Track car on a budget
Discussion
Hi all, looking for options, I'm looking to create a car for some amateur racing (750mc). I'd rather not spend a huge amount and it seems unnecessary so lets say £1000 for a car.
Ideally I'd like to make it close to either 145bhp/ton or 180bhp/ton for class purposes,, I don't mind spending a bit to get it there but don't want to spend thousands either.
Bare in mind I don't care that it may not be the very best option to win races, this is more of a stepping stone to get experience so I can maybe move on to bigger things.
I'm not particularly thrilled by Clios or 3 series so none of those please.
I've had a few ideas myself but I want to hear from you guys, thanks
Ideally I'd like to make it close to either 145bhp/ton or 180bhp/ton for class purposes,, I don't mind spending a bit to get it there but don't want to spend thousands either.
Bare in mind I don't care that it may not be the very best option to win races, this is more of a stepping stone to get experience so I can maybe move on to bigger things.
I'm not particularly thrilled by Clios or 3 series so none of those please.
I've had a few ideas myself but I want to hear from you guys, thanks
Marshalled a 750mc event a while back. Seem to think their regs are fairly open so fiesta to US or jap import can race.
Which class are you looking to “compete” in ? What are the regs and is competitive in this or last years championship? Fiesta, Saxo, Mini, MG?
Often get a car from a racer who’s run out of funds, talent or time ... Northen Sports car club NSCC are also worth a look.
Which class are you looking to “compete” in ? What are the regs and is competitive in this or last years championship? Fiesta, Saxo, Mini, MG?
Often get a car from a racer who’s run out of funds, talent or time ... Northen Sports car club NSCC are also worth a look.
I race in 750mc (great club with great racing) go and take a look at what other people are running.
The cars you will be up against are nothing like track day cars they are properly developed racers.
Are you looking at hot hatch or enduro/open?
Obvious choice is based on low weight hence things alike saxo 106 do well in class.
If you turn up in a track car / road based car you will be getting lapped quite soon into the race.
The cars you will be up against are nothing like track day cars they are properly developed racers.
Are you looking at hot hatch or enduro/open?
Obvious choice is based on low weight hence things alike saxo 106 do well in class.
If you turn up in a track car / road based car you will be getting lapped quite soon into the race.
I'm looking at the Road Sports series with maybe another one on the side, possible Club Enduro or Hot Hatch depending on which car I end up with. I have never raced before so Road Sports looks like it'll suit an amateur like myself.
Turn7 said:
Where does the RX8 sit in your figures ?
I have thought about it, funds aren't tight but I would like to keep it fairly budget.J1JPE said:
Often get a car from a racer who’s run out of funds, talent or time ... Northen Sports car club NSCC are also worth a look.
Thanks for that!Edited by Valgar on Friday 17th August 21:03
The thing I'm learning from trying to do motorsport on the cheap is that the fancy stuff costs the same no matter what you drive... its the day to day costs of an older car that sting. With that in mind, maybe have a look at Audi TT's? a 180bhp is FWD i think rather than quattro, re-maps to 225 easily and is Mk4 golf parts so cheap and plentiful. also available cheap as chips at the moment. I Hill climb a 3.2TT and its a pain as being a 3.2 and 4wd (sort of) it puts me in a class where I just get pasted!
I suppose thats the main thing, see what other people race and buy something competitive for the class you're looking at.
I suppose thats the main thing, see what other people race and buy something competitive for the class you're looking at.
meehaja said:
The thing I'm learning from trying to do motorsport on the cheap is that the fancy stuff costs the same no matter what you drive... its the day to day costs of an older car that sting. With that in mind, maybe have a look at Audi TT's? a 180bhp is FWD i think rather than quattro, re-maps to 225 easily and is Mk4 golf parts so cheap and plentiful. also available cheap as chips at the moment. I Hill climb a 3.2TT and its a pain as being a 3.2 and 4wd (sort of) it puts me in a class where I just get pasted!
I suppose thats the main thing, see what other people race and buy something competitive for the class you're looking at.
I had seen that TTs are fairly cheap, would the 225 not be better than a 180? There is no 4wd restriction according to the regsI suppose thats the main thing, see what other people race and buy something competitive for the class you're looking at.
Valgar said:
I had seen that TTs are fairly cheap, would the 225 not be better than a 180? There is no 4wd restriction according to the regs
The cost of turning it into a racing car that laps at a decent time is huge compared to the cost of buying a road car to convert.For example a decent ex stock hatch Saxo VTR (about 120 bhp) will be a few seconds a lap faster than a TT 225 round most tracks.
A used proven race car ex 750 can be bought from £3k upwards.
Buy a £1,500 TT 225 road car and spend £1,500= £2,000 making it race prepared car and then spend £1,500 on suspension £500 on brakes and £500-£1000 tuning it up, and it will still be slower than the £3k racing Saxo 1600c with 120 bhp on AST trick suspension..
Best go and see what other people are running - MX5 probably best/fun/cheapest answer but as said above buy a car that's already been raced then improve it.
rallycross said:
The cost of turning it into a racing car that laps at a decent time is huge compared to the cost of buying a road car to convert.
For example a decent ex stock hatch Saxo VTR (about 120 bhp) will be a few seconds a lap faster than a TT 225 round most tracks.
A used proven race car ex 750 can be bought from £3k upwards.
Buy a £1,500 TT 225 road car and spend £1,500= £2,000 making it race prepared car and then spend £1,500 on suspension £500 on brakes and £500-£1000 tuning it up, and it will still be slower than the £3k racing Saxo 1600c with 120 bhp on AST trick suspension..
Best go and see what other people are running - MX5 probably best/fun/cheapest answer but as said above buy a car that's already been raced then improve it.
Thanks for that, even after a quick look I've found some decent looking motors, 106, Saxo, mx5 etc. some ready to go!For example a decent ex stock hatch Saxo VTR (about 120 bhp) will be a few seconds a lap faster than a TT 225 round most tracks.
A used proven race car ex 750 can be bought from £3k upwards.
Buy a £1,500 TT 225 road car and spend £1,500= £2,000 making it race prepared car and then spend £1,500 on suspension £500 on brakes and £500-£1000 tuning it up, and it will still be slower than the £3k racing Saxo 1600c with 120 bhp on AST trick suspension..
Best go and see what other people are running - MX5 probably best/fun/cheapest answer but as said above buy a car that's already been raced then improve it.
I was fancying a MG ZS 180 seeing as I am quite familiar with the KV6 and there is one local to me for under £500 with a dodgy water pump in typical KV6 fashion
this looks quite interesting/unusual choice, has an LSD, has been raced, could be improved.slightly odd choice using a 5 door shell.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Rover-200-1-8-cc-Race-C...
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Rover-200-1-8-cc-Race-C...
rallycross said:
this looks quite interesting/unusual choice, has an LSD, has been raced, could be improved.slightly odd choice using a 5 door shell.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Rover-200-1-8-cc-Race-C...
Nice. That’s more like it. OP go see?https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Rover-200-1-8-cc-Race-C...
What's your budget ?
race cars direct is worth a look but there's not much on there for under 8k
how about forgetting about racing and do hill climbs and sprints then you could enter a road going class so essentially no mods and thrash the pants of it , have a look for a clio 172 cup there pretty good .
race cars direct is worth a look but there's not much on there for under 8k
how about forgetting about racing and do hill climbs and sprints then you could enter a road going class so essentially no mods and thrash the pants of it , have a look for a clio 172 cup there pretty good .
Thanks for all the input, I did like the look of the Rover, looks like a nice setup but I'm not sure how good a Rover 200 is going to be on track, it wasn't exactly brimming with race pedigree out of the showroom although that k-series does look nice.
Ideally I'd like the budget to stay below £2500 but this includes the cost of the rollcage, fire extingusiher so really I'd like the car to be around £1000 so I can spend some money on race suspension.
I'm not going to be competing for the lead in my first season, it's more of a learning experience and to have some fun and something to develop over time.
The ford Puma has been catching my eye as once stripped it'll meet the 145hp/ton class with no engine mods with the possibility to tune it to meet the 180hp/ton class later on.
Ideally I'd like the budget to stay below £2500 but this includes the cost of the rollcage, fire extingusiher so really I'd like the car to be around £1000 so I can spend some money on race suspension.
I'm not going to be competing for the lead in my first season, it's more of a learning experience and to have some fun and something to develop over time.
The ford Puma has been catching my eye as once stripped it'll meet the 145hp/ton class with no engine mods with the possibility to tune it to meet the 180hp/ton class later on.
Valgar, have you done many track days? Probably, please don't think I'm being condescending...
I've done quite a few and mostly at Bedford, in a variety of cars. My first 8 or 10 trackdays were in a MK1 1.6 MX5 that had been living under the bushes in my garden for 5 years. The first time I did a track day, I had intended for the day to be a shake down for the kit car I had been building, but it was not finished in time. So, I took the scrap MX5. All I did was drill some holes in the floor to let the water out, check the oil, pads and brake fluid, tyre pressures and fit a battery to it. It was the slowest car out there, but I learned loads and had an absolute blast. I had so much fun that I flogged the relatively expensive kit car and spent a bit improving the MX5 in between track days.
By the time I sold it, it was stripped out, it had harnesses, lightweight seats, race pads & fluid, semi-slicks, old (but good) coil-overs and it was no longer the slowest car out there, but it was still probably one of the lowest powered...and that's why I sold it.
I've now got a bike powered kit car, but also a stripped out Corolla TSport that I take on wet days. Both are faster than the MX5. The Corolla is a low budget track shed (still probably under £1200), gutted, proper brakes and tyres and it's great fun, especially in the wet when it's faster than many of the expensive cars, but it's front wheel drive and consequently, for me, will never be as much fun.
In your shoes, I'd buy an MX5 or a MK3 MR2. They're rwd, small, relatively light, nicely balanced and fun to drive in standard spec.
I've done quite a few and mostly at Bedford, in a variety of cars. My first 8 or 10 trackdays were in a MK1 1.6 MX5 that had been living under the bushes in my garden for 5 years. The first time I did a track day, I had intended for the day to be a shake down for the kit car I had been building, but it was not finished in time. So, I took the scrap MX5. All I did was drill some holes in the floor to let the water out, check the oil, pads and brake fluid, tyre pressures and fit a battery to it. It was the slowest car out there, but I learned loads and had an absolute blast. I had so much fun that I flogged the relatively expensive kit car and spent a bit improving the MX5 in between track days.
By the time I sold it, it was stripped out, it had harnesses, lightweight seats, race pads & fluid, semi-slicks, old (but good) coil-overs and it was no longer the slowest car out there, but it was still probably one of the lowest powered...and that's why I sold it.
I've now got a bike powered kit car, but also a stripped out Corolla TSport that I take on wet days. Both are faster than the MX5. The Corolla is a low budget track shed (still probably under £1200), gutted, proper brakes and tyres and it's great fun, especially in the wet when it's faster than many of the expensive cars, but it's front wheel drive and consequently, for me, will never be as much fun.
In your shoes, I'd buy an MX5 or a MK3 MR2. They're rwd, small, relatively light, nicely balanced and fun to drive in standard spec.
Toed64 said:
Valgar, have you done many track days? Probably, please don't think I'm being condescending...
I've done quite a few and mostly at Bedford, in a variety of cars. My first 8 or 10 trackdays were in a MK1 1.6 MX5 that had been living under the bushes in my garden for 5 years. The first time I did a track day, I had intended for the day to be a shake down for the kit car I had been building, but it was not finished in time. So, I took the scrap MX5. All I did was drill some holes in the floor to let the water out, check the oil, pads and brake fluid, tyre pressures and fit a battery to it. It was the slowest car out there, but I learned loads and had an absolute blast. I had so much fun that I flogged the relatively expensive kit car and spent a bit improving the MX5 in between track days.
By the time I sold it, it was stripped out, it had harnesses, lightweight seats, race pads & fluid, semi-slicks, old (but good) coil-overs and it was no longer the slowest car out there, but it was still probably one of the lowest powered...and that's why I sold it.
I've now got a bike powered kit car, but also a stripped out Corolla TSport that I take on wet days. Both are faster than the MX5. The Corolla is a low budget track shed (still probably under £1200), gutted, proper brakes and tyres and it's great fun, especially in the wet when it's faster than many of the expensive cars, but it's front wheel drive and consequently, for me, will never be as much fun.
In your shoes, I'd buy an MX5 or a MK3 MR2. They're rwd, small, relatively light, nicely balanced and fun to drive in standard spec.
I've done a few track days many moons ago in a friends 306 xsi (Phwaor!). But pretty inexperienced it has to be said, I'd be definitely looking at tuition. The MR2 MK3 was very high in my thoughts. Like you say it's pretty ready from the factory, I've got until next year to build this up too.I've done quite a few and mostly at Bedford, in a variety of cars. My first 8 or 10 trackdays were in a MK1 1.6 MX5 that had been living under the bushes in my garden for 5 years. The first time I did a track day, I had intended for the day to be a shake down for the kit car I had been building, but it was not finished in time. So, I took the scrap MX5. All I did was drill some holes in the floor to let the water out, check the oil, pads and brake fluid, tyre pressures and fit a battery to it. It was the slowest car out there, but I learned loads and had an absolute blast. I had so much fun that I flogged the relatively expensive kit car and spent a bit improving the MX5 in between track days.
By the time I sold it, it was stripped out, it had harnesses, lightweight seats, race pads & fluid, semi-slicks, old (but good) coil-overs and it was no longer the slowest car out there, but it was still probably one of the lowest powered...and that's why I sold it.
I've now got a bike powered kit car, but also a stripped out Corolla TSport that I take on wet days. Both are faster than the MX5. The Corolla is a low budget track shed (still probably under £1200), gutted, proper brakes and tyres and it's great fun, especially in the wet when it's faster than many of the expensive cars, but it's front wheel drive and consequently, for me, will never be as much fun.
In your shoes, I'd buy an MX5 or a MK3 MR2. They're rwd, small, relatively light, nicely balanced and fun to drive in standard spec.
Clio 172/182 all the way. £1000 will get you a bit of a tatty one, but if it's for racing who cares. You just need to be careful of the cambelt/dephaser as if it hasn't been done recently, it'll cost you around £500. But otherwise parts are cheap and last a long time in my experience.
You could probably get away with spending £500/600 on upgrading the brakes and fitting some lowering springs and you'll be away. I'm fairly confident you'll get one race ready for your budget and you'll have a lot of fun in the process!
Edit: Just seen you're not thrilled by Clios, but have you tried one?
You could probably get away with spending £500/600 on upgrading the brakes and fitting some lowering springs and you'll be away. I'm fairly confident you'll get one race ready for your budget and you'll have a lot of fun in the process!
Edit: Just seen you're not thrilled by Clios, but have you tried one?
BenLowden said:
Clio 172/182 all the way.
£1000 will get you a bit of a tatty one, but if it's for racing who cares.
You just need to be careful of the cambelt/dephaser as if it hasn't been done recently,
it'll cost you around £500. But otherwise parts are cheap and last a long time in my experience.
You could probably get away with spending £500/600 on upgrading the brakes and fitting some lowering springs and you'll be away. I'm fairly confident you'll get one race ready for your budget and you'll have a lot of fun in the process!
road car - £500- £3000£1000 will get you a bit of a tatty one, but if it's for racing who cares.
You just need to be careful of the cambelt/dephaser as if it hasn't been done recently,
it'll cost you around £500. But otherwise parts are cheap and last a long time in my experience.
You could probably get away with spending £500/600 on upgrading the brakes and fitting some lowering springs and you'll be away. I'm fairly confident you'll get one race ready for your budget and you'll have a lot of fun in the process!
Fitting proper roll cage for MSA racing - £1,200-£3000+
race suitable suspension - £1,500 - £2,500+ (you wont get anywhere with cheap suspension)
seat, msa harness, fire and cut off's £500- £2,000 plus
race suit, helmet and HANS £800 to £2,000+
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