Foundation year in Degree course
Discussion
Not sure if this is the right forum (couldn't see one on education), but my 19 year old son has been offered a place at Essex to read History, but the offer includes a one year foundation course, so this is a four year Degree course. The reason that have given is that apparently as he originally applied to study Politics, they can offer him History instead, but only if he does this foundation year.
I have a number of concerns:
- Could this extra year kill off his interest in studying
- Extra year of fees/debt
- Is it worth studying for a four year arts Degree
Does anyone have any experience of this kind of thing, or have any thoughts/feedback?
I'm 50/50 on whether to say 'go' or 'I'm not sure this feels right'
Thanks for any help on this...
I have a number of concerns:
- Could this extra year kill off his interest in studying
- Extra year of fees/debt
- Is it worth studying for a four year arts Degree
Does anyone have any experience of this kind of thing, or have any thoughts/feedback?
I'm 50/50 on whether to say 'go' or 'I'm not sure this feels right'
Thanks for any help on this...
The reason they offer the foundation course is because they think the applicant isn't up to going straight into studying at degree level for their specific choice.
In my opinion, with the cost of obtaining a degree these days, a four year course to get a degree in history wouldn't be worth the money. Unless becoming a teacher, I can't see it helping him in the future. I know lots of people with degrees that they never use, working in unrelated jobs with a huge, pointless student debt hanging over their heads.
Time to re-group and have a serious think, I would imagine.
In my opinion, with the cost of obtaining a degree these days, a four year course to get a degree in history wouldn't be worth the money. Unless becoming a teacher, I can't see it helping him in the future. I know lots of people with degrees that they never use, working in unrelated jobs with a huge, pointless student debt hanging over their heads.
Time to re-group and have a serious think, I would imagine.
Foundation years used to be because the university believed that the student needed some of the basics taught before tackling the degree proper.
In my engineering course, it was usually because the candidate had btecs or a non recognised a level equivalent and the university believed their maths was insufficient to directly enter the first year.
I’d suggest the question to ask would be “what will you teach in the foundation year that’s required in year 1 of the degree.
A cynic might suggest that it gets a student in for an extra year of those lovely lovely fees.
In my engineering course, it was usually because the candidate had btecs or a non recognised a level equivalent and the university believed their maths was insufficient to directly enter the first year.
I’d suggest the question to ask would be “what will you teach in the foundation year that’s required in year 1 of the degree.
A cynic might suggest that it gets a student in for an extra year of those lovely lovely fees.
4 years to do a history degree.
To get a job at McDonald's.
Not being hard on your son but it's not exactly going to lead to a high powered career.
I suppose the traditional role would be to go into the civil service but they tend to like ver indulged toffs from Oxbridge rather than lads from Essex.
To get a job at McDonald's.
Not being hard on your son but it's not exactly going to lead to a high powered career.
I suppose the traditional role would be to go into the civil service but they tend to like ver indulged toffs from Oxbridge rather than lads from Essex.
I'm with the others. I would only pay for an education that got me a good return on the investment. If you say, oh but he could go into journalism, then I would say to get a degree in journalism.
I don't know why anyone is doing a degree in art these days. The local uni art building is not filled with retirees looking to do something interesting with their spare time but young adults. They probably say they don't gamble, too.
I don't know why anyone is doing a degree in art these days. The local uni art building is not filled with retirees looking to do something interesting with their spare time but young adults. They probably say they don't gamble, too.
Does the final degree contain any mention of a foundation year in it's title?
I applied for a Computer Science degree and was instead offered one with a foundation year instead for the reasons covered above.
The deal was if you got a decent grade after the first year, you could transfer "back" to the original degree and start from the beginning.
In reality they expected that either you would pass and go back into the main stream, or fail and not come back. The university also noticed that the foundation year students typically ended up as some of the highest scoring students at the end of their degrees (i.e. a significant number got firsts or 2:1s).
Ignoring whether or not history is a good degree or not, a foundation year isn't necessarily bad - as long as it doesn't come out on the degree certificate!
It cost me a little more, but I don't regret it - I doubt I would of worked as hard if I'd got on it in the first place. Seeing "my" course on clearing for someone else to apply for was quite sobering.
I applied for a Computer Science degree and was instead offered one with a foundation year instead for the reasons covered above.
The deal was if you got a decent grade after the first year, you could transfer "back" to the original degree and start from the beginning.
In reality they expected that either you would pass and go back into the main stream, or fail and not come back. The university also noticed that the foundation year students typically ended up as some of the highest scoring students at the end of their degrees (i.e. a significant number got firsts or 2:1s).
Ignoring whether or not history is a good degree or not, a foundation year isn't necessarily bad - as long as it doesn't come out on the degree certificate!
It cost me a little more, but I don't regret it - I doubt I would of worked as hard if I'd got on it in the first place. Seeing "my" course on clearing for someone else to apply for was quite sobering.
Just read through the previous posts. A response which is usually given in cases like this is, "all of that time and money to ultimately end up in a job which doesn't require a degree anyway".
Just playing devil's advocate, is it not the case that many jobs which traditionally don't require a degree, these days have a large number of applicants who do have degrees. As such, not having a degree (or equivalent) often sees those candidates filtered out at the first pass? I could understand why an employer would do this.
I genuinely don't know the answer, just a thought.
Just playing devil's advocate, is it not the case that many jobs which traditionally don't require a degree, these days have a large number of applicants who do have degrees. As such, not having a degree (or equivalent) often sees those candidates filtered out at the first pass? I could understand why an employer would do this.
I genuinely don't know the answer, just a thought.
The question you should be asking "is it worth spending four years doing a degree at Essex"
Now you already think it is worth spending three years..
Oxford/Cambridge/ICL - yes it is probably worth it, but Essex . . . . . .
Look at the percentage of graduates from that university who have real jobs at graduation rather than shop counter/fast food jobs and then ask yourself if he is ever going to pay any of the loan back.
Now you already think it is worth spending three years..
Oxford/Cambridge/ICL - yes it is probably worth it, but Essex . . . . . .
Look at the percentage of graduates from that university who have real jobs at graduation rather than shop counter/fast food jobs and then ask yourself if he is ever going to pay any of the loan back.
A Foundation Year is intended for students who do not have correct or appropriate grades or qualifications to enter straight into the Honours study.
Someone who left school at 16 without A Levels can still enter a degree with the appropriate BA or BSc Foundation Year.
Given that recent laws have extended compulsory education up to age 18 many of these Foundation Years are now redundant and really only exist for students with low A Level grades.
If either scenario sound like you son, and this is definitely the course he wants, he either goes for the Foundation Year, or attends a different uni which may have lower entry requirements.
If it were me or my child, I would encourage him to attend a different uni which will accept him straight into honors.
Someone who left school at 16 without A Levels can still enter a degree with the appropriate BA or BSc Foundation Year.
Given that recent laws have extended compulsory education up to age 18 many of these Foundation Years are now redundant and really only exist for students with low A Level grades.
If either scenario sound like you son, and this is definitely the course he wants, he either goes for the Foundation Year, or attends a different uni which may have lower entry requirements.
If it were me or my child, I would encourage him to attend a different uni which will accept him straight into honors.
What's he planning to do with the history degree? if he has vocational aims directly tied to it then an extra year of uni will be worth it in the long run.
I was at uni for 4 years, I studied architectural technology in my first year, but switched at the end of the year as it was boring me to death.
Switched to BSc Product design, and did the full 3 year course.
Graduated and i've worked as a designer/design engineer right out of the gate and for 11 years since, so the extra year at uni did me no real harm financially or otherwise...if anything it helped scratching that first year and starting over, at 18 I really was too young to really know what I wanted...that started to firm up and I went into the first year of the new course a lot happier with my direction.
That said, I wouldn't have done any old degree for the sake of it, even back then I knew I wanted to do something with a vocational focus.
I was at uni for 4 years, I studied architectural technology in my first year, but switched at the end of the year as it was boring me to death.
Switched to BSc Product design, and did the full 3 year course.
Graduated and i've worked as a designer/design engineer right out of the gate and for 11 years since, so the extra year at uni did me no real harm financially or otherwise...if anything it helped scratching that first year and starting over, at 18 I really was too young to really know what I wanted...that started to firm up and I went into the first year of the new course a lot happier with my direction.
That said, I wouldn't have done any old degree for the sake of it, even back then I knew I wanted to do something with a vocational focus.
Foundation years were actually originally none of the above. They were set up at some universities to give students a broader education. You could opt in to do one of you didn't know what you really wanted to study. Sign up for X but spend a year taking a look at other stuff and learning some pretty broad other subjects along the way. Then at the end of the foundation year you could swap onto a different degree subject than when you started - in some cases, like maths, you would still have needed a good maths A level.
Foundation years are not all like others have described.
I should know, I did one. I was offered a place to study X for three years with a foundation year - because that was just how they worked out. I didn't do any of X in that year and decided to do a degree in something else entirely. It wasn't about getting better at something before being good enough to do a degree.
My advice is, check what the foundation year is all about. If it's a year of history as prep them sack it off. If it's a year of all sorts with an option to change then....... it's just about the extra cost I suppose. That wasn't an issue when I did mine
Foundation years are not all like others have described.
I should know, I did one. I was offered a place to study X for three years with a foundation year - because that was just how they worked out. I didn't do any of X in that year and decided to do a degree in something else entirely. It wasn't about getting better at something before being good enough to do a degree.
My advice is, check what the foundation year is all about. If it's a year of history as prep them sack it off. If it's a year of all sorts with an option to change then....... it's just about the extra cost I suppose. That wasn't an issue when I did mine
Also to echo, there doesn’t seem to be much return on the extra investment, unless it is something he’s truly passionate about (which, with it not being his first choice, it seems he isn’t).
My cynicism radar has spotted something. Given that university applicants are dropping, and thus cash-flow is reducing, what possible reason should a HISTORY degree need a foundation course? If I needed to brush up on chemistry before a medical degree, or maths prior to engineering, then fine - my capabilities would be lacking. However, I’m trying to think why, having been out of formal education for 18 years (having always been more inclined to the sciences than the arts), could I not hop on to a history programme? It all smells a bit, to be honest. University fees are now life-changing sums of money for most people, so I think it needs a lot of consideration.
Nowadays I find it hard to justify a three year degree at all, barring a few ‘core’ degrees. Not that this is relevant to your son.
Good luck!
My cynicism radar has spotted something. Given that university applicants are dropping, and thus cash-flow is reducing, what possible reason should a HISTORY degree need a foundation course? If I needed to brush up on chemistry before a medical degree, or maths prior to engineering, then fine - my capabilities would be lacking. However, I’m trying to think why, having been out of formal education for 18 years (having always been more inclined to the sciences than the arts), could I not hop on to a history programme? It all smells a bit, to be honest. University fees are now life-changing sums of money for most people, so I think it needs a lot of consideration.
Nowadays I find it hard to justify a three year degree at all, barring a few ‘core’ degrees. Not that this is relevant to your son.
Good luck!
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