pain' and that was that..... I was shocked into silence.
Eventually google told me it was my core muscles too weak, allowing the nerves in my spine to get crushed, and exercise would cure it. It did.
Few years later, a nagging, aching, cruel pain that started in my shoulder blade and worked though to my bicep over a few weeks. Doctor told me, without even an examination, either cortisone injections, or strong painkillers. And that was that.
Google told me the most common cause of should/arm pain was bad posture in front of the PC, slouching etc. I shifted my posture, changed my chair, raised the screen, and 48 hours later the pain had gone.
I had numbness in my hands for days after spending a whole drunken evening resting my chin on my hands, on my elbows, staring out at the world, in a bar in a far flung corner of the world. I thought I was crippled forever, but slowly the nerves in my elbows uncrushed and my hands came back to life.
I once went to my doctor with agonising pains in my back and pelvis, if I stood up for too long. He pulled and poked, told me 'it's just skelotomuscular pain' and that was that..... I was shocked into silence.
Eventually google told me it was my core muscles too weak, allowing the nerves in my spine to get crushed, and exercise would cure it. It did.
Few years later, a nagging, aching, cruel pain that started in my shoulder blade and worked though to my bicep over a few weeks. Doctor told me, without even an examination, either cortisone injections, or strong painkillers. And that was that.
Google told me the most common cause of should/arm pain was bad posture in front of the PC, slouching etc. I shifted my posture, changed my chair, raised the screen, and 48 hours later the pain had gone.
I had numbness in my hands for days after spending a whole drunken evening resting my chin on my hands, on my elbows, staring out at the world, in a bar in a far flung corner of the world. I thought I was crippled forever, but slowly the nerves in my elbows uncrushed and my hands came back to life.
hi, sorry to hear about this. i don't post much on here but HAVS is what i deal with for a living! It does sound like you've done some damage but the sensorineural (nerve damage) aspect of HAVS usually takes years of regular and frequent exposure to vibration to appear and, when it does, is irreversible.
exposure to vibration can also cause CTS (carpal-tunnel syndrome) and this can give similar symptoms to what you are reporting. This can usually be reversed, if necessary by surgery. see http://www.nhs.uk/conditions/carpal-tunnel-syndrom...
if this were a work environment it sounds like the levels of vibration you were exposed to were probably well above the ELV (exposure limit value) of the Control of vibration at Work Regulations which, as it says, is a limit which must not be exceeded, even for one day. the ELV is a daily average of 5m/s2. this is likely to be reached in around 40-100 minutes using a chisel in an SDS drill.
HAVS is a serious condition which can reach disabling levels even in young people. hopefully this is CTS or just short-term symptoms .
drop me a pm if you need to know more.
exposure to vibration can also cause CTS (carpal-tunnel syndrome) and this can give similar symptoms to what you are reporting. This can usually be reversed, if necessary by surgery. see http://www.nhs.uk/conditions/carpal-tunnel-syndrom...
if this were a work environment it sounds like the levels of vibration you were exposed to were probably well above the ELV (exposure limit value) of the Control of vibration at Work Regulations which, as it says, is a limit which must not be exceeded, even for one day. the ELV is a daily average of 5m/s2. this is likely to be reached in around 40-100 minutes using a chisel in an SDS drill.
HAVS is a serious condition which can reach disabling levels even in young people. hopefully this is CTS or just short-term symptoms .
drop me a pm if you need to know more.
Thanks again for the help and advice all, especially Padrc66, top lurking!
I went to see a physio yesterday who was pretty mad at the docs for not taking it a little more seriously and she worked her magic, seems she was most concerned about the muscle in my lower arms, they were VERY tight from the vibrations, so a mix of Carpal tunnel damage and tight muscles pinching the nerves.
After an hour of pain with her it was much better last night, so things seem on the up!
I went to see a physio yesterday who was pretty mad at the docs for not taking it a little more seriously and she worked her magic, seems she was most concerned about the muscle in my lower arms, they were VERY tight from the vibrations, so a mix of Carpal tunnel damage and tight muscles pinching the nerves.
After an hour of pain with her it was much better last night, so things seem on the up!
Edited by sidekickdmr on Tuesday 25th April 10:33
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