Flying to a new airport ?
Discussion
I know pilots have to get a rating if they change to a different type, what happens with regards to flying to (or from for that matter) a new airport they haven been to before ?
Is it a case of,
Here’s the charts, off you pop, watch out for the mountains to the south and it can be a bit windy.
Or
You have to fly it in a simulator, then as a FO and you get a tick in your records, if you don’t fly there often do you have to do a refresher ?
I suppose if you have to divert you would have to land somewhere unfamiliar, just interested in how it works really, the charts look fairly complicated and some of the approaches, like Dubai for example look just weird.
I like to, if driving somewhere unfamiliar, nip on Google Streetview and get a feel for somewhere, would imagine that’s similar and probably more critical if piloting 100 tonnes of plane with 300 people on and it can be dark, foggy or whatever.
Is it a case of,
Here’s the charts, off you pop, watch out for the mountains to the south and it can be a bit windy.
Or
You have to fly it in a simulator, then as a FO and you get a tick in your records, if you don’t fly there often do you have to do a refresher ?
I suppose if you have to divert you would have to land somewhere unfamiliar, just interested in how it works really, the charts look fairly complicated and some of the approaches, like Dubai for example look just weird.
I like to, if driving somewhere unfamiliar, nip on Google Streetview and get a feel for somewhere, would imagine that’s similar and probably more critical if piloting 100 tonnes of plane with 300 people on and it can be dark, foggy or whatever.
I reckon there are all sorts of permutations on this depending on multiple factors -
private flying
airline flying
if airline flying - size of airline and aircraft used
the rules in any given country
I am sure most medium and large airlines would make use of simulator training and, of course, have the pilot fly alongside someone who was used to the particular airport.
private flying
airline flying
if airline flying - size of airline and aircraft used
the rules in any given country
I am sure most medium and large airlines would make use of simulator training and, of course, have the pilot fly alongside someone who was used to the particular airport.
In the case of private flying unless there is some sort of restriction on the airfield its a case of just study the charts and weather then set off if it all looks good. You generally have a diversionary airfield planned (or enough fuel to return to base) so if you don't like what you see you can simply depart the overhead and leave.
Some require prior permission, usually you phone the airfield operators for that and they will brief you if there is a specific approach path needed (avoiding overflying noise sensitive areas for example).
That being said some airfields are known to be a challenge so having somebody familiar onboard for guidance (be it an instructor or not) can be advisable.
Some require prior permission, usually you phone the airfield operators for that and they will brief you if there is a specific approach path needed (avoiding overflying noise sensitive areas for example).
That being said some airfields are known to be a challenge so having somebody familiar onboard for guidance (be it an instructor or not) can be advisable.
It's nowhere near as complicated as you might think.
A typical airport you may fly a scheduled route in to will have published charts for each standard arrival, departure and approaches. They look complicated, but to your typical pilot, easy to decipher. Some airlines have manuals with briefs for each airport, so we're expected to at least have a look before going in there for the first time.
Some airports do require simulator training prior to flying in there for the first time. London City is one example, as it has a steeper approach compared to your typical airport, so requires different techniques in flying and setting the aircraft up. Ajjacio in Corsica, where the approach is curved 180 degrees, so again, requires practice in the simulator prior to operating in there, and I've also practiced a particular approach in to JFK, which is quite demanding, but sometimes that's a company requirement, rather than the airport's.
Otherwise, you just get on with it!
A typical airport you may fly a scheduled route in to will have published charts for each standard arrival, departure and approaches. They look complicated, but to your typical pilot, easy to decipher. Some airlines have manuals with briefs for each airport, so we're expected to at least have a look before going in there for the first time.
Some airports do require simulator training prior to flying in there for the first time. London City is one example, as it has a steeper approach compared to your typical airport, so requires different techniques in flying and setting the aircraft up. Ajjacio in Corsica, where the approach is curved 180 degrees, so again, requires practice in the simulator prior to operating in there, and I've also practiced a particular approach in to JFK, which is quite demanding, but sometimes that's a company requirement, rather than the airport's.
Otherwise, you just get on with it!
The Canarsie approach to JFK is one that many airlines mandate must be practiced in the sim first and all Concorde pilots had to do this before being signed off to execute it for real. The Checkerboard approach to the old Kai Tak airport is another that most (all?) airlines mandated must be signed off in the sim first. But those are some of the exceptions, in general you just brief, read the charts and get on with it.
J4CKO said:
Is it a case of,
Here’s the charts, off you pop, watch out for the mountains to the south and it can be a bit windy.
Certainly for our company that pretty much covers 99% of airports! As mentioned above, it’s nowhere near as complicated as you might think it is. Here’s the charts, off you pop, watch out for the mountains to the south and it can be a bit windy.
We have Cat A, B and C airports; Cat A you’ll just have a look at the charts and ops manual during cruise just to make sure there’s nothing to catch you out. Cat B they’ll send the airport plates through the night before to study and self brief but it’s usually something mundane like there not being an instrument approach to one of the runways (could have a bearing on whether you can actually land though!) . Cat C is basically training required, like Chambery, but they’re few and far between.
Airlines probably have a bit more structure but bizjet operators go to so many weird and wonderful places that you couldn’t train for even a tiny fraction of them.
In our airline we have categories of aerodrome.
Cat A - no specific threats with regards to approach, terrain, runway, weather etc.
Can be self briefed during cruise with reference to CCI’s
Cat B - specific threat from approach (glide slope, offset, non precision only etc), terrain within certain distance and height from aerodrome, local weather phonomalies.
Specific threats are highlighted in CCI’s and normally referenced to during briefing.
Cat B** - used to be known as Cat C but normally requires specific training in the simulator due to approach type, area of operation or runway requirements.
These training can also be completed with a trainer in the other seat.
These aerodromes are also Captain only landing and/or take off.
It does raise the question of when the Captain becomes incapacitated.
The FO, although they would have acted as support during simulator training, would not have landed at these specific aerodromes and are challenging in normal conditions.
Cat A - no specific threats with regards to approach, terrain, runway, weather etc.
Can be self briefed during cruise with reference to CCI’s
Cat B - specific threat from approach (glide slope, offset, non precision only etc), terrain within certain distance and height from aerodrome, local weather phonomalies.
Specific threats are highlighted in CCI’s and normally referenced to during briefing.
Cat B** - used to be known as Cat C but normally requires specific training in the simulator due to approach type, area of operation or runway requirements.
These training can also be completed with a trainer in the other seat.
These aerodromes are also Captain only landing and/or take off.
It does raise the question of when the Captain becomes incapacitated.
The FO, although they would have acted as support during simulator training, would not have landed at these specific aerodromes and are challenging in normal conditions.
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