630 vs 645 reliability
Discussion
Would love a 645i or 650i, but the oil leaks and valve stems stories do scare me a bit.
Having read a number of threads on here about the issues, I'm still none the wiser if these problem will affect all of these at some point, or whether it's just pot luck
The figures on the 630i look ok, and it would be the sensible choice, but I can only think it would be a case of 'needing' the V8
Having read a number of threads on here about the issues, I'm still none the wiser if these problem will affect all of these at some point, or whether it's just pot luck
The figures on the 630i look ok, and it would be the sensible choice, but I can only think it would be a case of 'needing' the V8
It's likely that the leaks are being caused by other factors, not just age. In my 330 I was forever chasing oil leaks, but when I realised the crank pressure was largely to blame, I fixed the crank ventilation valve and all was sorted. Then it started leaking coolant, which was 4 years after I refreshed the whole system, but that's another story!
Gaskets fail over time anyway, but gaskets will also fail if they are having to deal with extra pressure. Fix the cause of the problem, then fix the gaskets.
Gaskets fail over time anyway, but gaskets will also fail if they are having to deal with extra pressure. Fix the cause of the problem, then fix the gaskets.
Ive taken it to a BMW specialist who said the valve stem seals may need doing and the leak is possibly the alternator and he quoted about £400 for that but said the valve stems were too big a job and i got the impression he didnt want to do it.
Took it to another garage who said they didnt think it was the alternator but somewhere above it. Again they said it would be £££ - didnt quote a figure but got the impression he didnt want to do it.
Took it to another garage who said they didnt think it was the alternator but somewhere above it. Again they said it would be £££ - didnt quote a figure but got the impression he didnt want to do it.
After chasing the leaks around the e46, I look back and wish I'd just taken the engine out and done everything in one go. The benefit of hindsight.
The alternator o-ring is a big job (6 hours or so, apparently) but is a frustratingly small gasket. A bit like the tiny gasket prone to leaking on the oil filter house on the e46 (that required the alternator to be moved), though this is a much smaller job than the one on the 645.
Not suggesting you take the engine out, but thinking out loud it seems that at some point it would be easiest to just do that and do every single gasket in one go rather than chasing annoying leaks everywhere. As someone said above, BMW don't make these things easy (though working on my wife's Vauxhall is actually more frustrating due to the quality of the parts/clips/screws).
The alternator o-ring is a big job (6 hours or so, apparently) but is a frustratingly small gasket. A bit like the tiny gasket prone to leaking on the oil filter house on the e46 (that required the alternator to be moved), though this is a much smaller job than the one on the 645.
Not suggesting you take the engine out, but thinking out loud it seems that at some point it would be easiest to just do that and do every single gasket in one go rather than chasing annoying leaks everywhere. As someone said above, BMW don't make these things easy (though working on my wife's Vauxhall is actually more frustrating due to the quality of the parts/clips/screws).
Had a 545i. Oil leaks were normal but never too serious. Tried not to think about valve stem seals.
Was always paranoid about coolant leaks given the alleged fragility of the system (although I never actually had any problems in that area).
Keep an eye on it and always carry a top-up bottle?
Was always paranoid about coolant leaks given the alleged fragility of the system (although I never actually had any problems in that area).
Keep an eye on it and always carry a top-up bottle?
Maracus said:
Would love a 645i or 650i, but the oil leaks and valve stems stories do scare me a bit.
Having read a number of threads on here about the issues, I'm still none the wiser if these problem will affect all of these at some point, or whether it's just pot luck
The figures on the 630i look ok, and it would be the sensible choice, but I can only think it would be a case of 'needing' the V8
Valve Stem Oil Seal failure is almost inevitable; what is pot luck is how quickly/soon it happens. I loved my (04) 645 and had it from 60k miles up to 100k, but the last 5k were spent leaving a large cloud of blue smoke behind me. There were other teething problems from time to time but nothing ruinous. There was a thread on here a while back where someone's 650 had VSOS failure at 60k but I got the impression it was a neglected car. Having read a number of threads on here about the issues, I'm still none the wiser if these problem will affect all of these at some point, or whether it's just pot luck
The figures on the 630i look ok, and it would be the sensible choice, but I can only think it would be a case of 'needing' the V8
Finding a E63/64 that has had the VSOS professionally corrected is nigh on impossible; mainly because to get the work done by a specialist would have cost almost the value of an 04 car, so if the work gets done they tend to hold onto the car. That was the choice I faced when mine started to smoke badly. I got out.
2005 650 here.
I have had mine since June 2011. It had 47k miles when I bought it.
Mine has never left so much as a single drop of oil on the garage floor sine I got it.
Valve oil stem seals on mine started to go at 135k miles. Had them changed out by a specialist. They dropped the engine to do the seals and replaced a couple of other gaskets in the process. Cost was well under £2k.
Now at 165k miles and engine uses no oil between services and appears oil tight. Only other non service items have been a wheel bearing and the gearbox sump pan.
Not sure this helps your thought process, but hope it does!
I have had mine since June 2011. It had 47k miles when I bought it.
Mine has never left so much as a single drop of oil on the garage floor sine I got it.
Valve oil stem seals on mine started to go at 135k miles. Had them changed out by a specialist. They dropped the engine to do the seals and replaced a couple of other gaskets in the process. Cost was well under £2k.
Now at 165k miles and engine uses no oil between services and appears oil tight. Only other non service items have been a wheel bearing and the gearbox sump pan.
Not sure this helps your thought process, but hope it does!
parabolica said:
Valve Stem Oil Seal failure is almost inevitable; what is pot luck is how quickly/soon it happens. I loved my (04) 645 and had it from 60k miles up to 100k, but the last 5k were spent leaving a large cloud of blue smoke behind me. There were other teething problems from time to time but nothing ruinous. There was a thread on here a while back where someone's 650 had VSOS failure at 60k but I got the impression it was a neglected car.
Finding a E63/64 that has had the VSOS professionally corrected is nigh on impossible; mainly because to get the work done by a specialist would have cost almost the value of an 04 car, so if the work gets done they tend to hold onto the car. That was the choice I faced when mine started to smoke badly. I got out.
Out of interest how much did you get for yours when it was fFinding a E63/64 that has had the VSOS professionally corrected is nigh on impossible; mainly because to get the work done by a specialist would have cost almost the value of an 04 car, so if the work gets done they tend to hold onto the car. That was the choice I faced when mine started to smoke badly. I got out.
ked?I never see these going for shed money which is what you would expect if there were loads out there with repair costs exceeding their value.
You can hire the tool to do the valve stem seals - but you need to be a keen and patient diy'er to do them yourself (i have a thread on here and details via my profile)
There's a person up manchester IIRC that can do it for about a grand or so, which is a fair price. I changed the timing cover gaskets at the same time and the front of the engine is dry now.
I do get a couple of drops from the 'box i think. (e65 750)
There's a person up manchester IIRC that can do it for about a grand or so, which is a fair price. I changed the timing cover gaskets at the same time and the front of the engine is dry now.
I do get a couple of drops from the 'box i think. (e65 750)
I kept reading oil leak horror stories where garages were suggesting this and that only for the cars still to have the leaks after having the work they suggested doing.
I've had a few drips of oil on my drive (2004 645) and took it to 3 places. First suggested there was no leak after cleaning up all the engine bay. Second thought it "may" be coming from the rocker cover gaskets and the third couldn't find anything at all despite having the car running up on the ramps for quite a while with the engine running.
I wasn't prepared to throw money at getting some of the suggestions done - rocker cover gaskets, oil breather, gearbox sump until it was pin pointed exactly where it was coming from. The last garage checked the oil and removed just over 0.5 litre as it over shot the marks on the dipstick. Oddly enough I've had no little maps of Australia left on the drive since then. It's been over 1500 miles since then.
Some of the prices I was getting for changing the rocker covers, gearbox sump, o ring from the alternator, etc, etc were just crazy! I'm glad I didn't go with the chin rubbing and listen to any of their suggestions.
Going back on track for the OP. I think I'd struggle and really hate going from a V8 to the 6 pot. Although I was tempted to kick my 6 away for a CLS55 AMG but the trader wouldn't warranty it so I walked away from it ....
I've had a few drips of oil on my drive (2004 645) and took it to 3 places. First suggested there was no leak after cleaning up all the engine bay. Second thought it "may" be coming from the rocker cover gaskets and the third couldn't find anything at all despite having the car running up on the ramps for quite a while with the engine running.
I wasn't prepared to throw money at getting some of the suggestions done - rocker cover gaskets, oil breather, gearbox sump until it was pin pointed exactly where it was coming from. The last garage checked the oil and removed just over 0.5 litre as it over shot the marks on the dipstick. Oddly enough I've had no little maps of Australia left on the drive since then. It's been over 1500 miles since then.
Some of the prices I was getting for changing the rocker covers, gearbox sump, o ring from the alternator, etc, etc were just crazy! I'm glad I didn't go with the chin rubbing and listen to any of their suggestions.
Going back on track for the OP. I think I'd struggle and really hate going from a V8 to the 6 pot. Although I was tempted to kick my 6 away for a CLS55 AMG but the trader wouldn't warranty it so I walked away from it ....
^ I agree, I think id be kicking myself. I had an SL before this, a 3.0 which was best described as brisk. The V8 in the 645 is great.
I recently test drove an E220cdi at a main dealer in view of getting something sensible and walked away thinking how painfully dull and slow it was. So for the time being im stuck with either keeping this car or changing it but Ive no idea what to as this still looks fresh in its looks and is great to drive.
I recently test drove an E220cdi at a main dealer in view of getting something sensible and walked away thinking how painfully dull and slow it was. So for the time being im stuck with either keeping this car or changing it but Ive no idea what to as this still looks fresh in its looks and is great to drive.
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