EPC on private rented property - exemption process?
Discussion
Just after some ideas please in case anyone is in the same boat.
I own two flats above a shop. The building is a late Victorian property with large sash windows. It was refurbished around 10 years ago, is in a good state of repair, and the tenants are happy with it.
One of the two flats, on the middle floor, has an EPC grade of F 27. This is based on an up to date EPC. The walls are solid, which rightly or wrongly results in a low score under the present system.
All low cost changes have already largely been incorporated, such as TRV's, low energy lighting etc. Heating is off an electric system, which is probably what is dragging the score down, combined with the large single glazed windows.
Options I can think of are:
a) Try to secure an exemption, as the recommended measures are not cost effective. However - the process for getting an exemption is not clear, and my agents are clueless - does anyone have any experience on this?
b) Bring gas in to the property and swap to a gas boiler (doable but ££££), not sure if this would transform the EPC or not?
c) Sell the flat to an owner occupier (unaffected by the EPC limitations) and put the money into more commercial property
Can anyone help on option a)?
I attach the EPC 'recommendations' below!
I own two flats above a shop. The building is a late Victorian property with large sash windows. It was refurbished around 10 years ago, is in a good state of repair, and the tenants are happy with it.
One of the two flats, on the middle floor, has an EPC grade of F 27. This is based on an up to date EPC. The walls are solid, which rightly or wrongly results in a low score under the present system.
All low cost changes have already largely been incorporated, such as TRV's, low energy lighting etc. Heating is off an electric system, which is probably what is dragging the score down, combined with the large single glazed windows.
Options I can think of are:
a) Try to secure an exemption, as the recommended measures are not cost effective. However - the process for getting an exemption is not clear, and my agents are clueless - does anyone have any experience on this?
b) Bring gas in to the property and swap to a gas boiler (doable but ££££), not sure if this would transform the EPC or not?
c) Sell the flat to an owner occupier (unaffected by the EPC limitations) and put the money into more commercial property
Can anyone help on option a)?
I attach the EPC 'recommendations' below!
Crikey they think you could save £295 on heating just with wall insulation, I wonder what the tenants heating bill is like a year ? Would air heat pumps be an option ? Might cost less than getting gas in , I know from experience it’s hard work getting gas installed , then you have all the cost of rads and plumping !
matjk said:
Crikey they think you could save £295 on heating just with wall insulation, I wonder what the tenants heating bill is like a year ? Would air heat pumps be an option ? Might cost less than getting gas in , I know from experience it’s hard work getting gas installed , then you have all the cost of rads and plumping !
There is scope to put gas heating in, however as you say, the cost will be high. I think an exemption is the way ahead due to the cost of the measures meaning they do not meet the 'golden rule' for energy improvements, but I need to work out what the process is and then navigate the bureaucracy of the wonderful new system....Bored today so did a bit of reading and the general consensus is the rules might be changing and to hold tight on doing anything until the government decides ! I guess you could still go for exemption, not sure you can use cost as an exemption , I think it’s more “it would spoil the building” type arguments ! If they change the rules on solid walls after you send a fortune on gas fitting you will be pretty annoyed , having said that I would definitely want gas heating in a building like yours ,
Raad this it’s interesting https://www.rla.org.uk/landlord/guides/minimum-ene...
Raad this it’s interesting https://www.rla.org.uk/landlord/guides/minimum-ene...
matjk said:
Bored today so did a bit of reading and the general consensus is the rules might be changing and to hold tight on doing anything until the government decides ! I guess you could still go for exemption, not sure you can use cost as an exemption , I think it’s more “it would spoil the building” type arguments ! If they change the rules on solid walls after you send a fortune on gas fitting you will be pretty annoyed , having said that I would definitely want gas heating in a building like yours ,
Raad this it’s interesting https://www.rla.org.uk/landlord/guides/minimum-ene...
Thanks - I was just looking at the same this morning, and am using it to write a reply to brief up my useless letting agent so they actually know something about the process. Raad this it’s interesting https://www.rla.org.uk/landlord/guides/minimum-ene...
I know the RLA's comment on solid walls has been there for some time, it would be good if this got resolved as it is pretty crucial....
What I have established is:
- I get a Green Deal Report produced
- This will then provide evidence that there are no cost effective improvements that can be made for zero cost to the landlord (as the saving versus cost plus interest under the green deal would not justify it)
- I then register and claim this exemption at https://prsregister.beis.gov.uk/NdsBeisUi/used-ser...
This sounds like it may work. Fingers crossed....
Personally if I was renting I'd be looking for a place with gas central heating and double glazing and would pay a higher rent for the reduced bills.
By doing one or both you could probably command a higher rent plus the value of the flat would increase.
I'm looking at buying a ground floor flat at the moment and the cost to get gas (and a meter) to the property is around £400.
I'll likely put something like this in.
https://www.mrcentralheating.co.uk/baxi-platinum-2...
By doing one or both you could probably command a higher rent plus the value of the flat would increase.
I'm looking at buying a ground floor flat at the moment and the cost to get gas (and a meter) to the property is around £400.
I'll likely put something like this in.
https://www.mrcentralheating.co.uk/baxi-platinum-2...
B17NNS said:
Personally if I was renting I'd be looking for a place with gas central heating and double glazing and would pay a higher rent for the reduced bills.
By doing one or both you could probably command a higher rent plus the value of the flat would increase.
I'm looking at buying a ground floor flat at the moment and the cost to get gas (and a meter) to the property is around £400.
I'll likely put something like this in.
https://www.mrcentralheating.co.uk/baxi-platinum-2...
All valid points thanks - that cost of a gas connection sounds quite good!By doing one or both you could probably command a higher rent plus the value of the flat would increase.
I'm looking at buying a ground floor flat at the moment and the cost to get gas (and a meter) to the property is around £400.
I'll likely put something like this in.
https://www.mrcentralheating.co.uk/baxi-platinum-2...
Biggles111 said:
All valid points thanks - that cost of a gas connection sounds quite good!
That's ground floor with gas in the street.If you call British Gas they'll tell you who is responsible for new installs in your area. If you call them they'll give you a quote over the phone. British Gas install the meter for free.
Depending on where the property is, the cost of the gas installation could be subsidised - it could even be free if you are lucky. My brother had 7 flats connected in a block which previously didn't have gas but had gas in the street. Cost was £0 because it was in a deprived area or some such nonsense.
Also you could get a grant / reduced cost of installation if you have tenants on certain benefits.
Whilst I think EPC's are a waste of time, improving the energy efficiency of the property would surely be money well spent and make the property far more attractive to a tenant.
A new gas supply and central heating would be the best for your tenant but if increasing the EPC by a few points to get to an 'E' is the primary goal then have you looked at secondary glazing? Also, Insulation on the inside of the property on the external walls would give good results.
Failing that - try a different energy / EPC assessor
Also you could get a grant / reduced cost of installation if you have tenants on certain benefits.
Whilst I think EPC's are a waste of time, improving the energy efficiency of the property would surely be money well spent and make the property far more attractive to a tenant.
A new gas supply and central heating would be the best for your tenant but if increasing the EPC by a few points to get to an 'E' is the primary goal then have you looked at secondary glazing? Also, Insulation on the inside of the property on the external walls would give good results.
Failing that - try a different energy / EPC assessor
Biggles111 said:
Just after some ideas please in case anyone is in the same boat.
I own two flats above a shop. The building is a late Victorian property with large sash windows. It was refurbished around 10 years ago, is in a good state of repair, and the tenants are happy with it.
One of the two flats, on the middle floor, has an EPC grade of F 27. This is based on an up to date EPC. The walls are solid, which rightly or wrongly results in a low score under the present system.
All low cost changes have already largely been incorporated, such as TRV's, low energy lighting etc. Heating is off an electric system, which is probably what is dragging the score down, combined with the large single glazed windows.
Options I can think of are:
a) Try to secure an exemption, as the recommended measures are not cost effective. However - the process for getting an exemption is not clear, and my agents are clueless - does anyone have any experience on this?
b) Bring gas in to the property and swap to a gas boiler (doable but ££££), not sure if this would transform the EPC or not?
c) Sell the flat to an owner occupier (unaffected by the EPC limitations) and put the money into more commercial property
Can anyone help on option a)?
I attach the EPC 'recommendations' below!
Your agents maybe clueless on the exemptions because this is new regulations on 1 April 2018 which has not been tested or tried and is a complete muddle of unclearness in exemptions. It wasn't even clear if it was coming into force.I own two flats above a shop. The building is a late Victorian property with large sash windows. It was refurbished around 10 years ago, is in a good state of repair, and the tenants are happy with it.
One of the two flats, on the middle floor, has an EPC grade of F 27. This is based on an up to date EPC. The walls are solid, which rightly or wrongly results in a low score under the present system.
All low cost changes have already largely been incorporated, such as TRV's, low energy lighting etc. Heating is off an electric system, which is probably what is dragging the score down, combined with the large single glazed windows.
Options I can think of are:
a) Try to secure an exemption, as the recommended measures are not cost effective. However - the process for getting an exemption is not clear, and my agents are clueless - does anyone have any experience on this?
b) Bring gas in to the property and swap to a gas boiler (doable but ££££), not sure if this would transform the EPC or not?
c) Sell the flat to an owner occupier (unaffected by the EPC limitations) and put the money into more commercial property
Can anyone help on option a)?
I attach the EPC 'recommendations' below!
First thing - is the property currently rented on a fixed term? is it empty ? or is it rented on a roll on periodic tenancy?
New guidance/softaware for the EPC assesors were sent out in November so it may be worth getting it retested.
If on a fixed term then you only have to get the rating to an E before the renewal date.
Its not so clear if its rolling on and has been before 1/4/18
As PFox above has said - secondary glazing may also be a cheaper option to help raise it with the new guidance on the EPC assessment.
Edited by superlightr on Wednesday 4th April 16:42
superlightr said:
Your agents maybe clueless on the exemptions because this is new regulations on 1 April 2018 which has not been tested or tried and is a complete muddle of unclearness in exemptions. It wasn't even clear if it was coming into force.
First thing - is the property currently rented on a fixed term? is it empty ? or is it rented on a roll on periodic tenancy?
New guidance/softaware for the EPC assesors were sent out in November so it may be worth getting it retested.
If on a fixed term then you only have to get the rating to an E before the renewal date.
Its not so clear if its rolling on and has been before 1/4/18
As PFox above has said - secondary glazing may also be a cheaper option to help raise it with the new guidance on the EPC assessment.
Thanks for the reply.First thing - is the property currently rented on a fixed term? is it empty ? or is it rented on a roll on periodic tenancy?
New guidance/softaware for the EPC assesors were sent out in November so it may be worth getting it retested.
If on a fixed term then you only have to get the rating to an E before the renewal date.
Its not so clear if its rolling on and has been before 1/4/18
As PFox above has said - secondary glazing may also be a cheaper option to help raise it with the new guidance on the EPC assessment.
Edited by superlightr on Wednesday 4th April 16:42
I had the property retested 2 weeks ago, however it still sat at an 'F' rating. I had hoped that the re-rating of solid walls that had been proposed would have been applied by now, but unfortunately not, thanks HMGov...
The initial fixed term has expired and the property is on a periodic tenancy, and has been for some time
Secondary glazing is a good shout. Next step is for me to get an advisor to tell me what will be a cost effective measure(s) to get the property compliant - obviously I don't want to shell out the money and then have it still fail...
skwdenyer said:
Presumably you're aware that the same rules apply to commercial property?
Yes, thanks - I would make sure to buy something compliant. Out of interest, for some reason the EPC seems to give a better score on a like for like basis for commercial - my commercial unit downstairs scores a D versus the F of the residential on the floor above....Biggles111 said:
skwdenyer said:
Presumably you're aware that the same rules apply to commercial property?
Yes, thanks - I would make sure to buy something compliant. Out of interest, for some reason the EPC seems to give a better score on a like for like basis for commercial - my commercial unit downstairs scores a D versus the F of the residential on the floor above....skwdenyer said:
I'm not an expert (despite letting-out commercial property, like you, I'm reliant on others to advise), but this article suggests that the basis of assessment is different - CO2 emissions for commercial vs fuel usage for residential - https://elementsproperty.co.uk/energy-performance-...
Thanks - this explains the reason for the differences well.... Just following up on this; we had a green deal assessor come around, who carried out an EPC which was going to be used as a starting point for improvements. The final result was that that no measures are needed as with the new assessment it is already acceptable and just about hits a 'D', beating the E required. I was pretty annoyed at the old rating, as the property already has TRV's, low energy lighting etc.
That one assessor can make it an 'F' and that 2 months later it is a 'D' though shows that the system is not infallible. We are happy and the tenant is happy, a good result in the end, I'm just glad that I didn't order up a new heating system!
That one assessor can make it an 'F' and that 2 months later it is a 'D' though shows that the system is not infallible. We are happy and the tenant is happy, a good result in the end, I'm just glad that I didn't order up a new heating system!
Gassing Station | Business | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff