Arranging a car convoy - legal implications
Discussion
We have setup a new car group where we will be arranging various meets and events. Our first meetup is likely to be a drive into Wales on a Sunday morning, enjoy the roads followed by lunch.
What are the legal implications of us doing this. We will likely have a convoy leader and will ensure speeds are sensible, but what happens in the event that some members of the group start driving dangerously or are caught speeding?
Not sure how the bigger guys do it, e.g. Cannonball, SCD etc, but would be good to understand more before our first event.
We could ask everyone to sign disclaimers but that's a bit of a faff.
What are the legal implications of us doing this. We will likely have a convoy leader and will ensure speeds are sensible, but what happens in the event that some members of the group start driving dangerously or are caught speeding?
Not sure how the bigger guys do it, e.g. Cannonball, SCD etc, but would be good to understand more before our first event.
We could ask everyone to sign disclaimers but that's a bit of a faff.
Do you know the people or are you advertising this in a public arena? Personally I wouldn't do this unless I knew the character and abilities of everyone in attendance. I have been on some very well run and responsible ride/drives out, and have been on one or two when things started to get out of hand very quickly.
Interestingly, in my experience, the more expensive the machinery, the more irresponsible the behavior.
Interestingly, in my experience, the more expensive the machinery, the more irresponsible the behavior.
LimaDelta said:
Do you know the people or are you advertising this in a public arena? Personally I wouldn't do this unless I knew the character and abilities of everyone in attendance. I have been on some very well run and responsible ride/drives out, and have been on one or two when things started to get out of hand very quickly.
Interestingly, in my experience, the more expensive the machinery, the more irresponsible the behavior.
It's advertised within our business community only. We don't know all of the attendees so can't vouch for them.Interestingly, in my experience, the more expensive the machinery, the more irresponsible the behavior.
The criteria is that they must be heavily involved in property development or investment.
It is faf, but the disclaimer could be important...
I'd get everyone to sign to say they understand that they are fully responsible for their own driving, and obeying all laws, of the road and otherwise at all times. That nothing the convoy leader, nor other participants does should suggest to them at any point that they should break the law or drive otherwise as to their own wishes. And finally that should they become in trouble with law, that all points or penalties are their sole responsibility and that you will not provide any defence or justification for their actions.
It's sensible really, but just ensuring they agree that if they get caught speeding, or have a crash, that they don't come to you for compensation.
Then should the worst happen, you won't find yourself in deep trouble for something you didn't do. Remember when faced with a ban, big fine or worse some people will do anything to get out of it.
I'd get everyone to sign to say they understand that they are fully responsible for their own driving, and obeying all laws, of the road and otherwise at all times. That nothing the convoy leader, nor other participants does should suggest to them at any point that they should break the law or drive otherwise as to their own wishes. And finally that should they become in trouble with law, that all points or penalties are their sole responsibility and that you will not provide any defence or justification for their actions.
It's sensible really, but just ensuring they agree that if they get caught speeding, or have a crash, that they don't come to you for compensation.
Then should the worst happen, you won't find yourself in deep trouble for something you didn't do. Remember when faced with a ban, big fine or worse some people will do anything to get out of it.
Worms, can of.
I think Nottingham ban more than 5 cars together, other authorities have different by laws. Each force seems to adopt a different approach. Getting someone to sign a "waiver" means nothing and could actually lead to more problems, like proof there was a "convoy run"
Having said the above, never seems to be problem when it's a funeral. There was about 30 Land Rovers in convoy for a friend of ours no issues, although the police had been informed.
I think Nottingham ban more than 5 cars together, other authorities have different by laws. Each force seems to adopt a different approach. Getting someone to sign a "waiver" means nothing and could actually lead to more problems, like proof there was a "convoy run"
Having said the above, never seems to be problem when it's a funeral. There was about 30 Land Rovers in convoy for a friend of ours no issues, although the police had been informed.
phil4 said:
It is faf, but the disclaimer could be important...
I'd get everyone to sign to say they understand that they are fully responsible for their own driving, and obeying all laws, of the road and otherwise at all times. That nothing the convoy leader, nor other participants does should suggest to them at any point that they should break the law or drive otherwise as to their own wishes. And finally that should they become in trouble with law, that all points or penalties are their sole responsibility and that you will not provide any defence or justification for their actions.
It's sensible really, but just ensuring they agree that if they get caught speeding, or have a crash, that they don't come to you for compensation.
Then should the worst happen, you won't find yourself in deep trouble for something you didn't do. Remember when faced with a ban, big fine or worse some people will do anything to get out of it.
Hmm. Would this not change things from being a group of people travelling to the same destination, to an organised event? I don't know the legal ramifications, but if paperwork is involved then a degree of organisation has taken place, and I can't help thinking that that might lead the 'organisors' liable if some unforeseen event took place.I'd get everyone to sign to say they understand that they are fully responsible for their own driving, and obeying all laws, of the road and otherwise at all times. That nothing the convoy leader, nor other participants does should suggest to them at any point that they should break the law or drive otherwise as to their own wishes. And finally that should they become in trouble with law, that all points or penalties are their sole responsibility and that you will not provide any defence or justification for their actions.
It's sensible really, but just ensuring they agree that if they get caught speeding, or have a crash, that they don't come to you for compensation.
Then should the worst happen, you won't find yourself in deep trouble for something you didn't do. Remember when faced with a ban, big fine or worse some people will do anything to get out of it.
https://www.expressandstar.com/news/crime/2018/02/...
My understanding was that this was being considered in a number of different regions, so it might be worth investigating this before hand.
We will generally be travelling to rural or scenic locations so the WM or Nottingham car cruising ban shouldn't be an issue.
The disclaimer is an interesting one, seems as though there are 2 sides to it. It will clearly be publicised that it's an event as we have a WhatsApp and private FB group, so there's no denying it's an organised convoy and meet either way.
The disclaimer is an interesting one, seems as though there are 2 sides to it. It will clearly be publicised that it's an event as we have a WhatsApp and private FB group, so there's no denying it's an organised convoy and meet either way.
topless360 said:
We will generally be travelling to rural or scenic locations so the WM or Nottingham car cruising ban shouldn't be an issue.
The disclaimer is an interesting one, seems as though there are 2 sides to it. It will clearly be publicised that it's an event as we have a WhatsApp and private FB group, so there's no denying it's an organised convoy and meet either way.
Check the definition of 'touring assembly' which an organised event like this may be though it's more likely to fall under 'social run':The disclaimer is an interesting one, seems as though there are 2 sides to it. It will clearly be publicised that it's an event as we have a WhatsApp and private FB group, so there's no denying it's an organised convoy and meet either way.
https://www.msauk.org/Clubs/FAQ/FAQ-Certificates-o...
Riley Blue said:
topless360 said:
We will generally be travelling to rural or scenic locations so the WM or Nottingham car cruising ban shouldn't be an issue.
The disclaimer is an interesting one, seems as though there are 2 sides to it. It will clearly be publicised that it's an event as we have a WhatsApp and private FB group, so there's no denying it's an organised convoy and meet either way.
Check the definition of 'touring assembly' which an organised event like this may be though it's more likely to fall under 'social run':The disclaimer is an interesting one, seems as though there are 2 sides to it. It will clearly be publicised that it's an event as we have a WhatsApp and private FB group, so there's no denying it's an organised convoy and meet either way.
https://www.msauk.org/Clubs/FAQ/FAQ-Certificates-o...
But at the end of the day this is a social run, no competition or prizes just a bunch of like minded people going for lunch.
I run these kind of events week in week out for PCGB and it’s not a problem and never had trouble with not being allowed to go somewhere.
I would produce a route and just put a note at the top stating that event is being held on the public roads and that all the rules of the road apply. Please drive responsibley and remember this is not a race. Drivers are responsible for the road worthiness of their cars and that all are appropriately taxed and ensured. Enjoy the drive and see you at lunch.
If you behave yourselves there will be no problem.
As supersport said above.
I recently organised a ride out for motorbikes. (Distinguished Gentleman's Ride).
We had 245 bikes turn up. We did notify the council and the police but that was purely because we wanted to close Guildford High Street for the start!
Regularly have rides out for lots of bikes. Never been a problem.
Added to the wording above, I state that each rider (driver) should act as if they were riding alone.
I recently organised a ride out for motorbikes. (Distinguished Gentleman's Ride).
We had 245 bikes turn up. We did notify the council and the police but that was purely because we wanted to close Guildford High Street for the start!
Regularly have rides out for lots of bikes. Never been a problem.
Added to the wording above, I state that each rider (driver) should act as if they were riding alone.
We do run outs, as phea (PistonHeads east anglia)
We have rules like no overtaking others who are on the run with you,
Dont speed in 30, 40 50 Limits
If we get lots of cars often its better to go off in small groups say 10 cars with a few minutes gap between groups.
Group leader to stop and wait for others to catch up if it looks like the group is getting a bit lost!
In the group if you get to a turning and the car behind has disappeared! wait at the turn for a bit for them to catch up
Can be lots of fun and you get to find out what other cars can and cant do.
Then there is BBWF, TVR Big Bad Wedge Fest, every year when we do a few run outs 50 TVR Wedge's together in convoy, seems to get everyone smiling!
We have rules like no overtaking others who are on the run with you,
Dont speed in 30, 40 50 Limits
If we get lots of cars often its better to go off in small groups say 10 cars with a few minutes gap between groups.
Group leader to stop and wait for others to catch up if it looks like the group is getting a bit lost!
In the group if you get to a turning and the car behind has disappeared! wait at the turn for a bit for them to catch up
Can be lots of fun and you get to find out what other cars can and cant do.
Then there is BBWF, TVR Big Bad Wedge Fest, every year when we do a few run outs 50 TVR Wedge's together in convoy, seems to get everyone smiling!
No. And the one from Brooklands didn't go from Brooklands!
We were Surrey Hills. Guildford High Street, up past Newlands Corner, Gomshall, Where and a coffee break at Polesden Lacey. From there, over Ranmore Common, through Dorking, up Box Hill and ended up at a pub in Headley.
As I said, 245 bikes. Not bad for a first attempt!
We were Surrey Hills. Guildford High Street, up past Newlands Corner, Gomshall, Where and a coffee break at Polesden Lacey. From there, over Ranmore Common, through Dorking, up Box Hill and ended up at a pub in Headley.
As I said, 245 bikes. Not bad for a first attempt!
Been years since I did anything like this so will defer to the advice above. Just my 2ps worth from back in the day - remove any wording suggesting "convoy" or " a leader" or anything suggesting checkpoints or timing en route. Have a meeting place a departure time and a time to meet at the other end and be clear there are no special privileges its an open event on public roads, usual laws of the road apply.
Informally once you've done a couple you realise any more than 3 or 4 cars together its impossible to keep together safely on public roads in normal traffic so the sensible people realise this and all is well unfortunately it only takes one idiot....
Informally once you've done a couple you realise any more than 3 or 4 cars together its impossible to keep together safely on public roads in normal traffic so the sensible people realise this and all is well unfortunately it only takes one idiot....
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