105/110 on the M25 - likely result?
105/110 on the M25 - likely result?
Author
Discussion

Stevoox

Original Poster:

367 posts

160 months

Friday 23rd November 2018
quotequote all
Morning All...

As per the title, I was pulled over last night for 110 on the M25 (his words, not sure on actual speed), he has however put 105 on the ticket. From reading online it would seem likely outcome is ban up to 56 days, fine up to 150% of weekly income or point (or a combo of all 3) - anyone have an experiences to share or advice on what they would suggest is the penalty?

I was in an S350 hire car, while the M4 is at BMW for rear end repairs after someone hit me last Friday. Assuming this would go straight to court my stance would be...

- First conviction, no previous offences or road violations.
- Road conditions were good, dry.
- Visibility was good, no fog.
- Road was clear, very few cars on the M25 at 00:43 between the 1 or 2 junctions I traveled.
- Usual car I drive has HUD where I can see the speed easily. After the recent crash I am more focused on keeping my eyes on the road than looking down at the speedo. Also, the M4 you can easily feel/hear the speed, the S class is more of a 'chauffeur' type of car, very quiet and very smooth, so was less aware of the speed built up.

Cheers
Steve

Oilchange

9,707 posts

290 months

Friday 23rd November 2018
quotequote all
Assuming you’re found guilty I think a ban and a fine or points (likely 6, sp50?) and a fine, depending on mitigation (not drunk/first offence/clear conditions etc)
and how you explain your need for keeping on the road.
Eg if you’re a district nurse and require a car to do your rounds etc

Nb. All the sentencing guidelines are on the internet


HTP99

25,223 posts

170 months

Friday 23rd November 2018
quotequote all
Similar happened to a guy at work on the M25, however he had only had a his licence for less than 6m at point of offence (took almost a year to get to court though).

He ended up with a month ban, don't know the fine he got though.

agtlaw

7,404 posts

236 months

Friday 23rd November 2018
quotequote all
I anticipate a Single Justice Procedure Notice and Written Charge will be issued within 6 months of the alleged offence.

If you want to avoid a ban then deal with the case online / by post. Do not elect for a traditional court hearing.

The maximum fine is £2500 on a motorway and £1000 on any other road. If you plead guilty then you are entitled to credit. A guilty plea at the first opportunity usually means a reduction of one-third.

The court may impose 3-6 points for this offence or disqualify from driving for any length. The court has guidelines to follow. The relevant guideline identifies the starting point for this offence as a Band C fine (150% of relevant weekly income). If your relevant weekly income is £600 then the Starting Point is £900 and the fine will very likely be £600 (one-third off). There will also be prosecution costs (typically £85-105 if guilty plea on day 1). A victim surcharge is also payable (10% of the fine but £30 minimum and a £170 maximum).

The defendant’s plea in mitigation should focus on offender mitigation. What would be the effect of disqualification on the offender, his employment and his family?

For 105/70 the usual disqualification period is 7-56 days. The disqualification order could be longer if the offender’s speed is deemed to be “grossly excessive” - not at all likely here.

A single magistrate will review your case and the outcome will be one of the following:

- Licence endosed with 3-6 penalty points. Fine and costs order.
- Notice of Proposed Disqualification issued
- Summons to a traditional court hearing

If a Notice of Proposed Disqualification is issued then you should respond with a request for a traditional court hearing.

Edited by agtlaw on Friday 23 November 10:41

anonymous-user

84 months

Friday 23rd November 2018
quotequote all
If you have to go to court .... dress smart, act humble, do not include anything about the car being deceptively quick/lack of HUD (you are supposed to know the speed you are travelling at) and point out first offence, need car for work and be prepared to admit you were being momentarily stupid (even if you or I or anyone else thinks you were or weren't is irrelevant). You may get lucky as 105mph is not always a nailed on ban, it's up to the magistrate.

Good luck.

PS Ignore the holier than thous that will be along later in this thread to castigate you!


Bill

58,683 posts

285 months

Friday 23rd November 2018
quotequote all
agtlaw said:
It’s 2018.
Has someone told the magistrate? wink

anonymous-user

84 months

Friday 23rd November 2018
quotequote all
Stevoox said:
Morning All...
As per the title, I was pulled over last night for 110 on the M25 (his words, not sure on actual speed), he has however put 105 on the ticket.

- Visibility was good,
Not that good then or was it an unmarked car ?
Local plod are always posting about boneheads flying past them at over a 100 when they are in fully liveried hi vis vehicles and then wonder why they were stopped.

cb1965 said:
PS Ignore the holier than thous that will be along later in this thread to castigate you!
Well there are people out there working and doing stuff not always under signals, good job it was good visibility for the op.

grumpyscot

1,293 posts

222 months

Friday 23rd November 2018
quotequote all
At that speed, I would suggest a ban would be in order. Totally reckless.

And I say this as a close friend of someone killed by an asshole driver doing just 50mph in a 40 never mind 110 in a 70.

anonymous-user

84 months

Friday 23rd November 2018
quotequote all
And here they are rolleyes

agtlaw

7,404 posts

236 months

Friday 23rd November 2018
quotequote all
That’s a tragic story but this isn’t mumsnet.

I’m looking forward to hearing what someone’s pal was fined in 1995 - based on his income and therefore of no significance to this case.

Alucidnation

16,810 posts

200 months

Friday 23rd November 2018
quotequote all
cb1965 said:
And here they are rolleyes
Yep.



And with any luck, a ban.



FWIW

3,932 posts

127 months

Friday 23rd November 2018
quotequote all
grumpyscot said:
At that speed, I would suggest a ban would be in order. Totally reckless.

And I say this as a close friend of someone killed by an asshole driver doing just 50mph in a 40 never mind 110 in a 70.
So you you should realise that this isn’t about speed, it’s about driving standards/lack of.
Sorry for your loss.

anonymous-user

84 months

Friday 23rd November 2018
quotequote all
Alucidnation said:
cb1965 said:
And here they are rolleyes
Yep.



And with any luck, a ban.
Hopefully not, 105 on a clear empty dry motorway is quite safe compared to 30 on a wet busy urban road all other things being equal.... but one's legal and the other's not... this is the nonsense of speed limits and those that blindly believe that exceeding them is dangerous whereas not exceeding them isn't. However, that's a complex discussion and will detract from the OP's question so I will bow out and leave it there.

Stevoox

Original Poster:

367 posts

160 months

Friday 23rd November 2018
quotequote all
Thanks for the input all - guess it is now a waiting game for the documents to come through the post (and to get he M4 back wink )

With regards to saying it is reckless, unsafe etc. - perhaps. But what about the countless people that seem to sit in a middle or outside lane doing 50? Just as bad in my eyes

av185

20,464 posts

157 months

Friday 23rd November 2018
quotequote all
Stevoox said:
With regards to saying it is reckless, unsafe etc. - perhaps. But what about the countless people that seem to sit in a middle or outside lane doing 50? Just as bad in my eyes
Irrelevant.

EU_Foreigner

2,838 posts

256 months

Friday 23rd November 2018
quotequote all
At least it proves that it is nonsense that there is no traffic police about, people never see them blah blah.

Everyday I see them driving about, so obviously this budget cut is not a problem then.

Stevoox

Original Poster:

367 posts

160 months

Friday 23rd November 2018
quotequote all
agtlaw said:
I anticipate a Single Justice Procedure Notice and Written Charge will be issued within 6 months of the alleged offence.

If you want to avoid a ban then deal with the case online / by post. Do not elect for a traditional court hearing.

The maximum fine is £2500 on a motorway and £1000 on any other road. If you plead guilty then you are entitled to credit. A guilty plea at the first opportunity usually means a reduction of one-third.

The court may impose 3-6 points for this offence or disqualify from driving for any length. The court has guidelines to follow. The relevant guideline identifies the starting point for this offence as a Band C fine (150% of relevant weekly income). If your relevant weekly income is £600 and you plead guilty at the earliest opportunity then the fine will very likely be £400 (one-third off). There will also be prosecution costs (typically £85-105 if guilty plea on day 1). A victim surcharge is also payable (10% of the fine but £30 minimum and a £170 maximum).

The defendant’s plea in mitigation should focus on offender mitigation. What would be the effect of disqualification on the offender, his employment and his family?

For 105/70 the usual disqualification period is 7-56 days. The disqualification order could be longer if the offender’s speed is deemed to be “grossly excessive” - not at all likely here.

A single magistrate will review your case and the outcome will be one of the following:

- Licence endosed with 3-6 penalty points. Fine and costs order.
- Notice of Proposed Disqualification issued
- Summons to a traditional court hearing

If a Notice of Proposed Disqualification is issued then you should respond with a request for a traditional court hearing.
Thanks for that - really useful.

"If a Notice of Proposed Disqualification is issued then you should respond with a request for a traditional court hearing." - assume purely so you can have the chance to appear in front of someone and try to reduce the penalty?

Pica-Pica

16,605 posts

114 months

Friday 23rd November 2018
quotequote all
Stevoox said:
Thanks for the input all - guess it is now a waiting game for the documents to come through the post (and to get he M4 back wink )

With regards to saying it is reckless, unsafe etc. - perhaps. But what about the countless people that seem to sit in a middle or outside lane doing 50? Just as bad in my eyes
A feeble counter.
(Oh! Have you mentioned that you have an M4?)

markjmd

563 posts

98 months

Friday 23rd November 2018
quotequote all
Likely outcome? Through the door, line on the left, one cross each!


Well, it is almost the weekend wink

Welshbeef

49,633 posts

228 months

Friday 23rd November 2018
quotequote all
Good luck OP - we all do it now and again just a nightmare when you get nipped.