Which clutch

[NeilS3]

I plan to do a engine swap for my 1992 S3 I have a tweaked 2.9 engine to go in however I'm trying to source the correct clutch as been informed by previous owner of the engine that a normal 2.9 clutch may not fit and that a 'small' triple plate clutch was used in the past. I think if you get it wrong there may be clutch slip as not disengaging correctly?

The flywheel has been lightened and so had some machine work done. Any ideas from the photos and measurements I have attached would be greatly received.

Thanks in advance. Neil

[TVRees]

Does this help ....

C L I C K

[phillpot]

The 29.3 looks about right (standard ring gear) but there the good news ends!




looks like you either need a triple plate clutch or a new flywheel and a standard clutch which i think is 2.8 Capri (not 2.9) even with the 2.9 engine.

[NeilS3]

TVRees said:

Does this help ....

C L I C K

Thank you I'll have a looky.

[NeilS3]

phillpot said:

The 29.3 looks about right (standard ring gear) but there the good news ends!




looks like you either need a triple plate clutch or a new flywheel and a standard clutch which i think is 2.8 Capri (not 2.9) even with the 2.9 engine.

Thanks Phillpot,

Was told it ran with a triple plate clutch in the past however trying to determine which one... so I take it for a 2.8? Plus any negatives using a triple plate clutch.

Edited by NeilS3 on Monday 7th August 19:45

[Boosted LS1]

^ Cost for one I would imagine. A triple plate item is for race use and being a smaller diameter allows the engine to rev up quicker.

[NeilS3]

Boosted LS1 said:

^ Cost for one I would imagine. A triple plate item is for race use and being a smaller diameter allows the engine to rev up quicker.

Ok thanks.... typical.

So if you have flywheel lightened on the 2.9 engine then your into having a triple plate clutch?

[phillpot]

NeilS3 said:

So if you have flywheel lightened on the 2.9 engine then your into having a triple plate clutch?

That is seriously lightened!

[zombeh]

This sort of thing: http://www.burtonpower.com/clutch-assy-2xpaddle-or...

As above, that's not "lightened" so much as "mostly not there any more"

I don't know how much the standard flywheel weighs but you could probably get a fair bit lighter than standard on a more normal clutch

[Boosted LS1]

NeilS3 said:

Boosted LS1 said:

^ Cost for one I would imagine. A triple plate item is for race use and being a smaller diameter allows the engine to rev up quicker.

Ok thanks.... typical.

So if you have flywheel lightened on the 2.9 engine then your into having a triple plate clutch?

No, you can lighten the stock flywheel a bit and still use a stock clutch. Thing is, the mass of the flywheel is what makes cruising a delight. If your car's a road car then some mass is useful. A race car needs to accellerate quickly, on, off etc. Might be a pain on long distance journeys though.

[GreenV8S]

How 'tweaked' is the new engine? If the rest of the engine spec is along the same lines as that clutch, I'm thinking you might have quite a wild setup. Do you know what you're getting yourself into?

[NeilS3]

Cheers guys for the info,

Obviously I didn't have a clue to the extent of the flywheel that had been 'lightened' so going to be tad expensive to get the correct clutch plus maybe a pain to drive if cruising.

The engine I was told was made for racing but never used or had very little usage. It came with a carb setup (plan to swap to the injection) and on checking things the engine itself has had an overbore (don't know how much) but with high compression pistons fitted, the heads have also had a lot of work done to them, cam is unknown kinda guessed something would match the other parts and the flywheel as pictured above. Further down the road I've fingers crossed the injection would handle it plus ECU as guessing around 20% power increase. Drivability on the other hand with clutch and ? to the cam I don't know.

Edited by NeilS3 on Monday 7th August 23:42

Edited by NeilS3 on Monday 7th August 23:56

[NeilS3]

GreenV8S said:

How 'tweaked' is the new engine? If the rest of the engine spec is along the same lines as that clutch, I'm thinking you might have quite a wild setup. Do you know what you're getting yourself into?

...Not yet. More info the better.

Cheers.

Edited by NeilS3 on Monday 7th August 23:54

[DamianS3]

Hello

Interesting flywheel..if you want to use it, these people may be able to help you.. they helped me source the correct plate for my Duratec conversion (harder than you would think.

www.clutch-specialists.co.uk

Thanks

Damian S3

[Alan Whitaker]

Clutch will depend on how many of the bolt holes are tapped, some cover plates use 6 some use eight, nine, ten or twelve. You look like you have a Tilton type mount with the clutch face cover plate set
There are lots of clutch kits out there so you should be able to find something to fit.
How is the clutch bearing (do you have one) these type of clutches mostly use a internal clutch release with a hose fixed direct to the release bearing and a hose coming out of the bell housing for bleeding.


Typical 2/3 plate clutch


Typical release bearing, there are many types out there to fit many applications

Edited by Alan Whitaker on Tuesday 8th August 11:00

[NeilS3]

DamianS3 said:

Hello

Interesting flywheel..if you want to use it, these people may be able to help you.. they helped me source the correct plate for my Duratec conversion (harder than you would think.

www.clutch-specialists.co.uk

Thanks

Damian S3

Thanks for the link

[NeilS3]

Alan Whitaker said:

Clutch will depend on how many of the bolt holes are tapped, some cover plates use 6 some use eight, nine, ten or twelve. You look like you have a Tilton type mount with the clutch face cover plate set
There are lots of clutch kits out there so you should be able to find something to fit.
How is the clutch bearing (do you have one) these type of clutches mostly use a internal clutch release with a hose fixed direct to the release bearing and a hose coming out of the bell housing for bleeding.


Typical 2/3 plate clutch


Typical release bearing, there are many types out there to fit many applications

Edited by Alan Whitaker on Tuesday 8th August 11:00

Thanks a lot for all the info guys, brilliant thanks.

I will investigate a little more of how the car may feel with such a lightened flywheel also unknown to the extra stresses to rest of the running gear with such a fierce pick up. I'm not intending to thrash it around a track just road cruising so starting to think better getting the correct clutch to handle a 20% power increase onto the standard 2.9 flywheel that's on the car now.

Anyone on here using a lightened flywheel and comp clutch with their 'S'... ok drivability or pig in traffic.

Edited by NeilS3 on Tuesday 8th August 20:51

Edited by NeilS3 on Tuesday 8th August 20:57

[Alan Whitaker]

Should be no problems with a twin or triple plat clutch, may have a slight bite when pulling away but nothing to cause any problems, it's only in first and reverse it will bite hard on clutch release. I ran this type of clutch on my Essex GAA engine, depending on the pressure plate spring rate, just a bit of extra leg work but nothing more than that.
You may have to use the exact clutch the last owner used, if not you may just have to machine a little on the flywheel so its seats with the right clutch pressure, I mean by that you may just have to machine the flywheel face a mm or two or the recess for the clutch plate, I have done this on quite a few flywheels and not changed the balance of the flywheel as it removes metal evenly.
Any competition clutch supplier should be able to sort you out, you will need the bolt pattern, face diameter and recess depth, if you can you may also need the depth of the gearbox to the clutch face if you want to add a internal clutch bearing, I think Burtons can sell you this, depending on the clutch you may just need some spacers..

[NeilS3]

Alan Whitaker said:

Should be no problems with a twin or triple plat clutch, may have a slight bite when pulling away but nothing to cause any problems, it's only in first and reverse it will bite hard on clutch release. I ran this type of clutch on my Essex GAA engine, depending on the pressure plate spring rate, just a bit of extra leg work but nothing more than that.
You may have to use the exact clutch the last owner used, if not you may just have to machine a little on the flywheel so its seats with the right clutch pressure, I mean by that you may just have to machine the flywheel face a mm or two or the recess for the clutch plate, I have done this on quite a few flywheels and not changed the balance of the flywheel as it removes metal evenly.
Any competition clutch supplier should be able to sort you out, you will need the bolt pattern, face diameter and recess depth, if you can you may also need the depth of the gearbox to the clutch face if you want to add a internal clutch bearing, I think Burtons can sell you this, depending on the clutch you may just need some spacers..

That's great thanks for the info Alan, I've had a heavy duty clutch on a 1380cc Mini years ago however it didn't have a lightened flywheel but it sounds similar with the behaviour of biting suddenly in first gear in fact I could only drive it with thin trainers on however with a 3ltr engine I wanted to check it wouldn't be too fierce for the rest of the running gear from what you have said it's sounding fine and could be fun.

Very much appreciated with all the info guys.

[magpies]

I have a comp clutch in my S and I wish I hadn't

Fine if you give it a few revs (at least 2000 and some throttle as it passes the bite) but judders in 1st and a pig to reverse. Otherwise it is fine but not a pleasure in town.