Insuring a PCH car
Discussion
I wonder whether someone can help and point me in the right direction as I'm running into a bit of an issue.
I've got a new Golf R on the way through PCH and have been working out juggling insurance around on my existing car and the new one. I'm insured with Aviva through quotemehappy.com on my current car with 7 years no claims; no problems. I also spoke to ALA Insurance today about GAP insurance on the new car and they mentioned to check with my proposed insurer whether their policy in the event of total loss in the first year was to replace with a brand new car as this could leave me in a tricky situation where the car is replaced but the finance on the total loss car is not 'settled'.
Ringing around a few insurers today, it seems that this 'new for old in the first year' is fairly common and I'm not quite sure how to get the insurance I need for the new car...
Additionally one of the insurers (AA) told me that I would need to be registered as the first keeper but with a PCH it's my understanding that the owner and registered keeper is always the leasing company, not the driver (and in confused.com I'd been entering the RK and RO as 'Leased - Personal' - was this incorrect)?
My plan was to change the car on my QMH policy to the new Golf, leaving my NCD etc exactly as-is. I would then insure my BMW separately (with no NCD) on another policy somewhere in the short-term until it's sold. If I'm not able to insure the Golf with QMH, I'll need to insure it elsewhere and move the NCD to the new policy, leaving the BMW with QMH and cancel with them when it sells.
This is my first time leasing a car personally so I'm not quite sure how to get the insurance I need. Should I be talking to a broker rather than trying to arrange it myself? Have I misunderstood about the way the Golf needs to be insured?
It's thrown me a bit of a curve ball and I'd really appreciate some advice from those who know.
I've got a new Golf R on the way through PCH and have been working out juggling insurance around on my existing car and the new one. I'm insured with Aviva through quotemehappy.com on my current car with 7 years no claims; no problems. I also spoke to ALA Insurance today about GAP insurance on the new car and they mentioned to check with my proposed insurer whether their policy in the event of total loss in the first year was to replace with a brand new car as this could leave me in a tricky situation where the car is replaced but the finance on the total loss car is not 'settled'.
Ringing around a few insurers today, it seems that this 'new for old in the first year' is fairly common and I'm not quite sure how to get the insurance I need for the new car...
Additionally one of the insurers (AA) told me that I would need to be registered as the first keeper but with a PCH it's my understanding that the owner and registered keeper is always the leasing company, not the driver (and in confused.com I'd been entering the RK and RO as 'Leased - Personal' - was this incorrect)?My plan was to change the car on my QMH policy to the new Golf, leaving my NCD etc exactly as-is. I would then insure my BMW separately (with no NCD) on another policy somewhere in the short-term until it's sold. If I'm not able to insure the Golf with QMH, I'll need to insure it elsewhere and move the NCD to the new policy, leaving the BMW with QMH and cancel with them when it sells.
This is my first time leasing a car personally so I'm not quite sure how to get the insurance I need. Should I be talking to a broker rather than trying to arrange it myself? Have I misunderstood about the way the Golf needs to be insured?
It's thrown me a bit of a curve ball and I'd really appreciate some advice from those who know.
Not sure I can fully help but say I'm in the same situation of moving from owner to PCH.
I've established that I think I'm best:
- Cancelling my existing policy with Tesco and take the cancellation fee hit.
- Finding the cheapest insurer where I am not the registered keeeper and start a new policy
- Take out separate GAP to cover the future payment liability and initial deposit cover.
Happy to hear if there's a better way I can do this.
I've established that I think I'm best:
- Cancelling my existing policy with Tesco and take the cancellation fee hit.
- Finding the cheapest insurer where I am not the registered keeeper and start a new policy
- Take out separate GAP to cover the future payment liability and initial deposit cover.
Happy to hear if there's a better way I can do this.
The key issue seems to be primarily around the fact that in the event of total loss, some insurers would simply buy you a new car. The problem is that the lease finance is tied to the written-off car and needs to be settled which a new car wouldn't do.
Edit: I've just had Hastings tell me they wouldn't be able to insure either as I wouldn't be the RK or the RO of the car despite me putting into the comparison site that the RK and RO would be 'Personal Leased' rather than 'Policyholder'.
I'm starting to get a little concerned I may struggle to find insurance at a sensible price - difference in price through the comparison sites was minimal over my current car but now they're telling me that they can't insure me.
Edit: I've just had Hastings tell me they wouldn't be able to insure either as I wouldn't be the RK or the RO of the car despite me putting into the comparison site that the RK and RO would be 'Personal Leased' rather than 'Policyholder'.
I'm starting to get a little concerned I may struggle to find insurance at a sensible price - difference in price through the comparison sites was minimal over my current car but now they're telling me that they can't insure me.
Edited by Funk on Thursday 11th January 18:10
Funk said:
I wonder whether someone can help and point me in the right direction as I'm running into a bit of an issue.
I've got a new Golf R on the way through PCH and have been working out juggling insurance around on my existing car and the new one. I'm insured with Aviva through quotemehappy.com on my current car with 7 years no claims; no problems. I also spoke to ALA Insurance today about GAP insurance on the new car and they mentioned to check with my proposed insurer whether their policy in the event of total loss in the first year was to replace with a brand new car as this could leave me in a tricky situation where the car is replaced but the finance on the total loss car is not 'settled'.
Ala confused you. Just insure the car as usual and mention you're not registered owner and keeper. And just buy GAP insurance covering your initial payments. Forget about new for old car option with some insurance companies, it won't cover you, because you're not registered owner or keeper. I've got a new Golf R on the way through PCH and have been working out juggling insurance around on my existing car and the new one. I'm insured with Aviva through quotemehappy.com on my current car with 7 years no claims; no problems. I also spoke to ALA Insurance today about GAP insurance on the new car and they mentioned to check with my proposed insurer whether their policy in the event of total loss in the first year was to replace with a brand new car as this could leave me in a tricky situation where the car is replaced but the finance on the total loss car is not 'settled'.
Wacky Racer said:
Thanks, I've seen that and have a quote from ALA for it.It may all be moot if I can't insure the car at all!
PenelopaPitstop said:
Ala confused you. Just insure the car as usual and mention you're not registered owner and keeper. And just buy GAP insurance covering your initial payments. Forget about new for old car option with some insurance companies, it won't cover you, because you're not registered owner or keeper.
Are you sure? Both AA and Hastings have said today that they wouldn't insure me at all if I'm not the RK/RO and my name's not on the V5 document. I really want to make sure that I don't get this wrong and end up in a pickle.I share the exact same concerns as you, but loads of people lease here so there must be something we are missing, or you've been unlucky speaking to 2 insurers that don't really cover PCH.
Don't fret, there'll be a few experienced players come here shortly and tell us the errors of our ways!
Have you read your lease terms yet? Might say in there. Think mine seemed to suggest the lease company would settle direct with the insurer so that's why I need gap.
Don't fret, there'll be a few experienced players come here shortly and tell us the errors of our ways!
Have you read your lease terms yet? Might say in there. Think mine seemed to suggest the lease company would settle direct with the insurer so that's why I need gap.
PenelopaPitstop said:
That's another matter and their choice not to insure cars when you are not RK and RO but you started with confusion about 1 year new for old replacement. Most companies have nothing against personal lease.
Ok, so I do need to find a way to filter out those insurers who won't insure for anyone not named on the V5. Confused.com doesn't seem to do that.I'm still not sure the 'new for old' isn't an issue either. I'll call Arval tomorrow and ask as well as asking here.
I'm not leasing, but on my new car, I specifically went for the 4 year GAP including the first year.
My current insurers do new for old at less than 12 months, but my renewal is due in March and I can't guarantee that my new insurer will have new for old. Plus, GAP insurers like to add a surcharge for missing out the first year (pllicybtgen extends to 5 years).
You wont be too bad with 7 years ncb but remember if you cancel your current policy, even if it's been running for 11 months and 29 days, you won't get the year's ncb - which can be quite expensive.
I've heard that some insurers don't like leases - just have to do millions of repetitive quotes :-)
Treat GAP as separate.
My current insurers do new for old at less than 12 months, but my renewal is due in March and I can't guarantee that my new insurer will have new for old. Plus, GAP insurers like to add a surcharge for missing out the first year (pllicybtgen extends to 5 years).
You wont be too bad with 7 years ncb but remember if you cancel your current policy, even if it's been running for 11 months and 29 days, you won't get the year's ncb - which can be quite expensive.
I've heard that some insurers don't like leases - just have to do millions of repetitive quotes :-)
Treat GAP as separate.
80-90% of insurers will cover PCH or BCH.
I’ve just switched from AXA to Quote me happy on my ALLTRACK for £262 / year. They both definitely do PCH.
When my lease runs out I’ll either cancel existing policy (£50 fee with QMH) or if the change of car on the existing policy is cheaper than switching + £50, I’ll stay with them.
Just make sure when you transfer from the comparison website to the insurers website the options for RK & RO are still ticked as private lease.
On QMH the terms for this are buried in the ‘assumptions we made’.
As others have said forget 1st year new for old, get proper GAP insurance if thats what you need.
I’ve just switched from AXA to Quote me happy on my ALLTRACK for £262 / year. They both definitely do PCH.
When my lease runs out I’ll either cancel existing policy (£50 fee with QMH) or if the change of car on the existing policy is cheaper than switching + £50, I’ll stay with them.
Just make sure when you transfer from the comparison website to the insurers website the options for RK & RO are still ticked as private lease.
On QMH the terms for this are buried in the ‘assumptions we made’.
As others have said forget 1st year new for old, get proper GAP insurance if thats what you need.
AlwynMike said:
I'm not leasing, but on my new car, I specifically went for the 4 year GAP including the first year.
My current insurers do new for old at less than 12 months, but my renewal is due in March and I can't guarantee that my new insurer will have new for old. Plus, GAP insurers like to add a surcharge for missing out the first year (pllicybtgen extends to 5 years).
You wont be too bad with 7 years ncb but remember if you cancel your current policy, even if it's been running for 11 months and 29 days, you won't get the year's ncb - which can be quite expensive.
I've heard that some insurers don't like leases - just have to do millions of repetitive quotes :-)
Treat GAP as separate.
The leasing bit seems to be the thing that makes a fundamental difference; I've been thinking about how it works and the best I can come up with is this:My current insurers do new for old at less than 12 months, but my renewal is due in March and I can't guarantee that my new insurer will have new for old. Plus, GAP insurers like to add a surcharge for missing out the first year (pllicybtgen extends to 5 years).
You wont be too bad with 7 years ncb but remember if you cancel your current policy, even if it's been running for 11 months and 29 days, you won't get the year's ncb - which can be quite expensive.
I've heard that some insurers don't like leases - just have to do millions of repetitive quotes :-)
Treat GAP as separate.
1) Lease company own the car. They have an interest in it, having paid 'x' for it and then charging interest/rental fees on it.
2) Car gets written off - lease company are now minus a car and want their money back as their interest is no longer car-shaped.
3) Insurers provide a new car to me under my policy. Great, but doesn't clear the finance with the leasing co as the car supplied isn't the one the finance is against.
4) Leasing co still want their money back and come after me for it and aren't interested in the car provided by the insurers.
Ham_and_Jam said:
80-90% of insurers will cover PCH or BCH.
I’ve just switched from AXA to Quote me happy on my ALLTRACK for £262 / year. They both definitely do PCH.
When my lease runs out I’ll either cancel existing policy (£50 fee with QMH) or if the change of car on the existing policy is cheaper than switching + £50, I’ll stay with them.
Just make sure when you transfer from the comparison website to the insurers website the options for RK & RO are still ticked as private lease.
On QMH the terms for this are buried in the ‘assumptions we made’.
As others have said forget 1st year new for old, get proper GAP insurance if thats what you need.
I would double-check - it's Quote Me Happy who I'm with at the moment and who told me today that they couldn't insure me on that basis. They said that it needs to be my name on V5 and I need to be the registered keeper/owner of the car.I’ve just switched from AXA to Quote me happy on my ALLTRACK for £262 / year. They both definitely do PCH.
When my lease runs out I’ll either cancel existing policy (£50 fee with QMH) or if the change of car on the existing policy is cheaper than switching + £50, I’ll stay with them.
Just make sure when you transfer from the comparison website to the insurers website the options for RK & RO are still ticked as private lease.
On QMH the terms for this are buried in the ‘assumptions we made’.
As others have said forget 1st year new for old, get proper GAP insurance if thats what you need.
It's entirely possible I've been misinformed, hence checking all of this very, very carefully. I can't afford to be in a position where I owe £35k+ on a car to the leasing company and the insurers are refusing to pay out and insisting on replacement within the first year.
I tried calling Arval tonight for clarification but they were out of the door by 17:15. I'll ring them in the morning and ask as it's their ball I'll be playing with.
Funk said:
I would double-check - it's Quote Me Happy who I'm with at the moment and who told me today that they couldn't insure me on that basis. They said that it needs to be my name on V5 and I need to be the registered keeper/owner of the car.
I am currently with Quote Me Happy and my car switched from being a lease to me buying it this year. VWFS were the registered owner and keeper on the policy IIRC.Funk said:
I would double-check - it's Quote Me Happy who I'm with at the moment and who told me today that they couldn't insure me on that basis. They said that it needs to be my name on V5 and I need to be the registered keeper/owner of the car.
It's entirely possible I've been misinformed, hence checking all of this very, very carefully. I can't afford to be in a position where I owe £35k+ on a car to the leasing company and the insurers are refusing to pay out and insisting on replacement within the first year.
I tried calling Arval tonight for clarification but they were out of the door by 17:15. I'll ring them in the morning and ask as it's their ball I'll be playing with.
100% sure QMH do PCH.It's entirely possible I've been misinformed, hence checking all of this very, very carefully. I can't afford to be in a position where I owe £35k+ on a car to the leasing company and the insurers are refusing to pay out and insisting on replacement within the first year.
I tried calling Arval tonight for clarification but they were out of the door by 17:15. I'll ring them in the morning and ask as it's their ball I'll be playing with.
After doing an online quote, you can review your policy before purchasing.
In the ‘assumptions we made’ heading, it quotes-
‘You are NOT the registered owner’
‘You are NOT the registered keeper’
I wouldn’t take much notice of some telephone twerp. Take a look yourself. The policy is very clear, and in black & white.
Most insurers do PCH now, its a big chunk of car drivers, why wouldn’t they?
I’ve had a few lease cars now & never had a problem. A few insurers disappear when you click PCH, but it never seems to affect who I would choose or what price I end up paying
Edit: just seen you Arval comment. As far as they are concerned, they will just say it must be insured correctly (them as RO & RK). I very much doubt they will recommend or comment on individual policies.
Edited by Ham_and_Jam on Thursday 11th January 20:13
Edited by Ham_and_Jam on Thursday 11th January 20:14
Edited by Ham_and_Jam on Thursday 11th January 20:15
Ham_and_Jam said:
100% sure QMH do PCH.
After doing an online quote, you can review your policy before purchasing.
In the ‘assumptions we made’ heading, it quotes-
‘You are NOT the registered owner’
‘You are NOT the registered keeper’
I wouldn’t take much notice of some telephone twerp. Take a look yourself. The policy is very clear, and in black & white.
Most insurers do PCH now, its a big chunk of car drivers, why wouldn’t they?
I’ve had a few lease cars now & never had a problem. A few insurers disappear when you click PCH, but it never seems to affect who I would choose or what price I end up paying
Edit: just seen you Arval comment. As far as they are concerned, they will just say it must be insured correctly (them as RO & RK). I very much doubt they will recommend or comment on individual policies.
Interesting.After doing an online quote, you can review your policy before purchasing.
In the ‘assumptions we made’ heading, it quotes-
‘You are NOT the registered owner’
‘You are NOT the registered keeper’
I wouldn’t take much notice of some telephone twerp. Take a look yourself. The policy is very clear, and in black & white.
Most insurers do PCH now, its a big chunk of car drivers, why wouldn’t they?
I’ve had a few lease cars now & never had a problem. A few insurers disappear when you click PCH, but it never seems to affect who I would choose or what price I end up paying
Edit: just seen you Arval comment. As far as they are concerned, they will just say it must be insured correctly (them as RO & RK). I very much doubt they will recommend or comment on individual policies.
I'm not doing a new policy though, I'll be amending my existing one. I have the option there to set 'Lease - Private' for RO & RK when amending the policy.
Does the issue of new-for-old not still raise its head in the event of a total loss though?
I believe you're over thinking this..
You will only get a new for old cover if you are the first and only registered keeper. On a lease car you won't be so the cover doesn't apply (it would for PCP, but not PCH).
My car insurance is with LV, but there are loads that cover personal lease cars.
So take a good GAP policy, that covers your up front payment, and rest easy.
You will only get a new for old cover if you are the first and only registered keeper. On a lease car you won't be so the cover doesn't apply (it would for PCP, but not PCH).
My car insurance is with LV, but there are loads that cover personal lease cars.
So take a good GAP policy, that covers your up front payment, and rest easy.
Funk said:
3) Insurers provide a new car to me under my policy. Great, but doesn't clear the finance with the leasing co as the car supplied isn't the one the finance is against.
4) Leasing co still want their money back and come after me for it and aren't interested in the car provided by the insurers.
Insurer won't give you new car because it would be against their policy, you're not RK or RO, so 3 and 4 are wrong assumptions.4) Leasing co still want their money back and come after me for it and aren't interested in the car provided by the insurers.
Funk said:
Interesting.
I'm not doing a new policy though, I'll be amending my existing one. I have the option there to set 'Lease - Private' for RO & RK when amending the policy.
Does the issue of new-for-old not still raise its head in the event of a total loss though?
New for old does not apply, as above. I'm not doing a new policy though, I'll be amending my existing one. I have the option there to set 'Lease - Private' for RO & RK when amending the policy.
Does the issue of new-for-old not still raise its head in the event of a total loss though?
You buy Gap to cover the difference between what you owe finance company and what will be settled by insurance company. Also to cover your initial payment for lease if it's high and worth covering.
Funk said:
Interesting.
I'm not doing a new policy though, I'll be amending my existing one. I have the option there to set 'Lease - Private' for RO & RK when amending the policy.
Does the issue of new-for-old not still raise its head in the event of a total loss though?
Have you tried ringing the insurance company and explaining? They can actually be helpful when they want to. They know people change vehicles, and I'm sure I was offered the chance to have both vehicles covered for a short period once although that may be a phantom memory because it sounds a little too generous for an insurance company. Definitely get the gap cover though, wouldn't want to bin it and end up still owing the lease company a big wedge of cash, they will have zero sympathy for you.I'm not doing a new policy though, I'll be amending my existing one. I have the option there to set 'Lease - Private' for RO & RK when amending the policy.
Does the issue of new-for-old not still raise its head in the event of a total loss though?
born2bslow said:
Funk said:
Interesting.
I'm not doing a new policy though, I'll be amending my existing one. I have the option there to set 'Lease - Private' for RO & RK when amending the policy.
Does the issue of new-for-old not still raise its head in the event of a total loss though?
Have you tried ringing the insurance company and explaining? They can actually be helpful when they want to. They know people change vehicles, and I'm sure I was offered the chance to have both vehicles covered for a short period once although that may be a phantom memory because it sounds a little too generous for an insurance company. Definitely get the gap cover though, wouldn't want to bin it and end up still owing the lease company a big wedge of cash, they will have zero sympathy for you.I'm not doing a new policy though, I'll be amending my existing one. I have the option there to set 'Lease - Private' for RO & RK when amending the policy.
Does the issue of new-for-old not still raise its head in the event of a total loss though?
Re. GAP as per my first post is already on the list to get once I have a delivery date.
I'd have though my entire first post shows how diligent I'm being about insurance!
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