Which new hot hatch would you buy?
Discussion
I'm not too happy about the way the new car market in general is panning out at the moment but at least one area of the market, the hot hatch market is burgeoning and every bit as buoyant as it was in its 1980s heyday. I honestly don't think there is a bad choice out there right now with some old players coming back into the fray (Peugeot) and some new entrants too (Hyundai/Kia), although Vauxhall are conspicuous by their absence. Maybe the ubiquity of the four cylinder turbo means that the powertrain landscape isn't as varied as perhaps it once was but then an NA four cylinder was the default choice in the 1980s and you need a turbo these days to keep up with the pack. So,
1) if you had 20k (or the equivalent monthly payment) to spend on a new hot hatch, which one would you buy and
2) if you were to up the budget to 30k (or the equivalent payment), what would your choice be then?
3) Out of interest, would you consider any of the 40k+ hot hatches (Audi RS3/A45 AMG) if they were in your budget or is that just too much money for a hot hatch?
1) For 20k, despite the price hike and being unconvinced by the styling and new engine, it would still have to be the Fiesta ST for me. I might have chosen the Clio RS because I prefer the way it looks, if it wasn't for the silly transmsission, the new Swift Sport could have been a contender but it either needed to have more power or be less expensive, I like MINIs but I have one and it has some compromises and likewise, I love the style and character of the Abarth 595 but being based on a Fiat Panda chassis (and an old one at that), it too is compromised.
2) My 30k choice is rather harder but currently it would have to be between the BMW M140i, Ford Focus RS and new Megane RS Cup. The BMW I love for the creamy six cylinder engine, the RWD balance and it's lovely to drive and be in but I remain unconvinced by the styling. I have not driven the Focus RS but the mk3 Focus chassis is an excellent starting point and I love the lairiness and useable all-season performance. The Megane is kind of the sensible choice (prior to the new Megane, I would have picked the Golf GTI as the most well-rounded all-rounder) but I think the Megane looks better, is faster, better value and probably handles better too. I also don't find the mk7 Golf to offer the cut above in quality that the Golf used to either. I hear that the Civic Type R is fabulous but I think that I'm amongst the many who just can't get on with the styling. So, for me it would be a difficult choice between the BMW, Ford and Renault. My instinct is that RWD/AWD>FWD but I haven't driven an RS Renault recently and I hear they handle brilliantly, so I honestly don't know.
3) As for the RS3/A45, I really like the RS3, the saloon moreso than the hatch actually but for that money, I think that I would rather be looking at a BMW M car or a Porsche.
1) if you had 20k (or the equivalent monthly payment) to spend on a new hot hatch, which one would you buy and
2) if you were to up the budget to 30k (or the equivalent payment), what would your choice be then?
3) Out of interest, would you consider any of the 40k+ hot hatches (Audi RS3/A45 AMG) if they were in your budget or is that just too much money for a hot hatch?
1) For 20k, despite the price hike and being unconvinced by the styling and new engine, it would still have to be the Fiesta ST for me. I might have chosen the Clio RS because I prefer the way it looks, if it wasn't for the silly transmsission, the new Swift Sport could have been a contender but it either needed to have more power or be less expensive, I like MINIs but I have one and it has some compromises and likewise, I love the style and character of the Abarth 595 but being based on a Fiat Panda chassis (and an old one at that), it too is compromised.
2) My 30k choice is rather harder but currently it would have to be between the BMW M140i, Ford Focus RS and new Megane RS Cup. The BMW I love for the creamy six cylinder engine, the RWD balance and it's lovely to drive and be in but I remain unconvinced by the styling. I have not driven the Focus RS but the mk3 Focus chassis is an excellent starting point and I love the lairiness and useable all-season performance. The Megane is kind of the sensible choice (prior to the new Megane, I would have picked the Golf GTI as the most well-rounded all-rounder) but I think the Megane looks better, is faster, better value and probably handles better too. I also don't find the mk7 Golf to offer the cut above in quality that the Golf used to either. I hear that the Civic Type R is fabulous but I think that I'm amongst the many who just can't get on with the styling. So, for me it would be a difficult choice between the BMW, Ford and Renault. My instinct is that RWD/AWD>FWD but I haven't driven an RS Renault recently and I hear they handle brilliantly, so I honestly don't know.
3) As for the RS3/A45, I really like the RS3, the saloon moreso than the hatch actually but for that money, I think that I would rather be looking at a BMW M car or a Porsche.
Edited by white_goodman on Tuesday 10th July 16:34
Assuming had to be new:
20k - Fiesta ST
30k (ish) - Golf R, despite having had mine stolen 12 months into ownership and despite it not being that involving to drive as I don't like the current Focus RS
40k (ish) - Audi RS3, simply sounds the best of the current gen hot hatches, 5 cylinders > 4
For the money assuming you don't need rear seats plenty of better options on the second hand market though.
20k - Fiesta ST
30k (ish) - Golf R, despite having had mine stolen 12 months into ownership and despite it not being that involving to drive as I don't like the current Focus RS
40k (ish) - Audi RS3, simply sounds the best of the current gen hot hatches, 5 cylinders > 4
For the money assuming you don't need rear seats plenty of better options on the second hand market though.
£20k - Fiesta ST, easy choice.
£30k - either Focus RS or Civic Type R (like the styling on both, so would have to test drive both and choose my favourite).
£40k - for a hot hatch
Let's face it, £30k is pushing the boundaries for a hot hatch, so for £40k'ish (admittedly 2nd hand) you could get something like an M4, or even a 997 Turbo...
£30k - either Focus RS or Civic Type R (like the styling on both, so would have to test drive both and choose my favourite).
£40k - for a hot hatch
Let's face it, £30k is pushing the boundaries for a hot hatch, so for £40k'ish (admittedly 2nd hand) you could get something like an M4, or even a 997 Turbo...white_goodman said:
3) Out of interest, would you consider any of the 40k+ hot hatches (Audi RS3/A45 AMG) if they were in your budget or is that just too much money for a hot hatch?
3) As for the RS3/A45, I really like the RS3, the saloon moreso than the hatch actually but for that money, I think that kind of money, I would rather be looking at a BMW M car or a Porsche.
The 40k hot hatches are amazing things, similar performance of supercars from 10 years ago, and they put the power down amazingly well.3) As for the RS3/A45, I really like the RS3, the saloon moreso than the hatch actually but for that money, I think that kind of money, I would rather be looking at a BMW M car or a Porsche.
A 40k Porsche is a good idea, get the right one and they'll not lose heaps of cash either. Look at good spec 981 Boxster/Cayman if you can live with 2 seats.
I have a 2016 M135i I bought six weeks ago, I like it but it isnt really a hot hatch with the auto box, its quick, pretty capable and easy to live with but it is more of a sort of sporty mini barge/junior exec if that makes any sense whatsoever, its not got that incisive edge that an out and out hot hatch should have, the woolly steering and slightly wobbly suspension just dont keep up with what the engine does. I drove an Hyundai I30N, that was more fun and more of a rounded package, we have a Fiesta ST and that is more fun, if a bit like hard work sometimes. The ZF8 auto box is a magnificent thing but for me, really a manual would make more sense for a "fun" car, that said, the other aspects mentioned would still count against it.
Its a great car, dont get me wrong but what it reminds me of is when I had a Golf GTI and the early nineties and drove a VR6 expecting more of the same, only better but found it was a different experience, almost a bit too grown up to qualify as a hot hatch, I think I want something thats like a motorised Tasmanian Devil, I suspect a change of exhaust will release a bit more character, the engine is a best bit.
I have gelled with it, just for different reasons than I expected.
Its a great car, dont get me wrong but what it reminds me of is when I had a Golf GTI and the early nineties and drove a VR6 expecting more of the same, only better but found it was a different experience, almost a bit too grown up to qualify as a hot hatch, I think I want something thats like a motorised Tasmanian Devil, I suspect a change of exhaust will release a bit more character, the engine is a best bit.
I have gelled with it, just for different reasons than I expected.
daveco said:
Probably the BMW for its engine.
Mazda really need to do a Mazda 2 or Mazda 3 with the new NA 190hp engine.
I'd also consider both Suzuki Swift Sport Gen 1 and Gen 2.
Good point. I've driven most of the current Mazda range and really love the way they all drive but they really lack something with purposeful performance and seem set on sticking with NA on their petrol engines. In America, you can get a 2.5 twin-scroll turbo with around 250 horsepower in the Mazda 6/CX9. I would love for that engine to be available over here in the Mazda 3/6.Mazda really need to do a Mazda 2 or Mazda 3 with the new NA 190hp engine.
I'd also consider both Suzuki Swift Sport Gen 1 and Gen 2.
J4CKO said:
I have a 2016 M135i I bought six weeks ago, I like it but it isnt really a hot hatch with the auto box, its quick, pretty capable and easy to live with but it is more of a sort of sporty mini barge/junior exec if that makes any sense whatsoever, its not got that incisive edge that an out and out hot hatch should have, the woolly steering and slightly wobbly suspension just dont keep up with what the engine does. I drove an Hyundai I30N, that was more fun and more of a rounded package, we have a Fiesta ST and that is more fun, if a bit like hard work sometimes. The ZF8 auto box is a magnificent thing but for me, really a manual would make more sense for a "fun" car, that said, the other aspects mentioned would still count against it.
Its a great car, dont get me wrong but what it reminds me of is when I had a Golf GTI and the early nineties and drove a VR6 expecting more of the same, only better but found it was a different experience, almost a bit too grown up to qualify as a hot hatch, I think I want something thats like a motorised Tasmanian Devil, I suspect a change of exhaust will release a bit more character, the engine is a best bit.
I have gelled with it, just for different reasons than I expected.
That's kind of the impression that I get about the M140i. More of a fast, compact luxury car that will reach its limits a lot sooner than the Focus RS/Megane RS/Type R. Peach of an engine though and IMHO currently still the nicest non-M BMW to drive. I'll be sad to see it go when the FWD and no doubt four cylinder replacement comes. Have you considered any Motech upgrades? I hear that they can be made to handle a lot better.Its a great car, dont get me wrong but what it reminds me of is when I had a Golf GTI and the early nineties and drove a VR6 expecting more of the same, only better but found it was a different experience, almost a bit too grown up to qualify as a hot hatch, I think I want something thats like a motorised Tasmanian Devil, I suspect a change of exhaust will release a bit more character, the engine is a best bit.
I have gelled with it, just for different reasons than I expected.
1) Abarth 595 Comp PP, but then I am biased I have just ordered one, the Fiesta left me cold, a great instrument with 0 character! I toyed with a Mini JCW too but my local dealer just wasn't interested in selling me one.
2) Probably a Golf GTI PP or a CTR if I could put up with the styling. I would convince myself of this right up to the point I signed for an M140!
3) RS3, always wanted one, 5 pot lovelyness!
There you go, I am boring
2) Probably a Golf GTI PP or a CTR if I could put up with the styling. I would convince myself of this right up to the point I signed for an M140!
3) RS3, always wanted one, 5 pot lovelyness!
There you go, I am boring
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