Lithium batteries and the Post Office
Discussion
Posting (no pun intended!) this here as it seems the best place for brains to answer this Condundrum of Corporate Policy...
I go to post a cheap watch to a friend. Lady at PO counter asks me what's in the parcel. 'A watch' say I. 'Does it it have a battery in it?' 'Yes'.
She picks up a lamimated sheet with symbols and barcodes on it and scans one of them. 'Beep'.
I ask her what this is for. 'Because it's got a battery in it, and they can catch fire'.
'Ah', say I, 'fair point. So does the parcel go by a different route? 'No'. 'Is it treated in a different way from the rest?' 'No'. Does it get there any slower?' 'No'. 'So why do you need to know if it has a battery in it?' 'Because if you don't declare it, and it's found, they'll destroy the package'.
Now either the lithium battery is a fire risk, in which case it should go by some special 'hazards' service in a steel box, or it is not, in which case it can go in the normal post. Which it does. The Post Office are clearly not going to mix a fire-risk in with ordinary mail - yet they happily send my watch by normal mail.
What is the point of the declaration? Because they might destroy it otherwise. But it's safe enough to go by normal post, so why destroy something that is safe enough to go with everything else...?
I have run out of logic.
I go to post a cheap watch to a friend. Lady at PO counter asks me what's in the parcel. 'A watch' say I. 'Does it it have a battery in it?' 'Yes'.
She picks up a lamimated sheet with symbols and barcodes on it and scans one of them. 'Beep'.
I ask her what this is for. 'Because it's got a battery in it, and they can catch fire'.
'Ah', say I, 'fair point. So does the parcel go by a different route? 'No'. 'Is it treated in a different way from the rest?' 'No'. Does it get there any slower?' 'No'. 'So why do you need to know if it has a battery in it?' 'Because if you don't declare it, and it's found, they'll destroy the package'.
Now either the lithium battery is a fire risk, in which case it should go by some special 'hazards' service in a steel box, or it is not, in which case it can go in the normal post. Which it does. The Post Office are clearly not going to mix a fire-risk in with ordinary mail - yet they happily send my watch by normal mail.
What is the point of the declaration? Because they might destroy it otherwise. But it's safe enough to go by normal post, so why destroy something that is safe enough to go with everything else...?
I have run out of logic.
Their web sits says this about lithium batteries.
Lithium ion/polymer/metal/alloy batteries when not sent with, or contained in/connected to an electronic device, are prohibited.
Lithium ion/polymer/metal/alloy batteries are allowed when sent with or contained in/connected to an electronic device, but are subject to packaging, volume and quantity restrictions.
So what is she on about?
I remember a guy who received a circular saw blade via the Post Office, wrong size, when he took it to the post office to send back they wouldn't let him post it as it was dangerous........
Lithium ion/polymer/metal/alloy batteries when not sent with, or contained in/connected to an electronic device, are prohibited.
Lithium ion/polymer/metal/alloy batteries are allowed when sent with or contained in/connected to an electronic device, but are subject to packaging, volume and quantity restrictions.
So what is she on about?
I remember a guy who received a circular saw blade via the Post Office, wrong size, when he took it to the post office to send back they wouldn't let him post it as it was dangerous........
Edited by Vipers on Saturday 23 December 12:25
ReverendCounter said:
You can sign up for a click & Drop account and buy your postage online. No ridiculous hoops to jump through, click a simple declaration, print your postage, package and drop your item in the postbox. No queues, no pointless/senseless procedures.
Actually I quite like the excuse for a walk. But there's still a declaration to sign, so the logic obstacle still exists...B17NNS said:
Using the post office really has become a dreadful user experience. Bloody expensive too.
Tell me about it. Box 20 kg to USA, £20.00, had it weighed a rats hair over, now it's £40.00.Used Parcels 2 of, forget weight, but certainly over 20 kg was £17.00 arrived safe and sound.
WinstonWolf said:
The reason is some internal mail goes by air, you can thank the CAA for the rule...
^ThisBut it's IATA that make the rules, the CAA have to follow.
The reason is, when they plan the load manifest for the aircraft, they wont put flammable material (lipo batteries for example) next to highly combustible material.
If the PO needs to, they will just put the package on the train rather than fly it.
justinio said:
WinstonWolf said:
The reason is some internal mail goes by air, you can thank the CAA for the rule...
^ThisBut it's IATA that make the rules, the CAA have to follow.
The reason is, when they plan the load manifest for the aircraft, they wont put flammable material (lipo batteries for example) next to highly combustible material.
If the PO needs to, they will just put the package on the train rather than fly it.
Simpo Two said:
So for any of this to make sense, the package would have to be visually or electroncially tagged somehow... all I saw going on was a first class postage label.
I suspect it's linked to the "beep" when she scanned a barcode.Guessing it's linked to a reference or something on the postage label and it gets picked up when it's scanned on its route.
Worst case https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ValuJet_Flight_592
b
hstewie said:
hstewie said: I suspect it's linked to the "beep" when she scanned a barcode.
Guessing it's linked to a reference or something on the postage label and it gets picked up when it's scanned on its route.
That makes sense.Guessing it's linked to a reference or something on the postage label and it gets picked up when it's scanned on its route.
However the flight you linked to was brought down by chemical oxygen generators. It's more likely https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UPS_Airlines_Flight_... but even that took 81,000 batteries with 'other combustible materials'.
Let's hope the PO van with my watch on board didn't explode on its 20-mile journey!
The battery rules are a right royal pain in the arse.
We sell a lot of laptops and would have used dhl for orders over 1 unit.
The customs guys sitting in the DHL depot started returning packages to us with more than 3 laptops in them as they were considered a risk. In the end we voted with our feet as we couldnt be arsed with the paper work they wanted to accompany each package that contained more than 1 laptop.
We sell a lot of laptops and would have used dhl for orders over 1 unit.
The customs guys sitting in the DHL depot started returning packages to us with more than 3 laptops in them as they were considered a risk. In the end we voted with our feet as we couldnt be arsed with the paper work they wanted to accompany each package that contained more than 1 laptop.
j4ckos mate said:
the trouble is faulty ones are a fire risk,
there is probably 8 or 9 different scenarios
ranging from completely forbidden to ok on freighters and ok passenger aircraft.
the rules and regs are constantly changing
The thing is, they dont even need to be faulty to be a fire risk. They can be perfectly fine, but if a lithium battery gets pierced, it will go into thermal runaway and catch fire very quickly, and burn very hot.there is probably 8 or 9 different scenarios
ranging from completely forbidden to ok on freighters and ok passenger aircraft.
the rules and regs are constantly changing
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