My weekend with a Model S
Discussion
Tesla kindly lent me a 100D for the weekend, a fairly un-optioned car with leather and a sunroof but not much else. I spent much of the weekend up and down the A1, some local driving and a jaunt to the PH meet at St Neots.
It took me a while to get over the geek-fest that is the central panel and dash, and start to treat it as a car. The acceleration is nuts, as we know, but it's the 40-70 that's amazing. It's almost at bike levels of overtaking - no more "can I make it" and more "will my passenger throw up". However, get over that and it's a really competent piece of kit. With all the cameras on the A1 from the A14 down to Apex corner it's the TACC that makes it easy, combined with Autopilot. Keeping to the speed limits I was doing 280 Wh/mile, which I think gives just shy of 280 on a full battery for the 75 I'm considering. Call it 260, which is well within the range I need.
Ride on air suspension isn't as smooth as my 2003 Range Rover, or the 2003 Jag X350 which I had before. Seats are pretty firm, so not a comfy as I'd hoped - this on 19" wheels. Speaking of seats, the floorpan with the batteries in means the angle of feet to hips is pretty flat. I had a dodgy back today anyway, but it took ages to find a comfortable seating position. I'm not sure I ever did. The lumbar support is every adjustable, but maybe a bit too hard for me. Heated seat doesn't get anywhere near as hot as the Range Rover. Lots of space in the rear, and lots of load space too.
Heating and ventilation isn't very adjustable. In the Range Rover I can mix cold air into the face vents, but the Tesla has no control over even the flow rate from the face vents. Having said that, whatever it does by default is really very good anyway.
The "infotainment" is really very good. DAB radio works very well, speech activated search is genuinely useful (although couuldn't find some of my favourite artists), TuneIn and Spotify are well integrated. Even the nav is OK, although not as good as Waze, and it makes some odd routing choices to avoid relatively trivial traffic.
Autopilot is really very good, if one stays conscious of its limitations. It's mostly quite smooth and avoids exit slip roads just fine. Shiny overbanding or removed white lines which leave a shiny surface in roadworks can get confused as lane markings. It can cope with tighter curves than the Volvo system I tried, and requires less frequent reminders that the driver is awake. This may be good or bad. The TACC brakes quite late, but can be configured I think. In stop-start traffic, the two together are a miracle. No stress at all.
Steering can be configured for weight and sensitivity, and is about as feel-free as the X350. Handling is flat and grip seems good, given it's not supposed to be a sports car.
Not sure if I'll get one yet, the Volvo V90 is more comfy, more capacious, has TACC and lane-keeping that's almost the equal of the Tesla and costs a LOT less. Taking fuel into account almost levels the playing field on that front for me. And the sales guy is MUCH better!
It took me a while to get over the geek-fest that is the central panel and dash, and start to treat it as a car. The acceleration is nuts, as we know, but it's the 40-70 that's amazing. It's almost at bike levels of overtaking - no more "can I make it" and more "will my passenger throw up". However, get over that and it's a really competent piece of kit. With all the cameras on the A1 from the A14 down to Apex corner it's the TACC that makes it easy, combined with Autopilot. Keeping to the speed limits I was doing 280 Wh/mile, which I think gives just shy of 280 on a full battery for the 75 I'm considering. Call it 260, which is well within the range I need.
Ride on air suspension isn't as smooth as my 2003 Range Rover, or the 2003 Jag X350 which I had before. Seats are pretty firm, so not a comfy as I'd hoped - this on 19" wheels. Speaking of seats, the floorpan with the batteries in means the angle of feet to hips is pretty flat. I had a dodgy back today anyway, but it took ages to find a comfortable seating position. I'm not sure I ever did. The lumbar support is every adjustable, but maybe a bit too hard for me. Heated seat doesn't get anywhere near as hot as the Range Rover. Lots of space in the rear, and lots of load space too.
Heating and ventilation isn't very adjustable. In the Range Rover I can mix cold air into the face vents, but the Tesla has no control over even the flow rate from the face vents. Having said that, whatever it does by default is really very good anyway.
The "infotainment" is really very good. DAB radio works very well, speech activated search is genuinely useful (although couuldn't find some of my favourite artists), TuneIn and Spotify are well integrated. Even the nav is OK, although not as good as Waze, and it makes some odd routing choices to avoid relatively trivial traffic.
Autopilot is really very good, if one stays conscious of its limitations. It's mostly quite smooth and avoids exit slip roads just fine. Shiny overbanding or removed white lines which leave a shiny surface in roadworks can get confused as lane markings. It can cope with tighter curves than the Volvo system I tried, and requires less frequent reminders that the driver is awake. This may be good or bad. The TACC brakes quite late, but can be configured I think. In stop-start traffic, the two together are a miracle. No stress at all.
Steering can be configured for weight and sensitivity, and is about as feel-free as the X350. Handling is flat and grip seems good, given it's not supposed to be a sports car.
Not sure if I'll get one yet, the Volvo V90 is more comfy, more capacious, has TACC and lane-keeping that's almost the equal of the Tesla and costs a LOT less. Taking fuel into account almost levels the playing field on that front for me. And the sales guy is MUCH better!
mr_spock said:
Not sure if I'll get one yet, the Volvo V90 is more comfy, more capacious, has TACC and lane-keeping that's almost the equal of the Tesla and costs a LOT less. !
I imagine a used Ford Mondeo has alot comfier suspension, just ad big and alot cheaper than a V90 
.Teslas are expensive but nice things in life cost more (unless you have a good accountant in which case the Tesla wouldn't - BIK etc but all beyond me so I paid for ours with post tax cash )
.I'd be wary of setting an expectation of 250 miles in a 75. You can, but its not easy, then factor in charging only to 90% unless you have to otherwise you can damage the battery over time and arriving back with 10% safety margin - leaves you a workhorse range of 80%, or 200 miles. You can push the boundaries, but the first time you hit a road closure and have to do a diversion you'll be caught out.
Thats not to count against it, I just wouldn't want anyone to chose the wrong model.
You can control fan speed as well..
Thats not to count against it, I just wouldn't want anyone to chose the wrong model.
You can control fan speed as well..
I know it sounds like a silly comparison, but I don't accept that pricier = nicer. Just look at comparisons of anything from olive oil to jeans. Anyway, I don't wan't to get into a discussion of whether a Tesla is overpriced for what you get, personally I think it's fair value for money, I'm trying to decide if the extra is worth the extra ££.
This may turn into a "what car" thread, so probably the wrong forum!
It's possible that a Panamera is a closer comparison, but without the 1.5% PCP and near-zero fuel costs I couldn't afford something like the Tesla, so I'm comparing overall ownership cost, and then an E-class/V90 comes very close but without the down payment. It's my mileage that brings it so close.
I may have messed up the maths on the range:
75000 * 0.9 /285 = 236, so a realistic 220 miles range?
.
Teslas are expensive but nice things in life cost more (unless you have a good accountant in which case the Tesla wouldn't - BIK etc but all beyond me so I paid for ours with post tax cash ).
This may turn into a "what car" thread, so probably the wrong forum!
It's possible that a Panamera is a closer comparison, but without the 1.5% PCP and near-zero fuel costs I couldn't afford something like the Tesla, so I'm comparing overall ownership cost, and then an E-class/V90 comes very close but without the down payment. It's my mileage that brings it so close.
I may have messed up the maths on the range:
75000 * 0.9 /285 = 236, so a realistic 220 miles range?
gangzoom said:
mr_spock said:
Not sure if I'll get one yet, the Volvo V90 is more comfy, more capacious, has TACC and lane-keeping that's almost the equal of the Tesla and costs a LOT less. !
I imagine a used Ford Mondeo has alot comfier suspension, just ad big and alot cheaper than a V90 .Teslas are expensive but nice things in life cost more (unless you have a good accountant in which case the Tesla wouldn't - BIK etc but all beyond me so I paid for ours with post tax cash )
.Edited by mr_spock on Monday 9th October 08:30
mr_spock said:
Tesla kindly lent me a 100D for the weekend, a fairly un-optioned car with leather and a sunroof but not much else. I spent much of the weekend up and down the A1, some local driving and a jaunt to the PH meet at St Neots.
It took me a while to get over the geek-fest that is the central panel and dash, and start to treat it as a car. The acceleration is nuts, as we know, but it's the 40-70 that's amazing. It's almost at bike levels of overtaking - no more "can I make it" and more "will my passenger throw up". However, get over that and it's a really competent piece of kit. With all the cameras on the A1 from the A14 down to Apex corner it's the TACC that makes it easy, combined with Autopilot. Keeping to the speed limits I was doing 280 Wh/mile, which I think gives just shy of 280 on a full battery for the 75 I'm considering. Call it 260, which is well within the range I need.
Ride on air suspension isn't as smooth as my 2003 Range Rover, or the 2003 Jag X350 which I had before. Seats are pretty firm, so not a comfy as I'd hoped - this on 19" wheels. Speaking of seats, the floorpan with the batteries in means the angle of feet to hips is pretty flat. I had a dodgy back today anyway, but it took ages to find a comfortable seating position. I'm not sure I ever did. The lumbar support is every adjustable, but maybe a bit too hard for me. Heated seat doesn't get anywhere near as hot as the Range Rover. Lots of space in the rear, and lots of load space too.
Heating and ventilation isn't very adjustable. In the Range Rover I can mix cold air into the face vents, but the Tesla has no control over even the flow rate from the face vents. Having said that, whatever it does by default is really very good anyway.
The "infotainment" is really very good. DAB radio works very well, speech activated search is genuinely useful (although couuldn't find some of my favourite artists), TuneIn and Spotify are well integrated. Even the nav is OK, although not as good as Waze, and it makes some odd routing choices to avoid relatively trivial traffic.
Autopilot is really very good, if one stays conscious of its limitations. It's mostly quite smooth and avoids exit slip roads just fine. Shiny overbanding or removed white lines which leave a shiny surface in roadworks can get confused as lane markings. It can cope with tighter curves than the Volvo system I tried, and requires less frequent reminders that the driver is awake. This may be good or bad. The TACC brakes quite late, but can be configured I think. In stop-start traffic, the two together are a miracle. No stress at all.
Steering can be configured for weight and sensitivity, and is about as feel-free as the X350. Handling is flat and grip seems good, given it's not supposed to be a sports car.
Not sure if I'll get one yet, the Volvo V90 is more comfy, more capacious, has TACC and lane-keeping that's almost the equal of the Tesla and costs a LOT less. Taking fuel into account almost levels the playing field on that front for me. And the sales guy is MUCH better!
Have a look at Heres Johnny's websiteIt took me a while to get over the geek-fest that is the central panel and dash, and start to treat it as a car. The acceleration is nuts, as we know, but it's the 40-70 that's amazing. It's almost at bike levels of overtaking - no more "can I make it" and more "will my passenger throw up". However, get over that and it's a really competent piece of kit. With all the cameras on the A1 from the A14 down to Apex corner it's the TACC that makes it easy, combined with Autopilot. Keeping to the speed limits I was doing 280 Wh/mile, which I think gives just shy of 280 on a full battery for the 75 I'm considering. Call it 260, which is well within the range I need.
Ride on air suspension isn't as smooth as my 2003 Range Rover, or the 2003 Jag X350 which I had before. Seats are pretty firm, so not a comfy as I'd hoped - this on 19" wheels. Speaking of seats, the floorpan with the batteries in means the angle of feet to hips is pretty flat. I had a dodgy back today anyway, but it took ages to find a comfortable seating position. I'm not sure I ever did. The lumbar support is every adjustable, but maybe a bit too hard for me. Heated seat doesn't get anywhere near as hot as the Range Rover. Lots of space in the rear, and lots of load space too.
Heating and ventilation isn't very adjustable. In the Range Rover I can mix cold air into the face vents, but the Tesla has no control over even the flow rate from the face vents. Having said that, whatever it does by default is really very good anyway.
The "infotainment" is really very good. DAB radio works very well, speech activated search is genuinely useful (although couuldn't find some of my favourite artists), TuneIn and Spotify are well integrated. Even the nav is OK, although not as good as Waze, and it makes some odd routing choices to avoid relatively trivial traffic.
Autopilot is really very good, if one stays conscious of its limitations. It's mostly quite smooth and avoids exit slip roads just fine. Shiny overbanding or removed white lines which leave a shiny surface in roadworks can get confused as lane markings. It can cope with tighter curves than the Volvo system I tried, and requires less frequent reminders that the driver is awake. This may be good or bad. The TACC brakes quite late, but can be configured I think. In stop-start traffic, the two together are a miracle. No stress at all.
Steering can be configured for weight and sensitivity, and is about as feel-free as the X350. Handling is flat and grip seems good, given it's not supposed to be a sports car.
Not sure if I'll get one yet, the Volvo V90 is more comfy, more capacious, has TACC and lane-keeping that's almost the equal of the Tesla and costs a LOT less. Taking fuel into account almost levels the playing field on that front for me. And the sales guy is MUCH better!
http://tesla.savemylegs.com/
A lot of good, balanced info, though if cost is important, and it should be, the S isn't going to do it.
gangzoom said:
I imagine a used Ford Mondeo has alot comfier suspension, just ad big and alot cheaper than a V90 .
Teslas are expensive but nice things in life cost more (unless you have a good accountant in which case the Tesla wouldn't - BIK etc but all beyond me so I paid for ours with post tax cash ).
.Teslas are expensive but nice things in life cost more (unless you have a good accountant in which case the Tesla wouldn't - BIK etc but all beyond me so I paid for ours with post tax cash )
.So you imagine that a used Mondeo is more comfy and spacious than a Model S?
As for your accountant theory, no, a Tesla will still cost much more than many very comparable vehicles.
REALIST123 said:
So you imagine that a used Mondeo is more comfy and spacious than a Model S?
As for your accountant theory, no, a Tesla will still cost much more than many very comparable vehicles.
But most people on this forum is probably more interested in how the thing drives rather just space/comfort and running costs.
Our Tesla is the most expensive car we have ever bought (probably ever will buy) by some £40K+ margin, but it's also by far the best, and in my book worth every single penny.
My personal experience, once someone gets their head around EV charging/range, and can see how EV will fit in with their current travel arrangements without major comprises it often becomes a matter of 'when' they get an EV rather than 'if'.
Test driving any Tesla is very bad for the bank account, if the OP can come close to affording one, new or used, I doubt they will regret the decision to get one over a V90 regardless of the cost difference.
Edited by gangzoom on Monday 9th October 13:53
Thanks, I've looked as his website (and others) lots, as you can imagine.
With my estimated mileage - could be as high as 2K per month during term time, falling to 1K or less outside that, and after 2 years my daughter leaves school so it will reduce - and assuming that I can get a second Volvo deal identical to the one for 24 months on offer now, and assuming diesel stays around £1.20, the Tesla is £4K more over 4 years. So not much really. If diesel goes up, or I drive more, it's close to break even.
This is not really a "what car", it's a "how much cash do I want to lay out up front rather than pay monthly" and a "how much risk is the cost of fuel" and a "how often do I need to move a wardrobe and can I rent a van".
And just a "do I WANT a Tesla" just because I do. Head vs heart.
With my estimated mileage - could be as high as 2K per month during term time, falling to 1K or less outside that, and after 2 years my daughter leaves school so it will reduce - and assuming that I can get a second Volvo deal identical to the one for 24 months on offer now, and assuming diesel stays around £1.20, the Tesla is £4K more over 4 years. So not much really. If diesel goes up, or I drive more, it's close to break even.
This is not really a "what car", it's a "how much cash do I want to lay out up front rather than pay monthly" and a "how much risk is the cost of fuel" and a "how often do I need to move a wardrobe and can I rent a van".
And just a "do I WANT a Tesla" just because I do. Head vs heart.
mr_spock said:
Speaking of seats, the floorpan with the batteries in means the angle of feet to hips is pretty flat. I had a dodgy back today anyway, but it took ages to find a comfortable seating position. I'm not sure I ever did. The lumbar support is every adjustable, but maybe a bit too hard for me. .
The Model X has a higher seating position and the floor space is less intruded in by the battery pack. But the suspension set up is just as hard, and if you want near 260 miles of range your need to go for the 100D X, which is actually only £1K more than a 100D S. mr_spock said:
the Tesla is £4K more over 4 years. So not much really. If diesel goes up, or I drive more, it's close to break even
Sounds like your mind is made up already!!Let us know what you end ordering
Once you do get the car join the FaceBook group (you need to be a confirmed owner to join), lots of tips and help/info for new owners (and old).
We picked up our new (insurance replacement) car a few weeks ago, been driving around in various Teslas for the last 8 months, still cannot help but smile every time I get in it, best part working this weekend was the empty roads to work on Sunday morning and a empty car park at work
If you order new, make sure you use a referral code of the £750 discount/free supercharging which ends this month, plenty of owner can give you a code if you need one.
gangzoom said:
mr_spock said:
the Tesla is £4K more over 4 years. So not much really. If diesel goes up, or I drive more, it's close to break even
Sounds like your mind is made up already!!Let us know what you end ordering
Once you do get the car join the FaceBook group (you need to be a confirmed owner to join), lots of tips and help/info for new owners (and old).
We picked up our new (insurance replacement) car a few weeks ago, been driving around in various Teslas for the last 8 months, still cannot help but smile every time I get in it, best part working this weekend was the empty roads to work on Sunday morning and a empty car park at work
If you order new, make sure you use a referral code of the £750 discount/free supercharging which ends this month, plenty of owner can give you a code if you need one.
Pity because I’d like to move technology for my daily car but without a 280 range (guaranteed) its a non starter and the looks just make it dull
keirik said:
I appreciate the technology but that looks like every other boring rep mobile. Even if it could do the journey I need to do in one go I’d still like to do it ina better looking car.
Pity because I’d like to move technology for my daily car but without a 280 range (guaranteed) its a non starter and the looks just make it dull
Don't buy one then,Pity because I’d like to move technology for my daily car but without a 280 range (guaranteed) its a non starter and the looks just make it dull
But like most cars, wheels and colours make a massive difference.
keirik said:
I appreciate the technology but that looks like every other boring rep mobile.
My last combustion car was a rep mobile too!!
Sadly my days of buying cars for the looks is far behind me, baby number 2 is on the cards at some point.
The X may not be a looker but it makes me smile, especially when this is the alternative for moving 6 people around!!
Steve57 said:
Just had a long weekend in a MX, 
looks like two cars might well be changing to one soon. Wifey wants the swap, its probably just making the numbers work and see if we keep the Zoe as a small run about or not.
How cheap is the Zoe to keep? looks like two cars might well be changing to one soon. Wifey wants the swap, its probably just making the numbers work and see if we keep the Zoe as a small run about or not. As a small run around I would try to keep it, especially for trips that involve parking in places you might not want to take a 5 meter long SUV with gullwing doors!!!
keirik said:
I appreciate the technology but that looks like every other boring rep mobile. Even if it could do the journey I need to do in one go I’d still like to do it ina better looking car.
Pity because I’d like to move technology for my daily car but without a 280 range (guaranteed) its a non starter and the looks just make it dull
I think it looking like other rep cars or just a conventional car in general is part of the appeal, up until now all the other electric cars looked a bit pants while trying to be futuristic.Pity because I’d like to move technology for my daily car but without a 280 range (guaranteed) its a non starter and the looks just make it dull
gangzoom said:
How cheap is the Zoe to keep?
As a small run around I would try to keep it, especially for trips that involve parking in places you might not want to take a 5 meter long SUV with gullwing doors!!!
Without digging it out it’s only £160 or so inc the battery lease, wifey does enjoy the Zoe for it’s ease of parking and I could always use as a station car also. As a small run around I would try to keep it, especially for trips that involve parking in places you might not want to take a 5 meter long SUV with gullwing doors!!!
That said she did cope with a discovery for several years before the Zoe.
Need to pop along to a store and see what we can agree on.
Edited by Steve57 on Friday 13th October 10:32
Edited by Steve57 on Friday 13th October 13:02
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