Is this restaurant operating as a pub?
Discussion
We live near a restaurant, and since it changed hands it has become a bit of an issue.
People drinking on pavement outside, loads of shouting after 2300, and it is surrounded by houses full of people with young kids.
They now have a board outside saying every Saturday will be live entertainment, with free entry, and free buffet, just pay for drinks.
Would that put them in breach of there licence, as they should only be serving alcohol with meals, as part of the licencing.
People drinking on pavement outside, loads of shouting after 2300, and it is surrounded by houses full of people with young kids.
They now have a board outside saying every Saturday will be live entertainment, with free entry, and free buffet, just pay for drinks.
Would that put them in breach of there licence, as they should only be serving alcohol with meals, as part of the licencing.
cjs racing. said:
We live near a restaurant, and since it changed hands it has become a bit of an issue.
People drinking on pavement outside, loads of shouting after 2300, and it is surrounded by houses full of people with young kids.
They now have a board outside saying every Saturday will be live entertainment, with free entry, and free buffet, just pay for drinks.
Would that put them in breach of there licence, as they should only be serving alcohol with meals, as part of the licencing.
depends entirely what license they have just because there a restaurant don't mean they not got a full drinks licensePeople drinking on pavement outside, loads of shouting after 2300, and it is surrounded by houses full of people with young kids.
They now have a board outside saying every Saturday will be live entertainment, with free entry, and free buffet, just pay for drinks.
Would that put them in breach of there licence, as they should only be serving alcohol with meals, as part of the licencing.
Having been on the course they would be stupid ot break the rules as they are heavily enforced
this is your friend
https://www.gov.uk/alcohol-licence-your-area
this is your friend
https://www.gov.uk/alcohol-licence-your-area
A205GTI said:
Having been on the course they would be stupid ot break the rules as they are heavily enforced
this is your friend
https://www.gov.uk/alcohol-licence-your-area
Thank you.this is your friend
https://www.gov.uk/alcohol-licence-your-area
To be fair to the owner, she came into some money, and bought the business as a whole. It was already well established, but she is new to the restaurant trade, and formally a beautician, and has made a few mistakes along the way, she does her best, but not always legally. No malice on her part, just a lack of understanding.
She corrects any mistakes made, but we as neighbours have to suffer the consequences first.
If you feel they're taking the mick, you and your neighbours need consistently report any and all antisocial behaviour to the police - it'll very quickly create a hassle for the licencee, especially if she tries to vary it.
Also check on the local council website to see what they're actually licenced for..
Also check on the local council website to see what they're actually licenced for..
The premises alcohol licences are the same for pubs or restaurants. However, the usage licences aren't; if I remember correctly restaurants which serve alcohol (but whose primary business is serving food) are licence A3, whereas pubs (primary business serving drinks) are A4. I'm guessing they'll have an A3 licence which means if they're serving people drinks only, they're out of their licence terms, which is probably why the "free buffet" is being offered. I suspect the council licensing people will look very dimly at such an attempt to "fiddle" their licence.
cjs racing. said:
Thank you.
To be fair to the owner, she came into some money, and bought the business as a whole. It was already well established, but she is new to the restaurant trade, and formally a beautician, and has made a few mistakes along the way, she does her best, but not always legally. No malice on her part, just a lack of understanding.
She corrects any mistakes made, but we as neighbours have to suffer the consequences first.
As long as she is dealing with any complaints made by you, what's the problem?To be fair to the owner, she came into some money, and bought the business as a whole. It was already well established, but she is new to the restaurant trade, and formally a beautician, and has made a few mistakes along the way, she does her best, but not always legally. No malice on her part, just a lack of understanding.
She corrects any mistakes made, but we as neighbours have to suffer the consequences first.
sim72 said:
The premises alcohol licences are the same for pubs or restaurants. However, the usage licences aren't; if I remember correctly restaurants which serve alcohol (but whose primary business is serving food) are licence A3, whereas pubs (primary business serving drinks) are A4. I'm guessing they'll have an A3 licence which means if they're serving people drinks only, they're out of their licence terms, which is probably why the "free buffet" is being offered. I suspect the council licensing people will look very dimly at such an attempt to "fiddle" their licence.
Aye, a "craft beer" type pub I did the underfloor heating for went for a licence as a pub - and then found out (as I recall) that the licence for a pub was £100,000, whereas the licence for a restaurant serving drink was £60,000. So he now does "pie and a pint" deals under his restaurant licence. Not sure how legal it is, but that's the story the owner gave me!guindilias said:
sim72 said:
The premises alcohol licences are the same for pubs or restaurants. However, the usage licences aren't; if I remember correctly restaurants which serve alcohol (but whose primary business is serving food) are licence A3, whereas pubs (primary business serving drinks) are A4. I'm guessing they'll have an A3 licence which means if they're serving people drinks only, they're out of their licence terms, which is probably why the "free buffet" is being offered. I suspect the council licensing people will look very dimly at such an attempt to "fiddle" their licence.
Aye, a "craft beer" type pub I did the underfloor heating for went for a licence as a pub - and then found out (as I recall) that the licence for a pub was £100,000, whereas the licence for a restaurant serving drink was £60,000. So he now does "pie and a pint" deals under his restaurant licence. Not sure how legal it is, but that's the story the owner gave me!Licence fees
You’ll be charged a fee that’s based on the rateable value of the property.
Application fees range from £100 to £1,905, depending on the fee band of your venue.
A205GTI said:
Having been on the course they would be stupid ot break the rules as they are heavily enforced
If only! We went through 2 years of my local serving gone 4am, Fighting in the street, vandalism of neighbouring properties, outdoor speakers blasting well into the early hours, drink driving galore. Coincidently when licensing finally decided to spring a surprise visit on the pub they couldn't get there as the road was closed... drink driver killed a biker. If it starts getting out of control then call 101 to report incidents. Call licensing and environmental health. Our local landlord got fed up after being called in for his 4th meeting with the council and coppers so he threw the towel in.
They had a massive disco last night. With very loud music going on until 0020.
Quite a few of the neighbours were very upset, and a few started talking to people attending, and asking them to be quiet, as we all have young kids.
I have numerous videos that will be given to the council. I would share one here, but the place is identifiable from the videos, and fear I would fall guilty under the name and shame rules.
Quite a few of the neighbours were very upset, and a few started talking to people attending, and asking them to be quiet, as we all have young kids.
I have numerous videos that will be given to the council. I would share one here, but the place is identifiable from the videos, and fear I would fall guilty under the name and shame rules.
sim72 said:
The premises alcohol licences are the same for pubs or restaurants. However, the usage licences aren't; if I remember correctly restaurants which serve alcohol (but whose primary business is serving food) are licence A3, whereas pubs (primary business serving drinks) are A4. I'm guessing they'll have an A3 licence which means if they're serving people drinks only, they're out of their licence terms, which is probably why the "free buffet" is being offered. I suspect the council licensing people will look very dimly at such an attempt to "fiddle" their licence.
A3/A4 are planning use classes - there may have been a 'change of use' which needs planning permission.There may also be hours of use restrictions on the licence and/or conditions on a planning approval.
Check with planning enforcement.
First off I would get everyone to write to the designated premises supervisor (her) making specific complaints and referring to the terms of the premises license. Even if they are operating within the terms of the license they cannot cause nuisance in doing so. Request that the activities cease immediately and make it clear you will refer to the council if they do not do so.
The best answer is she gets a dozen complaints and packs it in straight away.
If not then everyone objecting needs to email individually to licensing and environmental health stating noise nuisance, breach of license conditions etc. Make sure you quote times, dates and do so every time it happens.
As long as your objections and complaints are reasonable the council will act but it will take longer than the first option.
The best answer is she gets a dozen complaints and packs it in straight away.
If not then everyone objecting needs to email individually to licensing and environmental health stating noise nuisance, breach of license conditions etc. Make sure you quote times, dates and do so every time it happens.
As long as your objections and complaints are reasonable the council will act but it will take longer than the first option.
The other thing I'd say is when we went through a similar situation only two households made direct complaints to the landlord and both those houses got windows put in and cars vandalised.
If all the residents are willing to stand up and be counted then things happen quicker. When it all went to court nothing happened due to lack of evidence despite having police and licensing officer as witnesses to several incidents and cctv footage of fighting in the street.
If all the residents are willing to stand up and be counted then things happen quicker. When it all went to court nothing happened due to lack of evidence despite having police and licensing officer as witnesses to several incidents and cctv footage of fighting in the street.
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