Can I protect myself in a used car ownership dispute?

[larrylamb11]

I've often wondered about this...... is it possible to protect oneself in a used car purchase in case there is a future ownership dispute? and if so, how?

Here's the scenario:-
I found a car advertised on line, vendor selling an unstarted / unfinished project. It's advertised as keys and V5C lost and been off the road many years. An online registration check shows no records found for the displayed registration number. We already know that possession of a V5C does not constitute legal ownership, only keeper status.
On viewing, the car is not at the vendor's address as it's in 'yard' storage with another of his cars and clearly not moved in a long time. Vendor states he bought it off the previous owner some years ago as is and where it sits now - i.e. in the same place in the same yard. He also met this previous owner at the yard and bought it with no V5C / keys, receiving a receipt for his purchase. So the guy I am buying it off is declaring he has legal ownership (although no tangible proof of same).
If I buy this car, receiving a receipt for my purchase from my vendor, I am buying it in 'good faith' in the honest belief that the guy selling it to me really does own it and has the authority to sell it to me.....

BUT, what if he's lifting my leg and actually doesn't own it at all? what if the car has simply been abandoned by the genuine owner / registered keeper and is now being sold without their consent? how does one unravel that?
Would I be legally bound to return the car to the person claiming ownership? how do they prove they are the legal owner? does it become a tedious civil law case? a he said / she said?

One hears mythical stories of people spending fortunes restoring old cars only to lose the lot when the 'true' owner materialises years after the car was 'stolen' but I've never actually come across anyone who has suffered that fate either in real life or online.... so what's the worst case scenario and how, as a buyer, can one protect oneself from that possible eventuality?

[Monkeylegend]

If in doubt not buying it is probably the safest option. Stating the obvious but why take the risk if there is no definitive proof that it is his/hers to sell.

[Graveworm]

I don't think you could completely indemnify yourself but if you really want it then obviously there are some things you can do. For example Vin and engine number checks & make sure they match in all the places they should be.
Speak to the local police, if you can find an open front counter and then try for a deal where you pay a small deposit contingent on you successfully getting a V5 or ask the seller to get one.
This could reduce but not remove the risk. That said there is some risk in all used car purchases.

[larrylamb11]

Monkeylegend said:

If in doubt not buying it is probably the safest option. Stating the obvious but why take the risk if there is no definitive proof that it is his/hers to sell.

A fair point. The risk is quantifiable though - hence the post.
I am aware of what I think are the risks and after consideration have concluded it's a risk worth taking......I am going to buy it anyway and roll the dice. I am still interested in the definitive legal position though and the potential consequences if it all goes pear-shaped.

[Wooda80]

You might feel more comfortable that you have the V5, but whether you have it or not the only document that will demonstrate ownership is the invoice.

If you have proof that the seller is who he says he is, and he gives you an invoice then that's as much as you can ever do really.

[Monkeylegend]

larrylamb11 said:

Monkeylegend said:

If in doubt not buying it is probably the safest option. Stating the obvious but why take the risk if there is no definitive proof that it is his/hers to sell.

A fair point. The risk is quantifiable though - hence the post.
I am aware of what I think are the risks and after consideration have concluded it's a risk worth taking......I am going to buy it anyway and roll the dice. I am still interested in the definitive legal position though and the potential consequences if it all goes pear-shaped.

Out of interest what car is it?

Presumably it needs a comprehensive restoration job. Just need to be careful as you mentioned that you don't end up spending a lot of money only to have it repossessed.

[NickGRhodes]

HPI check ?

Edit: scratch that, they require a V5 and their Guarantee requires vehicle is bought at from the address of the registered keeper.

Edited by NickGRhodes on Tuesday 16th October 13:19

[TooMany2cvs]

larrylamb11 said:

I've often wondered about this...... is it possible to protect oneself in a used car purchase in case there is a future ownership dispute? and if so, how?

Simply put, you can't ever be 100% sure.
The true ultimate legal owner isn't recorded anywhere - just the "keeper", which the V5C is at great pains to point out is not the same thing.

larrylamb11 said:

Here's the scenario:-
...
If I buy this car, receiving a receipt for my purchase from my vendor, I am buying it in 'good faith' in the honest belief that the guy selling it to me really does own it and has the authority to sell it to me.....

BUT, what if he's lifting my leg and actually doesn't own it at all? what if the car has simply been abandoned by the genuine owner / registered keeper and is now being sold without their consent? how does one unravel that?

Does any of that vary from buying any other used car?
Even from a showroom...
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=15...