Can you bump start a shaftie

[waynedear]

Hello all, I have been offered a Moto Guzzi v50 iii for £300, chances are I will buy it anyway.
It has not moved for 14/15 years, apparently someone tried to steal it and smashed the ignition meaning the keys won't work, battery will also be kaput and it does not have a kickstart.
How do I check if it's seized, if I put it in gear will it (if not seized) rotate the engine.
From 30+ bikes I have only had one shaft drive before and I knew that was not seized as it ran.

Thanks in advance

[jjones]

that would work, probably easy to pop the spark plugs out, this will make it much easier to turn over (if it isn't seized!)

[waynedear]

jjones said:

that would work, probably easy to pop the spark plugs out, this will make it much easier to turn over (if it isn't seized!)

Thank you, I will remember to take plug spanners.

[crofty1984]

waynedear said:

Thank you, I will remember to take plug spanners.

They're always the size of spanner you leave at home. Remember to bring that one.

[catso]

I was checking the valve clearance and ignition timing yesterday on my Guzzi Lemans (shaft drive). To do this I need to be able to rotate the engine by hand - put it on the centrestand, remove the plugs and rotate the rear wheel in top gear (much easier than 1st) and It turns over fairly easily with one hand.

[waynedear]

Crafty I have 4 sizes, fingers crossed

Catso, cheers.

[dugsud]

Probably be worth a squirt of spray oil in each plug-hole before you turn it over after 15 years!

[curlie467]

Do what catso said, on centrestand, pop it in top gear and turn the wheel.

I lot less knackering than trying to bump it.

[waynedear]

Thank you one and all, hoping to view on Wednesday

[Rubin215]

You're going to buy it anyway, which means you're going to service it anyway, which means you'll fit new plugs anyway.

Buy two now and check at home what size plug spanner it needs.

And yes, definitely give it a good squirt of oil down the plugholes and let it sit for ten minutes before you try turning it over.

[Rubin215]

Remember as well that the rear brake is linked to the front right caliper and there is a valve thingy in between the two; it is possible for this to be all gummed up so that any pressure in the system seizes the caliper on; this can be mistaken for something else seized.

The bores are also nikasil plated so if you can get it turned over easily check for compression. Old-days cheap petrol (supermarket in particular) had high sulphur content that destroyed the nikasil leaving you with no compression.

[catso]

Rubin215 said:

You're going to buy it anyway, which means you're going to service it anyway, which means you'll fit new plugs anyway.

Buy two now and check at home what size plug spanner it needs.

And yes, definitely give it a good squirt of oil down the plugholes and let it sit for ten minutes before you try turning it over.

Given the vintage, I'd wager it uses an old-school 'large' spark plug (like yer lawnmower), so a 21mm plug spanner/socket should do the job - the Lemans does and I would think it's going to be similar?

[catso]

Rubin215 said:

Remember as well that the rear brake is linked to the front right caliper and there is a valve thingy in between the two; it is possible for this to be all gummed up so that any pressure in the system seizes the caliper on; this can be mistaken for something else seized.

Or (as with mine when I got it) that the brakes don't work at all, because it's full of air and the linked setup is a bastid to bleed.

I de-linked mine for a conventional setup of the 2 front discs by hand and rear disc from the foot pedal.

[LuS1fer]

I bump started my Gold Wing K1,regularly.
The supplied kickstarter in the dummy tank was so useless, it wasn't worth having.

[catso]

I've never tried bump starting my Guzzi, I don't think it'd be easy to get it going fast enough to start? unless a big downhill and it's a heavy old thing to push back up if it doesn't go.

It has a huge battery and takes a good few (slow) cranks before it fires.

[Rubin215]

catso said:

Rubin215 said:

Remember as well that the rear brake is linked to the front right caliper and there is a valve thingy in between the two; it is possible for this to be all gummed up so that any pressure in the system seizes the caliper on; this can be mistaken for something else seized.

Or (as with mine when I got it) that the brakes don't work at all, because it's full of air and the linked setup is a bastid to bleed.

I de-linked mine for a conventional setup of the 2 front discs by hand and rear disc from the foot pedal.

What master cylinders did you use?

[Some Guy]

I have bumped a GS1000 and a V Max, so yes it can be done. You might need some help shoving it though (I was f~$%ed after).

Not sure you can bump anything with fuel injection though.

[waynedear]

I only mentioned bump start so I could check for compression, I will whip out the plugs and give the holes a spray.
I have read about the linked brakes, they can not be any harder to sort than the last bike I did, bm k1100lt with abs2 and an utterly knackered brake system, rebuilt, bled and reset.

Chuffed to bits at all the pointers and help

[Rubin215]

Some Guy said:

I have bumped a GS1000 and a V Max, so yes it can be done. You might need some help shoving it though (I was f~$%ed after).

Not sure you can bump anything with fuel injection though.

Yes, you can, as long as the battery still has enough oomph to run the fuel pump.

My TL was a bd to start off the button if the battery was a bit low but with a decent hill and a bloody good bounce to get it over the compression it would still fire up.

[catso]

Rubin215 said:

catso said:

Rubin215 said:

Remember as well that the rear brake is linked to the front right caliper and there is a valve thingy in between the two; it is possible for this to be all gummed up so that any pressure in the system seizes the caliper on; this can be mistaken for something else seized.

Or (as with mine when I got it) that the brakes don't work at all, because it's full of air and the linked setup is a bastid to bleed.

I de-linked mine for a conventional setup of the 2 front discs by hand and rear disc from the foot pedal.

What master cylinders did you use?

Originally it had a 15mm master for the linked (rear + 1 front) and a 12mm for the single front, all 3 calipers are the same type.

I replaced the rear with a 12mm version of the same design (as used on Ducati/Laverda of the same era) and for the front (both discs) I used a Brembo RCS15, chosen because I was unsure exactly how it would feel so wanted the 2 options plus a good range of adjustment.

It works very well and with a full caliper overhaul + new pistons (old ones were corroded) and braided hoses, the brakes are surprisingly good for a '70s heavyweight.