Database - ditch ACCESS?
Discussion
My small business - 10 people / 8 of whom are van based, runs on a `bespoke` Microsoft Access database. We use it to keep customer records, schedule work, generate worksheets and invoices etc.
It has been ok, but is getting long in the tooth, and the chap who wrote it originally is having some health issues which mean we need to look elsewhere to either update or replace it.
One issue we have is a costly reliance on the traditional post. Our new or upgraded system will need to be able to communicate with live or pending customers by email or even text (for appointment reminders etc) and this needs to be foolproof and easy.
Another item on the wish list is - generating pdf invoices for email sending, with the option to pay via a `Go Cardless` tab on the pdf invoice.
The new system will ideally be able to do its own reconciliation for BACS or Go Cardless payments - and update the customer records.
Our new system needs to ultimately support IPAD/PDA data collection and input from the staff in the field - although we can live without this for now.
IT is not my forte, and there seem to be a huge range of programs available on which to build what you need. I think we will end up going `hosted` but we do not need to run any live webb interface for customers.
If anybody has recently upgraded an ACCESS database - or moved to a different software platform, I would welcome some insight into your reasoning and thoughts on how it is working out.
Many thanks.
It has been ok, but is getting long in the tooth, and the chap who wrote it originally is having some health issues which mean we need to look elsewhere to either update or replace it.
One issue we have is a costly reliance on the traditional post. Our new or upgraded system will need to be able to communicate with live or pending customers by email or even text (for appointment reminders etc) and this needs to be foolproof and easy.
Another item on the wish list is - generating pdf invoices for email sending, with the option to pay via a `Go Cardless` tab on the pdf invoice.
The new system will ideally be able to do its own reconciliation for BACS or Go Cardless payments - and update the customer records.
Our new system needs to ultimately support IPAD/PDA data collection and input from the staff in the field - although we can live without this for now.
IT is not my forte, and there seem to be a huge range of programs available on which to build what you need. I think we will end up going `hosted` but we do not need to run any live webb interface for customers.
If anybody has recently upgraded an ACCESS database - or moved to a different software platform, I would welcome some insight into your reasoning and thoughts on how it is working out.
Many thanks.
Used to use Access, many yonks ago.
My business has changed from those days so not a direct comparison, but I mostly use Podio and Xero for the accounting side. For live data entry is use Device Magic Forms, which also links into Podio - although I actually use it stand-alone and import the completed pdf report.
My business has changed from those days so not a direct comparison, but I mostly use Podio and Xero for the accounting side. For live data entry is use Device Magic Forms, which also links into Podio - although I actually use it stand-alone and import the completed pdf report.
Similar to you we have a bespoke database written in 1999. We have simply outgrown it making it too slow. Our developer is still current and wanted us to switch to SQL. He is writing the new database and making it as similar as possible. It should have taken 6 months and currently we are 13 months and still fixing bugs so not yet live still running access.
It does need writing for you and it will be bespoke allowing you to keep “tweaking it” as we did with ours so it sounds like the right path for us and maybe you if we ever get it right and go live. Because we are so used to it and it does what we want we have decided to go down this path although still not there. I am against licenses which are the alternatives I believe.
It does need writing for you and it will be bespoke allowing you to keep “tweaking it” as we did with ours so it sounds like the right path for us and maybe you if we ever get it right and go live. Because we are so used to it and it does what we want we have decided to go down this path although still not there. I am against licenses which are the alternatives I believe.
Also analyse what needs to be bespoke and what could go into a standard package.
You mention pdf invoices and cash collection. You can get this on Xero for £30 per month so could this be a better safer option and just write bits around the edge that are genuinely unique to your business.
You mention pdf invoices and cash collection. You can get this on Xero for £30 per month so could this be a better safer option and just write bits around the edge that are genuinely unique to your business.
zoomy said:
Similar to you we have a bespoke database written in 1999. We have simply outgrown it making it too slow. Our developer is still current and wanted us to switch to SQL. He is writing the new database and making it as similar as possible. It should have taken 6 months and currently we are 13 months and still fixing bugs so not yet live still running access.
It does need writing for you and it will be bespoke allowing you to keep “tweaking it” as we did with ours so it sounds like the right path for us and maybe you if we ever get it right and go live. Because we are so used to it and it does what we want we have decided to go down this path although still not there. I am against licenses which are the alternatives I believe.
Speaking as a programmer, 13 months and still not live sounds unusual for a like-for-like Access database migration. Are you doing it all in one go? As a phased release often works out better i.e. go live with minimal set of features, then add new releases containing the other features often.It does need writing for you and it will be bespoke allowing you to keep “tweaking it” as we did with ours so it sounds like the right path for us and maybe you if we ever get it right and go live. Because we are so used to it and it does what we want we have decided to go down this path although still not there. I am against licenses which are the alternatives I believe.
For a small business like yours, ideally you'd be best to find a 'COTS' product (commercial off the shelf) - eg; software already made to do 90%+ of what you need it to do and get costs upfront for them to make the required changes.
If what you're doing is unique so you can't find something like that and you want it mobile, you may be best looking at a web-based solution which will likely be cheaper and more user friendly than making something from the ground up...
The key to anything like this is to have very, very clear requirements; small businesses often end up spending a fortune on software solutions and they need constant changes often over many years before (if they ever) get what they wanted. There are some cowboys and there are often huge misunderstandings between non-IT and IT people... and salesmen from pre-made products are... well, salesmen!
If you spend the time upfront to be clear on exactly what you want out of it (in very heavy detail) you should get something excellent out the other end
I would second the 'phased' approach mentioned above, very often a good way to roll these things out.
Drop me a PM if you want some advice
If what you're doing is unique so you can't find something like that and you want it mobile, you may be best looking at a web-based solution which will likely be cheaper and more user friendly than making something from the ground up...
The key to anything like this is to have very, very clear requirements; small businesses often end up spending a fortune on software solutions and they need constant changes often over many years before (if they ever) get what they wanted. There are some cowboys and there are often huge misunderstandings between non-IT and IT people... and salesmen from pre-made products are... well, salesmen!
If you spend the time upfront to be clear on exactly what you want out of it (in very heavy detail) you should get something excellent out the other end
I would second the 'phased' approach mentioned above, very often a good way to roll these things out.
Drop me a PM if you want some advice
Hi,
I'm a experienced SQL Server DBA (Database Administrator). I have done many migrations from Access to SQL Server (it's straight forward, quick etc) in previous roles and I've also done bespoke solutions. I've worked with small databases /small projects (20k) up to large enterprise databases/projects (5M+). Ive also been a developer on job management and financial applications, which sounds like your area of requirement.
If I were you I'd write down my most valuable requirements/reason for replacment.
Then I'd do a good amount of Google research and get a free demo and trial for anything you think meets 90% of your requirements. Most likely will be hosted you don't want to introduce on premise infrastructure these days unless specifically necessary.
But to reiterate the free demo stuff is key, try try try then when your certain pay, don't get pushed into anything. You will find the vast majority of good companies will offer free trials, on site demos even if it's not explicitly stated on their website, just drop them an email! You will most likely find things you have not considered or a better way of doing a process you do now. What you don't want to be doing is spending a load of cash on bespoke functionality which provides 0.01% of value to your business just because you want the software to fit the process. You may find you get 10% value by accepting new functionality and changing your process.
Good luck!
I'm a experienced SQL Server DBA (Database Administrator). I have done many migrations from Access to SQL Server (it's straight forward, quick etc) in previous roles and I've also done bespoke solutions. I've worked with small databases /small projects (20k) up to large enterprise databases/projects (5M+). Ive also been a developer on job management and financial applications, which sounds like your area of requirement.
If I were you I'd write down my most valuable requirements/reason for replacment.
Then I'd do a good amount of Google research and get a free demo and trial for anything you think meets 90% of your requirements. Most likely will be hosted you don't want to introduce on premise infrastructure these days unless specifically necessary.
But to reiterate the free demo stuff is key, try try try then when your certain pay, don't get pushed into anything. You will find the vast majority of good companies will offer free trials, on site demos even if it's not explicitly stated on their website, just drop them an email! You will most likely find things you have not considered or a better way of doing a process you do now. What you don't want to be doing is spending a load of cash on bespoke functionality which provides 0.01% of value to your business just because you want the software to fit the process. You may find you get 10% value by accepting new functionality and changing your process.
Good luck!
Edited by Harrison-91xcg on Thursday 17th August 20:26
Edited by Harrison-91xcg on Thursday 17th August 20:28
I've developed few Access databases in the past and I'm proud to say few are still being used 
It's a very cheap and flexible tool but doesn't scale too well.
Have a look at Dynamics 365 to see it suits your needs. Pretty flexible system that covers most business needs in one product.
https://www.microsoft.com/en-gb/dynamics365/pricin...
It's a very cheap and flexible tool but doesn't scale too well. Have a look at Dynamics 365 to see it suits your needs. Pretty flexible system that covers most business needs in one product.
https://www.microsoft.com/en-gb/dynamics365/pricin...
The good thing about Access/bespoke is that it maps to your business processes exactly, the danger with an off the shelf product is that you then end up with a few other little solutions alongside to cover any inadequacies. Depends on how closely your company maps to others in a similar sector.
OP, my advice to you is that with the size of your company is to stick with Access for now, until you grow a bit more.
Your post indicates that most of the new stuff is ‘nice to have’ at some point, as opposed to customer valued features adding to the actual bottom line.
Your main concern seems to be around email/text and your current solution can be be extended to do that.
But again it depends on how much money these 10 people are making and the volume of data being put through, for example I wrote a bespoke solution which allows a move away from Access for a 20 man company, but these 20 people were a significant Hedge Fund and the middle office needed it.
If your business is simpler and you are invoicing a small number of invoices a day then there is no need for you to pay £70 a month per person to Microsoft Dynamics, nor get involved with a server based solution just yet.
If you are not expecting huge growth in the near future, stick to what you have, review and fix any ongoing issues in your current solution, and extend Access to send reminders/texts. That will allow you to fully concentrate on growing the business.
OP, my advice to you is that with the size of your company is to stick with Access for now, until you grow a bit more.
Your post indicates that most of the new stuff is ‘nice to have’ at some point, as opposed to customer valued features adding to the actual bottom line.
Your main concern seems to be around email/text and your current solution can be be extended to do that.
But again it depends on how much money these 10 people are making and the volume of data being put through, for example I wrote a bespoke solution which allows a move away from Access for a 20 man company, but these 20 people were a significant Hedge Fund and the middle office needed it.
If your business is simpler and you are invoicing a small number of invoices a day then there is no need for you to pay £70 a month per person to Microsoft Dynamics, nor get involved with a server based solution just yet.
If you are not expecting huge growth in the near future, stick to what you have, review and fix any ongoing issues in your current solution, and extend Access to send reminders/texts. That will allow you to fully concentrate on growing the business.
Edited by hyphen on Thursday 17th August 21:34
rival38 said:
Thanks to all for the insights and advice. Greatly appreciated, I can now go and do some more focused homework.
I am very experienced in helping small business make correct technical decisions based on their current and future needs. If you would like some free advice and help (I am currently contracted and working) please do contact me. Only happy to help.Kind regards.
OP - my company (3 people) builds systems for small businesses (ranging from fully bespoke to "value added" integrations with various off-the-shelf products to automate workflow).
Currently doing something for a company in the midlands which does something very similar to what you describe, including integrating with Stripe for online payments, generating quotes and invoices on PDF, pumping data in to their accounts package (Xero) and sending SMS messages to customers. The approach we've taken is to incrementally release functionality in the new system and gradually suffocate the old system out of use - an approach I'd recommend in your situation too.
If you PM me I'm happy to have a chat and advise and also see if there is something we can do for you too.
Currently doing something for a company in the midlands which does something very similar to what you describe, including integrating with Stripe for online payments, generating quotes and invoices on PDF, pumping data in to their accounts package (Xero) and sending SMS messages to customers. The approach we've taken is to incrementally release functionality in the new system and gradually suffocate the old system out of use - an approach I'd recommend in your situation too.
If you PM me I'm happy to have a chat and advise and also see if there is something we can do for you too.
Access can actually do a super job if its constructed from well written VBA code.
As a company, we touched Access for quite a few years. However, some systems I wrote years ago are still being used in Access today. None of my developers want anything to do with it as its not 'Cool'.
As someone else mentioned above, when you outgrow its data limitations, migrating the backend data to SQL server can buy you many more years of use.
If you are stuck, you are more than welcome to drop me a PM. Happy to help you out, or just give you some advice on the system you have now.
Andy
As a company, we touched Access for quite a few years. However, some systems I wrote years ago are still being used in Access today. None of my developers want anything to do with it as its not 'Cool'.
As someone else mentioned above, when you outgrow its data limitations, migrating the backend data to SQL server can buy you many more years of use.
If you are stuck, you are more than welcome to drop me a PM. Happy to help you out, or just give you some advice on the system you have now.
Andy
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