John McGuinness to Norton for the TT

[FourWheelDrift]

Joining Josh Brookes for the Superbike and Senior TTs - http://www.crash.net/rr/news/889348/1/mcguinness-s...

[graham22]

Great marketing exercise by Norton.

As much as I'd love to see McG win on the Norton, I'd doubt we'll see a repeat of 1992 - the rotary had a distinct speed advantage over the 750s of the time.

[chris4652009]

graham22 said:

Great marketing exercise by Norton.

As much as I'd love to see McG win on the Norton, I'd doubt we'll see a repeat of 1992 - the rotary had a distinct speed advantage over the 750s of the time.

Iirc The 750s handled better, the Norton rotary was faster everywhere else.
Any idea how the TT lap times compaired between rotary and IL4 bikes during that era?

[FourWheelDrift]

Few things I have found.

1992 - Superbike TT
McCallen - Honda - 1hr53m22.4s, average speed 119.81mph
Hislop - Norton - 1hr53m34.4s, average speed 119.59mph

1992 - Senior TT
Hislop - Norton - 1hr51m59.6s, average speed 121.28mph
Fogarty - Yamaha - 1hr52m04.0s, average speed 121.2mph

Hislop did 192mph on Sulby straight in 1991 on a Honda. Gary Johnson did 193mph on the Norton in 2016.


Ps. However Josh Brookes was 6th last year on the Norton, best lap average was 130.853mph (he did 2x 130mph laps), 13th on the all time top lap speed list.

More stats on here - https://www.devittinsurance.com/guides/motorcycle-...

[trickywoo]

chris4652009 said:

Any idea how the TT lap times compaired between rotary and IL4 bikes during that era?

Foggy vs Hizzy in the 1992 Senior

First Hislop broke his own lap record, then Fogarty raised it to 123.61mph. Hislop went on to take the race by 4.4s, and set a new race record of 121.38mph. It was Norton’s first TT win since 1973 and their first Senior victory since 1961.

I've seen Foggy's Yamaha in the IoM museum and the development that went on over the next ten years was amazing. 123mph with I think 120 bhp and lower tech everything was something else.

[supermono]

This is super exciting news for those of us fortunate enough to be on the V4SS waiting list. I think way more than marketing, it's got to be a dream come true for the factory. Provided JM's leg is up to the job of hurling the thing around it's got to be in with a shout -- surely nobody has the same level of circuit knowledge and skill JM brings to the party? The bike is proven as superb already and continues to be developed.

Add to that other news out today in the V4 distribution list, regarding the involvement of Suter in the development of the Norton 1200V4 (not aprillia engine in the SG7) and it seems they've taken the engine up a few notches. The expectation is now for more torque and power than the Ducati V4, and you've seen how much MCN were raving about that (and with good reason).

It's academic to 99% of us, but if this V4SS with the race pipe and whatever else it has up its sleeve is only a bit quicker than the Ducati we might just be looking at the first 200mph production sports bike. Add that to a potential TT victory and we definitely have an instant classic that's made in Britain.

Godspeed to everyone involved!

[anonymous-user]

I think this is a great opportunity for Norton and McGuinness, He has nothing to prove, the bike has been getting more competitive every year and it looks the business. He could have chased a ride on the BMW but where's the fun in that? Good on him.

[NITO]

Great news, I wish Norton and McGuinness all the best of luck in the TT, I hope it’ll be an awesome spectacle, like many I would love a V4SS, for me, easily bike of the show just now at NEC!

[anonymous-user]

I can testify the Norton is the best looking and best sounding bike at the TT. If only I had the money!

[scunnylad]

I hope he is fit and well enough to be at the sharp end come June

As for the old rotaries by the time they were in TT trim I don't think they had much of a speed advantage
The rev limit was lowered to preserve the engines which were running too hot
In the f1 race in 92 Dunlop's Norton heat siezed despite having the front mudguard ripped off during a pitstop in
a bid too aid cooling. They did the same to hislops and they both run without front mudguards in the senior.

I am no great fan of fogerty but his lap on the ow01 is still the greatest lap I've ever seen
I was involved with the loctite team so have a bit of insight into the bike etc.
When it was back at the awning it was like one of those clowns cars with bits falling off it.
Unbelievable performance

[chunder27]

The thing is with 92. Neither bike as really suited to the TT. the Norton had little proven running there at those speeds.

It was GP bike basically and was never designed to do this, quite how the hell Hizzy managed it I will never know. And the Yamaha too was a Superbike, all screamy EXUP power, it was literally falling to bits at the end, Foggy had no history on Yamaha's was a Honda man really and by then starting out on Ducati's.

So both rides were of massively huge bravery, which is why the lap record stood for so long, and almost why Hizzy didn't want to go back!

[Tango13]

FourWheelDrift said:

Few things I have found.

1992 - Superbike TT
McCallen - Honda - 1hr53m22.4s, average speed 119.81mph
Hislop - Norton - 1hr53m34.4s, average speed 119.59mph

1992 - Senior TT
Hislop - Norton - 1hr51m59.6s, average speed 121.28mph
Fogarty - Yamaha - 1hr52m04.0s, average speed 121.2mph

Hislop did 192mph on Sulby straight in 1991 on a Honda. Gary Johnson did 193mph on the Norton in 2016.


Ps. However Josh Brookes was 6th last year on the Norton, best lap average was 130.853mph (he did 2x 130mph laps), 13th on the all time top lap speed list.

More stats on here - https://www.devittinsurance.com/guides/motorcycle-...

There's no way Hislop hit 192mph, it was pure MCN bullst as quite simply no 750 of that era had enough power.

The works RVF's, not the tarted up RC45's, the proper full fat magnesium crankcased F1 spec RVF750 had 145/150bhp which is simply not enough power which ever way you gear the bike or however long the run up.

To put it in context an NSR500 of that era was putting down about 185/190bhp and hitting 190mph at Hockenheim so a bike with 35/40bhp less going just as fast? Don't think so...

The 2016 works Norton probably had about 190/200bhp which makes Gary Johnsons' 193mph very believable.

[mister_ee]

chunder27 said:

The thing is with 92. Neither bike as really suited to the TT. the Norton had little proven running there at those speeds.

It was GP bike basically and was never designed to do this, quite how the hell Hizzy managed it I will never know. And the Yamaha too was a Superbike, all screamy EXUP power, it was literally falling to bits at the end, Foggy had no history on Yamaha's was a Honda man really and by then starting out on Ducati's.

So both rides were of massively huge bravery, which is why the lap record stood for so long, and almost why Hizzy didn't want to go back!

I think the OW01 was falling apart before he set off, we were watching the Superbike race from somewhere just after the Bungalow when Foggy came past and it sounded like he changed up into about 95th gear and the thing made some horrible noises and that was it

[scunnylad]

Tango13 said:

There's no way Hislop hit 192mph, it was pure MCN bullst as quite simply no 750 of that era had enough power.

The works RVF's, not the tarted up RC45's, the proper full fat magnesium crankcased F1 spec RVF750 had 145/150bhp which is simply not enough power which ever way you gear the bike or however long the run up.

To put it in context an NSR500 of that era was putting down about 185/190bhp and hitting 190mph at Hockenheim so a bike with 35/40bhp less going just as fast? Don't think so...

The 2016 works Norton probably had about 190/200bhp which makes Gary Johnsons' 193mph very believable.

Of course it was Mcn Bullst

Don't know how Gary Johnsons name has got into this,he hasn't ridden the norton,it was Dave johnson

[FourWheelDrift]

Typo, reading one thing typing another.

[Jazoli]

scunnylad said:

I hope he is fit and well enough to be at the sharp end come June

As for the old rotaries by the time they were in TT trim I don't think they had much of a speed advantage
The rev limit was lowered to preserve the engines which were running too hot

Talking of old rotaries, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yiOpwFZTReI Josh Brookes on the WizNorton

[shoestring7]

Nice article on the Goodwood Road and Racing site

https://www.goodwood.com/grrc/race/modern/2018/2/E...

Hope this is behind their paywall...


SS7