Help identifying BSA and getting a new V5
Discussion
Evening all.
A neighbour of my parents has just taken over an old garage from the sons of someone who died about 7-8 years ago. There was loads of old junk in there, including an old BSA that has a long been forgotten about. The bike was originally owned by the father of the guy that died, so no one really still about that knows anything about it. I'm 32 and grew up in the village and I've never seen the bike outside of the garage. I was talking to my parents neighbour on the weekend and had a quick look at the bike, and incredibly with a light push on the kickstart the engine turned, so after 30+ years stuck in an tin garage it isn't seized, and rocking it back and fore and trying the brakes they still work!
So a couple of questions,
a - how can I identify it? The reg number doesn't work on the DVLA tax checker, but I guess if just hasn't been taxed for at least 30 years. I can take some pics this weekend if that would help.
b - would I be able to get a V5 for if based just on having the reg number?
c - assuming it isn't a particularly valuable model, and its just a C15 250 or something, would it be worth getting going? Not necessarily to make money on, or even restore to original, but more as a project for myself. I've always fancied an old Brit bike since watching Heartbeat as a child, and even having ridden a few fast modern bikes, going fast on the road doesn't really interest me, I prefer to get my kicks off road on my enduro bike. Some parts are missing, and most things are quite rusty, but parts seem to be quite readily available for most BSAs, and to be honest I've never been much into chrome, so if things end up painted to look presentable thats fine.
So either try to talk me into it or out of it, just trying to get a bit of info before talking to the previous owners of the garage about it and offering them a quid quid.
Cheers
A neighbour of my parents has just taken over an old garage from the sons of someone who died about 7-8 years ago. There was loads of old junk in there, including an old BSA that has a long been forgotten about. The bike was originally owned by the father of the guy that died, so no one really still about that knows anything about it. I'm 32 and grew up in the village and I've never seen the bike outside of the garage. I was talking to my parents neighbour on the weekend and had a quick look at the bike, and incredibly with a light push on the kickstart the engine turned, so after 30+ years stuck in an tin garage it isn't seized, and rocking it back and fore and trying the brakes they still work!
So a couple of questions,
a - how can I identify it? The reg number doesn't work on the DVLA tax checker, but I guess if just hasn't been taxed for at least 30 years. I can take some pics this weekend if that would help.
b - would I be able to get a V5 for if based just on having the reg number?
c - assuming it isn't a particularly valuable model, and its just a C15 250 or something, would it be worth getting going? Not necessarily to make money on, or even restore to original, but more as a project for myself. I've always fancied an old Brit bike since watching Heartbeat as a child, and even having ridden a few fast modern bikes, going fast on the road doesn't really interest me, I prefer to get my kicks off road on my enduro bike. Some parts are missing, and most things are quite rusty, but parts seem to be quite readily available for most BSAs, and to be honest I've never been much into chrome, so if things end up painted to look presentable thats fine.
So either try to talk me into it or out of it, just trying to get a bit of info before talking to the previous owners of the garage about it and offering them a quid quid.
Cheers
Some pics would help to identify the model of bike.
The frame number is often on the front engine mounting assuming it's not on the headstock. I'm assuming it's been registered at some point in the road, so you may be able to apply to the DVLA saying you've lost the v5 and need it based on the frame no.
If you need to register it as "new" on an age related plate you can join the owners club or VMCC and an inspector will give it a look over to identify it then you can apply for a first registration once you've got an MOT on it. I'm talking as someone who's just registered an imported BSA so the process might be a little different for you.
Main thing, find the frame and or engine number. And get some pics up!
The frame number is often on the front engine mounting assuming it's not on the headstock. I'm assuming it's been registered at some point in the road, so you may be able to apply to the DVLA saying you've lost the v5 and need it based on the frame no.
If you need to register it as "new" on an age related plate you can join the owners club or VMCC and an inspector will give it a look over to identify it then you can apply for a first registration once you've got an MOT on it. I'm talking as someone who's just registered an imported BSA so the process might be a little different for you.
Main thing, find the frame and or engine number. And get some pics up!
You'll be easily able to tell the model from the engine number.
If it has a desperate gearbox then it's most likely pre60(ish) and again most likely to be something like a B31 (350cc single) as they were quite common.
If it has rear suspension (of any type, first was 'plunger' before swinging arm) it'll be post 1950(Ish).
If you have the original number plate you may very well be able to recover that registration but it'll be non-transferable (i.e. you can't sell it or remove it from that bike) but nice to have. Otherwise you can get an age-related one if not but makes it less attractive to buyers.
As for is it worth it, all old BSAs are in demand now and whilst you may not retire from the proceeds (unless the engine number starts MC21
) it will make someone's year to be able to restore it and get it back on the road.
If you post pictures I'm sure we can identify it for you and point you in the right direction for parts or information
If it has a desperate gearbox then it's most likely pre60(ish) and again most likely to be something like a B31 (350cc single) as they were quite common.
If it has rear suspension (of any type, first was 'plunger' before swinging arm) it'll be post 1950(Ish).
If you have the original number plate you may very well be able to recover that registration but it'll be non-transferable (i.e. you can't sell it or remove it from that bike) but nice to have. Otherwise you can get an age-related one if not but makes it less attractive to buyers.
As for is it worth it, all old BSAs are in demand now and whilst you may not retire from the proceeds (unless the engine number starts MC21
) it will make someone's year to be able to restore it and get it back on the road. If you post pictures I'm sure we can identify it for you and point you in the right direction for parts or information
Well until I got up there on Saturday, I can try to fill in some answers to above questions.
It's a single cylinder (round I think)
It's got rear suspension, not sure which type, but I didn't notice anything unusual, and I'm used to swing arms, so maybe swing arm type.
The plate is 3 numbers then 3 letters, so don't know if that helps date it. All I know is its before '63 on a 6 digit plate.
The seat is a 'normal' type seat. Not a single saddle, but don't know if that really narrows it down.
The only other thing I can remember is its hot chrome fork stanchions between the top and bottom yokes, where as alt of pics I've seen have got black stanchions. And I think it's got gaiters on the forks.
I'll try and find a frame number when I go up there.
If anyone gets it right from the above I info then they deserve a virtual pint. Haha
Assuming it's a late 50s early 60s bike, what are they like to ride? I've got this romantic vision of riding around like Nick Berry with a leather jacket and a piss pot helmet on a Sunday morning, but living in the south Wales valleys there are plenty of hills about, is it going to be pain fully slow?
Thanks again for all the replies.
It's a single cylinder (round I think)
It's got rear suspension, not sure which type, but I didn't notice anything unusual, and I'm used to swing arms, so maybe swing arm type.
The plate is 3 numbers then 3 letters, so don't know if that helps date it. All I know is its before '63 on a 6 digit plate.
The seat is a 'normal' type seat. Not a single saddle, but don't know if that really narrows it down.
The only other thing I can remember is its hot chrome fork stanchions between the top and bottom yokes, where as alt of pics I've seen have got black stanchions. And I think it's got gaiters on the forks.
I'll try and find a frame number when I go up there.
If anyone gets it right from the above I info then they deserve a virtual pint. Haha
Assuming it's a late 50s early 60s bike, what are they like to ride? I've got this romantic vision of riding around like Nick Berry with a leather jacket and a piss pot helmet on a Sunday morning, but living in the south Wales valleys there are plenty of hills about, is it going to be pain fully slow?
Thanks again for all the replies.
Does sound like a B31, which is the 350cc overhead valve single. If it is, it'll happily sit at 50mph and pull up whatever hills are thrown at you. They're a steady kind of bike but actually as much fun as pretty much any British bike you'll ride!
Your idea of riding about like someone off Heartbeat is pretty much spot on and pretty much why I ride these kinds of bikes too! I'm only a couple of years older than you and me and the mrs are out a lot of Sunday mornings riding our Velocette Venom (1960s 500cc single) and it is basically like that; just proper fun.
The social side of old bikes is great too - not just in the riding about with other old bikes (join the VMCC, there'll be a local group to you and there'll be some very helpful people there) but also that almost everyone you meet when you're out on it will smile and be happy to see you. It's a very different experience to riding a modern bike of any description.
Your idea of riding about like someone off Heartbeat is pretty much spot on and pretty much why I ride these kinds of bikes too! I'm only a couple of years older than you and me and the mrs are out a lot of Sunday mornings riding our Velocette Venom (1960s 500cc single) and it is basically like that; just proper fun.
The social side of old bikes is great too - not just in the riding about with other old bikes (join the VMCC, there'll be a local group to you and there'll be some very helpful people there) but also that almost everyone you meet when you're out on it will smile and be happy to see you. It's a very different experience to riding a modern bike of any description.
Update!
I had a day off work today so I popped up there and had a nose.
It's a 250 (at least that's what it says on the side of the engine) and I found the engine number, but couldn't find the frame number, but if anyone can point me to the right place I can pop in before I leave my parents.
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![](https://thumbsnap.com/sc/HdELtCRc.jpg[/img]|https://thumbsnap.com/HdELtCRc[/url] <a href="https://thumbsnap.com/FqjXDcec" Target="_blank" rel="nofollow">[img]https://thumbsnap.com/sc/FqjXDcec.jpg)
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|https://thumbsnap.com/Eu9aSfJ2[/url]
So there it is. I guess that makes it a C15. So the next question is it savage? And more importantly is it worth saving? What you see is all there is, fuel tank and oil tank missing, and various bits and bolts. So it needs alt of new bits.
Any information anyone can shed on it is appreciated.
Cheers
I had a day off work today so I popped up there and had a nose.
It's a 250 (at least that's what it says on the side of the engine) and I found the engine number, but couldn't find the frame number, but if anyone can point me to the right place I can pop in before I leave my parents.
[url]
[url]
|https://thumbsnap.com/Eu9aSfJ2[/url]So there it is. I guess that makes it a C15. So the next question is it savage? And more importantly is it worth saving? What you see is all there is, fuel tank and oil tank missing, and various bits and bolts. So it needs alt of new bits.
Any information anyone can shed on it is appreciated.
Cheers
In my head I was thinking of a cheaper smaller version of a T120 bonneville Black. Not bothered about standard bits, just a combination of matt./shiny black with only a few bits of chrome.
Or maybe take inspiration from a ducati scrambler. More function than some, and with trials style tyres.
Or maybe take inspiration from a ducati scrambler. More function than some, and with trials style tyres.
Wacky Racer said:
Yes, a C15....tbh, it looks like a load of old scrap.
I had one of these as a field bike when I was fourteen, paid £6 for it iirc.
Don't waste your time restoring it, it will be worth now't when you have finished.
The reg number might be worth a few bob though.
Firstly, don't listen to this. I had one of these as a field bike when I was fourteen, paid £6 for it iirc.
Don't waste your time restoring it, it will be worth now't when you have finished.
The reg number might be worth a few bob though.
You won't make your fortune restoring it but you'd have loads of fun and be saving something from 'scrap' which is always worthwhile.
It looks to be largely there with the exception of the tank. It's hard to tell the state of the engine but you mentioned before that it turned over so that's half the battle. The cases look 'furry' so would give them a clean up first and see how they go.
There were a few versions of the C15 including sports ones although it looks to me like someone's had a go at caff racering that one in the past so suspect it was a standard one.
I'd be tempted to make it into a green laner. C15s have quite a following in old trials and I think you could make a nice little off-road looking machine with a nice polished alloy tank and stainless guards.
Something like this, but with a headlight:
srob said:
Wacky Racer said:
Yes, a C15....tbh, it looks like a load of old scrap.
I had one of these as a field bike when I was fourteen, paid £6 for it iirc.
Don't waste your time restoring it, it will be worth now't when you have finished.
The reg number might be worth a few bob though.
Firstly, don't listen to this. I had one of these as a field bike when I was fourteen, paid £6 for it iirc.
Don't waste your time restoring it, it will be worth now't when you have finished.
The reg number might be worth a few bob though.
You won't make your fortune restoring it but you'd have loads of fun and be saving something from 'scrap' which is always worthwhile.
It looks to be largely there with the exception of the tank. It's hard to tell the state of the engine but you mentioned before that it turned over so that's half the battle. The cases look 'furry' so would give them a clean up first and see how they go.
There were a few versions of the C15 including sports ones although it looks to me like someone's had a go at caff racering that one in the past so suspect it was a standard one.
I'd be tempted to make it into a green laner. C15s have quite a following in old trials and I think you could make a nice little off-road looking machine with a nice polished alloy tank and stainless guards.
Something like this, but with a headlight:
.You could easily spend 2k restoring that rusty heap to mint condition, the internals are almost certainly shot, and the bike would not be worth much more than that when you have finished.
C15's are not really that collectable, and were ten a penny in the 50's and 60's.
However, I agree, if you wanted a long term d-I-y project, you certainly could have a lot of fun, and learn a lot in the process. That is a different matter entirely.
I was looking at it from a purely financial point of view, once you have factored in the hundreds of man hours spent.
I'm with SRobs thinking but find someone who has already set up a C15 (or B40) as a trials machine as they will probably have the original forks & many other components to hand as they will have swapped these to proper period looking better items.
But as WR said, getting it anything like original will be a fruitless exercise.
eta - just spotted the headlight brackets & turned down bars - forget all of the above & sell I to some hipster as a barn find genuine café racer!!
But as WR said, getting it anything like original will be a fruitless exercise.
eta - just spotted the headlight brackets & turned down bars - forget all of the above & sell I to some hipster as a barn find genuine café racer!!
Thanks for the replies.
The project would just be something for me to do for myself, and to end up with an interesting little road bike I can use on sunny Sundays. So Not worried about making an original bike or trying to make money from it.
Any idea on age, the 6 digit plate means pre '63 I think, and for some reason the picture of the engine number didn't show in my post earlier so here it is,
I can't quite make out what the first digits are, just the 14068. Is that the engine number? I tried a few Brit bike pages, but couldn't really make much sense from them. But if I had to make an educate guess, maybe '61?
Having had a quick look today the frame all seems solid, with all the rusty bits appearing to have been chromed parts. But as I said before, nothing seems seized, forks and rear shocks all move, brakes both work, and the engine turns over easily but I would give it at least a partial rebuilt before trying to run it. I quite like the idea of a black engine as well so the furry or pitted cases won't be too much of a problem.
What I was thinking of was the scrambler type style as posted by Srob but in black with inspiration from the T120 Black and the Ducati Scrambler. Skills wise I can do the mechanicals, the electrics, and would be happy with the paint finish I could do, the only thing I can't do is weld. But hopefully I can source enough parts that would bolt on easily without having to fabricate too much, although if I need to I've got friends who can weld and a brother who knows his way around CNC machines. I was even thinking to maybe do some modern touches like LED lighting so make it a bit different (although if the electrics are 6v that might not be as easy). I just fancy having something to fiddle with to get away from things for a few hours a week and end up with something that I can use.
I'm hoping that money wise I can offer the brothers who effectively own it a hundred quid or so and they'd be happy. Their father was a serial project starter and mostly didn't finish things, so there are a few things that are no better than scrap in the garage and field next to his house that need getting rid of (including a Moggie 1000) and can't see them ever doing anything with the bike.
The project would just be something for me to do for myself, and to end up with an interesting little road bike I can use on sunny Sundays. So Not worried about making an original bike or trying to make money from it.
Any idea on age, the 6 digit plate means pre '63 I think, and for some reason the picture of the engine number didn't show in my post earlier so here it is,
I can't quite make out what the first digits are, just the 14068. Is that the engine number? I tried a few Brit bike pages, but couldn't really make much sense from them. But if I had to make an educate guess, maybe '61?
Having had a quick look today the frame all seems solid, with all the rusty bits appearing to have been chromed parts. But as I said before, nothing seems seized, forks and rear shocks all move, brakes both work, and the engine turns over easily but I would give it at least a partial rebuilt before trying to run it. I quite like the idea of a black engine as well so the furry or pitted cases won't be too much of a problem.
What I was thinking of was the scrambler type style as posted by Srob but in black with inspiration from the T120 Black and the Ducati Scrambler. Skills wise I can do the mechanicals, the electrics, and would be happy with the paint finish I could do, the only thing I can't do is weld. But hopefully I can source enough parts that would bolt on easily without having to fabricate too much, although if I need to I've got friends who can weld and a brother who knows his way around CNC machines. I was even thinking to maybe do some modern touches like LED lighting so make it a bit different (although if the electrics are 6v that might not be as easy). I just fancy having something to fiddle with to get away from things for a few hours a week and end up with something that I can use.
I'm hoping that money wise I can offer the brothers who effectively own it a hundred quid or so and they'd be happy. Their father was a serial project starter and mostly didn't finish things, so there are a few things that are no better than scrap in the garage and field next to his house that need getting rid of (including a Moggie 1000) and can't see them ever doing anything with the bike.
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