Tempted by Shiny New Things!

[motorhole]

So I’ve had my current daily driver, a 2005 Fabia vRS, for over 12 years now. In over 160,000 miles, it’s not bored me to death. It’s never let me down. It’s never thrown a big bill. It’s still as economical as ever and it still provides more than adequate performance for day to day driving.

However, it’s not exactly fit for my needs any more, and it hasn’t been for some time. Long motorway hauls aren’t particularly comfortable and the lack of load space is a problem. Being a grown up means moving stuff around, having a wife means luggage and having a track car that’s not kept at home means lugging tools and car parts around on a fairly regular basis. The back seat is increasingly becoming a boot extension, which is not ideal. I’ve just had it so long as I’ve never been able to justify the outlay for something to replace it, because I’m both a cheap barsteward and I hate waste. Thankfully, I’m married to somebody of a similar mindset so I don’t get nagged for shiny new things every three years…

However, the wife’s car is nearly 15 years old and may be coming close to the end of its useful life. When it goes, that means new car for me and she gets my Fabia; a resolution that she’s actually pretty happy with. I do most of the long distance work and she does love the yellow vRS.

So for me – I’m looking at an estate car. It has to be economical, comfortable, pokey, reliable and also long lived because I’d be looking at keeping it for another 10 years at least. It also has to be able to keep me fairly entertained. Outright performance isn’t it; my track car has plenty of that. But it has to be a pleasant thing to be behind the wheel of and be engaging enough to be entertaining when the right road and the right circumstances present themselves.

So that brings me to a shortlist of 3: F30 BMW 320D Touring, Audi A4 Avant Tdi (184 bhp version) and Skoda Octavia vRS TDi estate. Why diesel? My research suggests the current crop of direct injection petrols seem fairly untested above 130,000 miles or so and I have doubts about long-term longevity. Plus diesel values seem to have taken a bit of a hit with the recent bad press. My budget allows for any of these cars, 3-4 years old with 25,000-40,000 on the clock.

So, I’m looking for people who have owned one or more of these cars for feedback. I’m happy top be proven wrong about the direct injection engines. And I’m open to alternatives that fit my criteria.

Go

[ZX10R NIN]

You say your a bit frugal with the cash & there's an estate that is a decent steer but (the diesel drivetrain is already proven for 200k+ usage) really good on fuel then one of these may be the answer:

Mondeo Vignale the Ford is the best FWD steer in class & imo is a better bet than the Skoda & Audi

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...

ST Line X

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...


508 GT these are well equipped with good handling & are a very good long term option.

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...

RXH

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...

Or the Plug in Hybrid V40 D5 Estate

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...

If it's a premium brand car you're looking for then the 2.1d in the Mercedes is well proven to able to do mega miles so I'd be looking for a well spec'd 220/250:

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...

220

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...

My other pick would be the Jaguar XF Sportbrake but I'd be looking for the 3.0d:

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...

[Mr Tidy]

I can understand your dislike of DI petrol engines - they seem to have some issues!

I've had an 06 plate E91 BMW 325i for just over a year which has the N52 engine that isn't DI, and it's still going fine at 139K miles!

But I will be selling it as I've bought an E90 330i.

[motorhole]

Thanks for the alternative suggestions ZX10R

Unfortunately, almost all of those are more than I want to spend. However I like the look of the Mondeo and here's one more fitting budget wise:

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...

Peugeots - most of the French cars I've driven or those that belong to friends have felt rough and tired once they get to 5 years old/60,000 miles plus and the residuals are terrible, which makes the option of swapping again after 5 or 6 years more unattractive if I do grow tired of the car.

I also like the idea of the Volvo plug in hybrid, but the V40 is a bit small. I had considered the V60 D4 but reviews suggested both the driving experience and the load space weren't the best. Still fancy looking at a V60 though...

Jag and Merc: very difficult to find one with my age/mileage wants at < £16k. Also, I would definitely want to stick with a manual for driver engagement purposes which I think rules out the Jag. Plus the wife doesn't like driving autos either

[DaveTheRave87]

A Golf GTD estate would be on my shopping list if I was in your position.

[moffspeed]

Funnily enough just had the same issue post Fabia VRs ownership. The Fabia was a stop-gap after selling an A4 and coincided with a move to spending several months a year abroad.

Soon became apparent that I needed something roomier back here in the UK - and like you lugging around classic car spares is a priority. I had a similar short list to yourself but then I overcame my taxi cab perspective on M-Bs and took a look.

I ended up with a W204 (post facelift) C Class Merc. It's a C250 in AMG Sport spec. (but nothing to do with a proper AMG!) so you get economy, reliability, a great deal of kit, a 7 speed paddle shift auto which is allegedly unburstable (unlike the Audi job) and a whisker over 200 BHP. OK the handling isn't quite on par with a Bimmer 3 series but not too far off.

The saloon has enough room for me but secondhand estates are also plentiful - with the advent of ULEZ there are some great deals on London-based cars to be had out there, £10K should sort it.....

[Toaster Pilot]

I had a similar requirement to you with a 20k/year commute in the mix and I’ve just bought a F31 320d Touring - albeit a nearly new (ex rental) one.

£20k on an 18 reg with 11k miles from a main dealer - you won’t need to go a whole lot older to bring it into budget.

[ninjag]

motorhole said:

Jag and Merc: very difficult to find one with my age/mileage wants at < £16k. Also, I would definitely want to stick with a manual for driver engagement purposes which I think rules out the Jag. Plus the wife doesn't like driving autos either

I used to be a manual only but the 8 speed ZF in the Jag (and also BMW) is so good and coupled with the paddles I'll never go back to manual. Also minimises potential clutch/dmf problems from previous owner abuse. I found that BMW had tuned their transmission a little better with the 330d in comfort mode but in sports mode I found them both roughly the same. The self leveling rear air suspension of the XF made a recent fully loaded trip feel like the car was near empty on the corners and I also find the interior far more premium feeling in the Jag and much quieter. iDrive on the BMW is a little easier to use whilst on the road though. Both have 50:50 weight distribution.

But if you really want manual then you may want to rule out BMW as well.

[Toaster Pilot]

I didn’t even consider the manual option when buying an F31.

Far more manual 318d around than 320 but they tend to be pretty sparse spec wise with cloth seats etc. Think motorpoint have some for about £17.5k though - less than a year old etc

[ZX10R NIN]

motorhole said:

Thanks for the alternative suggestions ZX10R

Unfortunately, almost all of those are more than I want to spend. However I like the look of the Mondeo and here's one more fitting budget wise:

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...

Peugeots - most of the French cars I've driven or those that belong to friends have felt rough and tired once they get to 5 years old/60,000 miles plus and the residuals are terrible, which makes the option of swapping again after 5 or 6 years more unattractive if I do grow tired of the car.

I also like the idea of the Volvo plug in hybrid, but the V40 is a bit small. I had considered the V60 D4 but reviews suggested both the driving experience and the load space weren't the best. Still fancy looking at a V60 though...

Jag and Merc: very difficult to find one with my age/mileage wants at < £16k. Also, I would definitely want to stick with a manual for driver engagement purposes which I think rules out the Jag. Plus the wife doesn't like driving autos either

No problem I didn't see a budget with regards to the residuals on French cars I have to say there's not as big a difference, also the diesel hybrids are firming up as the talk of ULEZ's being implemented in major cities these cars will be sought after.

The Mondeo you linked to is good but the one below is a better option & they're pretty much the same money:

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...

[Jamescrs]

motorhole said:

Thanks for the alternative suggestions ZX10R

Unfortunately, almost all of those are more than I want to spend. However I like the look of the Mondeo and here's one more fitting budget wise:

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...

Peugeots - most of the French cars I've driven or those that belong to friends have felt rough and tired once they get to 5 years old/60,000 miles plus and the residuals are terrible, which makes the option of swapping again after 5 or 6 years more unattractive if I do grow tired of the car.

I also like the idea of the Volvo plug in hybrid, but the V40 is a bit small. I had considered the V60 D4 but reviews suggested both the driving experience and the load space weren't the best. Still fancy looking at a V60 though...

Jag and Merc: very difficult to find one with my age/mileage wants at < £16k. Also, I would definitely want to stick with a manual for driver engagement purposes which I think rules out the Jag. Plus the wife doesn't like driving autos either

I have a Volvo V60, albeit mines a petrol T4 so I can't comment on Diesel versions. The load space on the V60 I find very good, it has a decent size boot and I've never struggled especially with the back seats flat fitting large objects in, I think it gets criticised because people compare it to the V70's of old which are really a level bigger than the V60 was ever meant to be but I would say its very similar space wise to the Audi A4 I had previously.

Driving experience is generally comfortable I would describe it as, it's not a particularly sporty estate, it's not as sporty as the Audi A4 S line I had previously or the BMW 320i I previously had but its easily as comfortable if not more comfortable than both.

[motorhole]

Thanks again for suggestions all.

Regarding the 8-speed ZF auto; I had a new 520D hire car which a spent quite a while behind the wheel of a few months ago. Whilst it was the best auto I've driven, it still bored me to death, even in sport mode using the paddles. I was glad to get back in the Fabia! That's my only reservation for the F30 3-series to be honest - that it will bore me. The 520 was lovely. Very capable. Very comfortable. Felt really solid and beautifully built. But it didn't entertain me at all. I'd like to think the same engine in a smaller, lighter car with a manual box would be more engaging. Otherwise, the F30 is the favourite of my list atm; RWD, ticks the performance and economy boxes, good to look at, good to sit in and known specialists nearby for servicing and repairs.

I guess I need to go somewhere where they have all of these things in stock (Car hell/supermarket) and have a look around a few just to see if I can't whittle down the shortlist

Cheers!

[Toaster Pilot]

Motorpoint would be a good shout for you to try various stuff out I reckon - might not be in your budget due to them mostly having ex rental but they’ll have pretty much every car in your consideration

[Mr Tidy]

motorhole said:

Thanks again for suggestions all.

Regarding the 8-speed ZF auto; I had a new 520D hire car which a spent quite a while behind the wheel of a few months ago. Whilst it was the best auto I've driven, it still bored me to death, even in sport mode using the paddles. I was glad to get back in the Fabia! That's my only reservation for the F30 3-series to be honest - that it will bore me. The 520 was lovely. Very capable. Very comfortable. Felt really solid and beautifully built. But it didn't entertain me at all. I'd like to think the same engine in a smaller, lighter car with a manual box would be more engaging. Otherwise, the F30 is the favourite of my list atm; RWD, ticks the performance and economy boxes, good to look at, good to sit in and known specialists nearby for servicing and repairs.

I guess I need to go somewhere where they have all of these things in stock (Car hell/supermarket) and have a look around a few just to see if I can't whittle down the shortlist

Cheers!

I think you may be missing the point with 4-pot diesels and flappy-paddles!

I bought a manual E90 330i last month and it's great!

[motorhole]

Mr Tidy said:

I think you may be missing the point with 4-pot diesels and flappy-paddles!

I bought a manual E90 330i last month and it's great!

Not so much that - I just don't require/can't justify that performance and the associated running costs for the 0.1% of the time I would get to exploit it in a daily. Especially when I have a stripped and caged E30 in the lockup with a normally aspirated 250 bhp/tonne

[Mr Tidy]

motorhole said:

Mr Tidy said:

I think you may be missing the point with 4-pot diesels and flappy-paddles!

I bought a manual E90 330i last month and it's great!

Not so much that - I just don't require/can't justify that performance and the associated running costs for the 0.1% of the time I would get to exploit it in a daily. Especially when I have a stripped and caged E30 in the lockup with a normally aspirated 250 bhp/tonne

Right - that's fair enough, but how often do you drive your stripped and caged E30?

I have a Z4 Coupe for fun trips out, but can't endure driving a daily that feels sluggish while wishing I was in the Z4C - hence my 330i!

[motorhole]

Mr Tidy said:

Right - that's fair enough, but how often do you drive your stripped and caged E30?

I have a Z4 Coupe for fun trips out, but can't endure driving a daily that feels sluggish while wishing I was in the Z4C - hence my 330i!

Admittedly not very often and when I do, it’s almost entirely for trackday use.

• OFF-TOPIC WARNING*

On the road, I’m quite happy to pootle about like an old duffer, only having a bit of fun when the right road and conditions present themselves; which for me is a very rare thing. Generally, I find driving high performance cars on the road quite frustrating because you’re only ever a couple of minutes from the next car/train of cars holding you up. It would be silly to commit to unsighted corners. And hold 3rd for a few seconds and suddenly you’re in license losing territory. Driving like that just isn’t enjoyable.

On track, you always want more from the car; power, grip, braking. On the road, I find the opposite and it’s far more enjoyable for me to drive a slow car at nine tenths than a fast car at five tenths. If I was looking for a fast road car, I’d be in the market for an MX5, GT-86 or even a Suzuki Swift Sport or Renault Twingo. Hence my requirement of something practical, reliable and economical that still has some driver appeal for the rare opportunity I’ll get to exploit its abilities.

The Fabia has been great for this. It doesn’t exactly have exciting handling, but it goes where you point it so long as you’re not being a complete tit and provides plenty of feedback. The driving position is good, the gear shift is excellent, the controls are all nicely weighted. There’s enough poke to give you a satisfying shove, it’s pretty easy to make quick progress when the opportunity arises and overtaking is nice and easy. Sure, it feels flat as a dry fart straight after jumping into it from the E30, but you soon acclimatise. Then for 99.9% of my driving, it gives me 480+ miles to a 10-gallon tank and has done for nearly 13 years and 166,000 miles, never missing a beat in the process. It’s also done 2 trackdays.

• BACK ON TOPIC*

So I think the cars I’m shortlisting are cars that I hope would do everything the Fabia has done for me, whilst providing vastly improved load space, more mod cons (digital radio, Bluetooth etc) and with improved comfort and refinement.

[ZX10R NIN]

I have to say the Mondeo I linked to will do everything you're looking for it to do & it'll be a nice way to while away the miles.