CrossClimates better than true winters for UK...?
Discussion
I need to buy some tyres to fit to the winter wheels I have for my BMW X5.
In the past, I’ve always fitted “proper” winter tyres - Continental TS, Pirelli Scorpion - etc. But I am wondering whether a tyre like the Michelin CrossClimate would actually be better for UK winter conditions (I’m in the SE) than a full-on winter tyre.
Auto Bild’s recent comparison test was pretty positive about them
http://www.tyrereviews.co.uk/Article/2018-Auto-Bil...
In the past, I’ve always fitted “proper” winter tyres - Continental TS, Pirelli Scorpion - etc. But I am wondering whether a tyre like the Michelin CrossClimate would actually be better for UK winter conditions (I’m in the SE) than a full-on winter tyre.
Auto Bild’s recent comparison test was pretty positive about them
http://www.tyrereviews.co.uk/Article/2018-Auto-Bil...
The Crossclimate is an all-season tyre, but is summer tyre biased.
I was in the same predicament, Autobild actually rated the Goodyear Vector 4seasons better in winter conditions, it too is an all-season tyre but is more winter biased. Had them fitted today...
http://www.tyrereviews.co.uk/Article/2018-Auto-Bil...
I was in the same predicament, Autobild actually rated the Goodyear Vector 4seasons better in winter conditions, it too is an all-season tyre but is more winter biased. Had them fitted today...
http://www.tyrereviews.co.uk/Article/2018-Auto-Bil...
For the south east of the UK, where we may see 3- 5 days of snow a year, and possibly 20 days of temps below 0c from 6 am until 11 pm they make great sense. Winter tyres do make a difference but it isn't that cold, wintery or grim in most parts of the UK from Nov 1 until March 30, so yes I think cross climates are the better option.
silver1011 said:
The Crossclimate is an all-season tyre, but is summer tyre biased.
I was in the same predicament, Autobild actually rated the Goodyear Vector 4seasons better in winter conditions, it too is an all-season tyre but is more winter biased. Had them fitted today...
http://www.tyrereviews.co.uk/Article/2018-Auto-Bil...
Thanks for the link, was going to order the bridgestones might look again, although their dry and wet performance is useful and any snow use would be better than summersI was in the same predicament, Autobild actually rated the Goodyear Vector 4seasons better in winter conditions, it too is an all-season tyre but is more winter biased. Had them fitted today...
http://www.tyrereviews.co.uk/Article/2018-Auto-Bil...
I drive 90K a year and it is just not worth the investment . I have only been stuck once in the last 10 years and that was on the 303 near Salisbury this March . I was there all night and snow tyres would not have been any good as the road was shut
When you do have a capable 4X4 with winter tyres it is still a waste of time as the cars in front of you wont have the capabilities that you have and you will be going nowhere
Are we really going to have any bad weather this year . I dont think so !
When you do have a capable 4X4 with winter tyres it is still a waste of time as the cars in front of you wont have the capabilities that you have and you will be going nowhere
Are we really going to have any bad weather this year . I dont think so !
I've had cross climates on previous and current car. Excellent tyres basically, more than enough grip for most cars in day to day use (all but indistinguishable from a summer tyre) Good in the wet and have a bit extra low temp performance basically.
No they won't allow you to carry on weather regardless, but in all but the most extreme conditions (which we don't see in most of the South these days) you'll be fine and better off than with summer tyres fitted. Good wear too.
No they won't allow you to carry on weather regardless, but in all but the most extreme conditions (which we don't see in most of the South these days) you'll be fine and better off than with summer tyres fitted. Good wear too.
Tyrereviews is a great tyre geek resource, here’s their latest look at the market for all season tyres.
https://youtu.be/pe-gkTCOs7E
Edit, no idea why this has just been moved to BMW General, it’s not a BMW specific question just the OP happens to drive an X5?!
https://youtu.be/pe-gkTCOs7E
Edit, no idea why this has just been moved to BMW General, it’s not a BMW specific question just the OP happens to drive an X5?!
CrossClimates are not as good as the best winters nor the best summers, but they are not aiming at that segment.
From the reviews/videos I’ve seen, their performance in wet, ice, snow and dry is good enough - especially for the UK. Also means you don’t have buy and store separate winters.
For me, they are nowhere near as good as my cup 2s in the dry and my conti winters are symmetric and one size down so relatively cheap.
The winters were £800 including alloys so there is an upfront investment, but replacements are only £80 v over £250 for the cup 2s - and I will recoup the s/h alloy wheel value
From the reviews/videos I’ve seen, their performance in wet, ice, snow and dry is good enough - especially for the UK. Also means you don’t have buy and store separate winters.
For me, they are nowhere near as good as my cup 2s in the dry and my conti winters are symmetric and one size down so relatively cheap.
The winters were £800 including alloys so there is an upfront investment, but replacements are only £80 v over £250 for the cup 2s - and I will recoup the s/h alloy wheel value
jeremyh1 said:
I drive 90K a year and it is just not worth the investment . I have only been stuck once in the last 10 years and that was on the 303 near Salisbury this March . I was there all night and snow tyres would not have been any good as the road was shut
When you do have a capable 4X4 with winter tyres it is still a waste of time as the cars in front of you wont have the capabilities that you have and you will be going nowhere
Are we really going to have any bad weather this year . I dont think so !
Wise words sir! I commuted from just east of High Wycombe to near Stanmore from 1968 until 1989 and then St Albans instead of Stanmore until 2003. I never got stuck and the worst journey home was in a rented Morris Ital during the winter of discontent when the roads were not salted or gritted. It took five hours instead of 45 minutes but only because the traffic was solid, not because I couldn't make progress. The cars I had ranged from a 1955 Standard Ten, 2.8 Capri and lastly a Mk1 Mondeo, and drove 50k p.a. for a few years. It's not the car you're in, it's the traffic you are surrounded by. I have a set of winter tyres for my current car but only because I live half way up a hill in the Chilterns.When you do have a capable 4X4 with winter tyres it is still a waste of time as the cars in front of you wont have the capabilities that you have and you will be going nowhere
Are we really going to have any bad weather this year . I dont think so !
My son lived on the edge of Exmoor last winter (now in Sydney for a change) and his RS4 (Quattro 4x4) became buried in a snowdrift because his summer tyres had no grip at all in heavy snow. A colleague in a Subaru Forester (also 4x4) heaved his Audi out with no bother at all - on winter tyres. In North Devon winter tyres are a good idea, but in much of the south they're not really necessary.
Edited by motco on Saturday 3rd November 09:33
jeremyh1 said:
I drive 90K a year and it is just not worth the investment . I have only been stuck once in the last 10 years and that was on the 303 near Salisbury this March . I was there all night and snow tyres would not have been any good as the road was shut
When you do have a capable 4X4 with winter tyres it is still a waste of time as the cars in front of you wont have the capabilities that you have and you will be going nowhere
Are we really going to have any bad weather this year . I dont think so !
Cool, not what the OP asked though When you do have a capable 4X4 with winter tyres it is still a waste of time as the cars in front of you wont have the capabilities that you have and you will be going nowhere
Are we really going to have any bad weather this year . I dont think so !
I've got a set of nokian WR A4s on my z4, they are noticeably better than the Michelin cup 2s even when it's just "chilly" and damp/greasy
jeremyh1 said:
I drive 90K a year and it is just not worth the investment . I have only been stuck once in the last 10 years and that was on the 303 near Salisbury this March . I was there all night and snow tyres would not have been any good as the road was shut
When you do have a capable 4X4 with winter tyres it is still a waste of time as the cars in front of you wont have the capabilities that you have and you will be going nowhere
Are we really going to have any bad weather this year . I don't think so !
My experience is the total opposite, having the right tyres has allowed me not to get stuck on the main routes, allowing me to use the moorland roads on the hills whilst everyone else is stuck in the inevitable gridlock in the valleys below. When you do have a capable 4X4 with winter tyres it is still a waste of time as the cars in front of you wont have the capabilities that you have and you will be going nowhere
Are we really going to have any bad weather this year . I don't think so !
In March during the beast from the east I able to travel 200 miles from the SE to Yorkshire and for the last 30 miles through up to 5" of snow using roads that were empty whilst main roads were either closed due to accidents or gridlocked.
As for whether we'll get bad weather, you haven't got a clue so it matters not what you think.
As always one of these threads descends into folk presenting that what is the correct solution for them is automatically the one for every other person and use profile across the entire nation and anyone who chooses a different route is just plain wrong. Tiresome.
Whereas what the OP asked for was unbiased advice about the Cross lunate versus others.
Personally I've used mainly Nokians for years, previously two sets, a winter set and summer set. Currently on Nokian Weatherproof SUV as prefer a slight bias towards the snow end. When the current set is to be replaced, probably going to go for the Goodyear Vector 4 Seasons Gen 2 as they are less biased towards snow and better in the wet.
Some folks have commented that the Cross Climates are good in dry and the snow, but less impressive in wet and slush.
Whereas what the OP asked for was unbiased advice about the Cross lunate versus others.
Personally I've used mainly Nokians for years, previously two sets, a winter set and summer set. Currently on Nokian Weatherproof SUV as prefer a slight bias towards the snow end. When the current set is to be replaced, probably going to go for the Goodyear Vector 4 Seasons Gen 2 as they are less biased towards snow and better in the wet.
Some folks have commented that the Cross Climates are good in dry and the snow, but less impressive in wet and slush.
Wills2 said:
jeremyh1 said:
I drive 90K a year and it is just not worth the investment . I have only been stuck once in the last 10 years and that was on the 303 near Salisbury this March . I was there all night and snow tyres would not have been any good as the road was shut
When you do have a capable 4X4 with winter tyres it is still a waste of time as the cars in front of you wont have the capabilities that you have and you will be going nowhere
Are we really going to have any bad weather this year . I don't think so !
My experience is the total opposite, having the right tyres has allowed me not to get stuck on the main routes, allowing me to use the moorland roads on the hills whilst everyone else is stuck in the inevitable gridlock in the valleys below. When you do have a capable 4X4 with winter tyres it is still a waste of time as the cars in front of you wont have the capabilities that you have and you will be going nowhere
Are we really going to have any bad weather this year . I don't think so !
In March during the beast from the east I able to travel 200 miles from the SE to Yorkshire and for the last 30 miles through up to 5" of snow using roads that were empty whilst main roads were either closed due to accidents or gridlocked.
As for whether we'll get bad weather, you haven't got a clue so it matters not what you think.
Once again I am a courier doing 90 K a year all over Europe I have been doing this for 30 years I dont really care what you think .It is up to people on here weather they wish to draw from my actual real experience on this subject
Some of us like to help where we can and I am saying save your money .Not one to blow my own trumpet on anything but the way I make my living qualifies me to impart my experience on this subject
Hmmmm.....
Absolutely not a BMW question, so no idea why it’s been moved. My fault for not thinking just to say SUV.
It is disappointing to see the usual debate about whether winter tyres are worthwhile being re-run. That quality tyres with the snowflake symbol will be better on freezing mornings than 315/35/R20 P-Zero’s is frankly a given. My wife drives our kids to school from our rural frost hollow; she may not have the finely honed driving skills of the poster who racks up 90k miles a year...
The question I am seeking input on is whether the CrossClimates are likely to be better suited to SE England conditions than a set of full-on winters.
Absolutely not a BMW question, so no idea why it’s been moved. My fault for not thinking just to say SUV.
It is disappointing to see the usual debate about whether winter tyres are worthwhile being re-run. That quality tyres with the snowflake symbol will be better on freezing mornings than 315/35/R20 P-Zero’s is frankly a given. My wife drives our kids to school from our rural frost hollow; she may not have the finely honed driving skills of the poster who racks up 90k miles a year...
The question I am seeking input on is whether the CrossClimates are likely to be better suited to SE England conditions than a set of full-on winters.
I'm in an alpine location and for me there is no option but do the twice a year winter wheel change. We had 50cm of snow last week and the local slopes had 150cm!
I changed my tyres on 5 Oct this year. On the 2nd we had had snow in the village and I tried to get a wheel-change slow ASAP (my BMW dealer looks after the tyres / wheels as we don't have that much space).
On the 6th I then drove from home to the Netherlands. When I left home it was about 1 degree. In the Netherlands it was 25.
The winter tyres certainly were operating outside their preferred ranges. I could feel them being a bit too soft. You could see wear of the sort you'd see on a moderate track session.
Winter tyres are best below about 6 degrees when they will out-perform summers in things like braking, snow or no snow. Here I saw -30 last winter and -40 was predicted. You'd be mad not to fun good winters in these conditions. However you're not going to see that in the UK.
From memory of my time in the SE England you might have reasonably frequent early morning frosts, though typically it's no more than 2 or 3 degrees below. You can quite easily have temperatures in the teens in the winter. I suspect average temperature is above 6 degrees. You will see additional wear with winter tyres. I ran the winter tyres on an i3 a few years ago a few weeks too long and saw serious wear in those weeks.
Personally given you're at the sort of borderline temperature I'd be looking at the CrossClimates as a good compromise solution. It would be good to see what Michelin publish as the optimal operating temperatures.
I changed my tyres on 5 Oct this year. On the 2nd we had had snow in the village and I tried to get a wheel-change slow ASAP (my BMW dealer looks after the tyres / wheels as we don't have that much space).
On the 6th I then drove from home to the Netherlands. When I left home it was about 1 degree. In the Netherlands it was 25.
The winter tyres certainly were operating outside their preferred ranges. I could feel them being a bit too soft. You could see wear of the sort you'd see on a moderate track session.
Winter tyres are best below about 6 degrees when they will out-perform summers in things like braking, snow or no snow. Here I saw -30 last winter and -40 was predicted. You'd be mad not to fun good winters in these conditions. However you're not going to see that in the UK.
From memory of my time in the SE England you might have reasonably frequent early morning frosts, though typically it's no more than 2 or 3 degrees below. You can quite easily have temperatures in the teens in the winter. I suspect average temperature is above 6 degrees. You will see additional wear with winter tyres. I ran the winter tyres on an i3 a few years ago a few weeks too long and saw serious wear in those weeks.
Personally given you're at the sort of borderline temperature I'd be looking at the CrossClimates as a good compromise solution. It would be good to see what Michelin publish as the optimal operating temperatures.
jeremyh1 said:
Wills2 said:
jeremyh1 said:
I drive 90K a year and it is just not worth the investment . I have only been stuck once in the last 10 years and that was on the 303 near Salisbury this March . I was there all night and snow tyres would not have been any good as the road was shut
When you do have a capable 4X4 with winter tyres it is still a waste of time as the cars in front of you wont have the capabilities that you have and you will be going nowhere
Are we really going to have any bad weather this year . I don't think so !
My experience is the total opposite, having the right tyres has allowed me not to get stuck on the main routes, allowing me to use the moorland roads on the hills whilst everyone else is stuck in the inevitable gridlock in the valleys below. When you do have a capable 4X4 with winter tyres it is still a waste of time as the cars in front of you wont have the capabilities that you have and you will be going nowhere
Are we really going to have any bad weather this year . I don't think so !
In March during the beast from the east I able to travel 200 miles from the SE to Yorkshire and for the last 30 miles through up to 5" of snow using roads that were empty whilst main roads were either closed due to accidents or gridlocked.
As for whether we'll get bad weather, you haven't got a clue so it matters not what you think.
Once again I am a courier doing 90 K a year all over Europe I have been doing this for 30 years I dont really care what you think .It is up to people on here weather they wish to draw from my actual real experience on this subject
Some of us like to help where we can and I am saying save your money .Not one to blow my own trumpet on anything but the way I make my living qualifies me to impart my experience on this subject
jeremyh1 said:
The beast from the East only lasted a few hours mate !
Once again I am a courier doing 90 K a year all over Europe I have been doing this for 30 years I dont really care what you think .It is up to people on here weather they wish to draw from my actual real experience on this subject
Some of us like to help where we can and I am saying save your money .Not one to blow my own trumpet on anything but the way I make my living qualifies me to impart my experience on this subject
do winter tyres give less or more grip than summers when the temp is <7c?Once again I am a courier doing 90 K a year all over Europe I have been doing this for 30 years I dont really care what you think .It is up to people on here weather they wish to draw from my actual real experience on this subject
Some of us like to help where we can and I am saying save your money .Not one to blow my own trumpet on anything but the way I make my living qualifies me to impart my experience on this subject
I'm not a fan of cross climate tyres and would rather have a set of cheap alloys with dedicated winter tyres and then my normal alloys & tyres for the warmer months 
Had them on a previous 7 series and MG ZT and just never felt that were as good as decent summer tyres, for the warmer months, or as good as winters for the colder months. Grip levels were ok, but they weren't amazing
I've just put 18" alloys and Yokohama winter tyres onto my 7; it's got a bit milder, but they've been absolutely fine and the car drove superbly up/down the M6/56/A55 to Anglesey and back over the last few days; temps were between 6ºC and 14ºC! TBH the drive has given them a good 'scrub in' etc
It's not a case of if we'll get bad weather over here; just a matter of when. It does get cold, it does get wet and it can snow (ok, not everywhere); but the colder temps will soon be on us and the cold, wetter weather too and winter tyres perform hell of a lot better in those situations that the best summer tyres can.
I'd rather have decent winters on, for peace of mind, for when the weather changes and also knowing that my summer alloys & tyres aren't being trashed by the salt put onto the roads etc
Had them on a previous 7 series and MG ZT and just never felt that were as good as decent summer tyres, for the warmer months, or as good as winters for the colder months. Grip levels were ok, but they weren't amazingI've just put 18" alloys and Yokohama winter tyres onto my 7; it's got a bit milder, but they've been absolutely fine and the car drove superbly up/down the M6/56/A55 to Anglesey and back over the last few days; temps were between 6ºC and 14ºC! TBH the drive has given them a good 'scrub in' etc
It's not a case of if we'll get bad weather over here; just a matter of when. It does get cold, it does get wet and it can snow (ok, not everywhere); but the colder temps will soon be on us and the cold, wetter weather too and winter tyres perform hell of a lot better in those situations that the best summer tyres can.
I'd rather have decent winters on, for peace of mind, for when the weather changes and also knowing that my summer alloys & tyres aren't being trashed by the salt put onto the roads etc
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