Certified Proof of ID
Discussion
Our bank has asked for a certified copy of our daughter's passport, so I got certified copies done at the Post Office, (annoyingly £10+, but the quickest way to get it sorted, or so I thought).
The bank's refusing to accept them, because while they certify that the document is a true copy of the original, they don't certify "the photograph therein is a true likeness of that person described therein".
Surely that means only someone who knows her personally can certify it?
The passport photo must have been countersigned, so I'm at a loss as to what benefit this certification of a "true likeness" gives.
The bank's refusing to accept them, because while they certify that the document is a true copy of the original, they don't certify "the photograph therein is a true likeness of that person described therein".
Surely that means only someone who knows her personally can certify it?
The passport photo must have been countersigned, so I'm at a loss as to what benefit this certification of a "true likeness" gives.
Squiddly Diddly said:
Can't your daughter go into one of the banks branches for them do it?
Not easily - But I can't see how that would solve the problem of the certifier confirming that the photo is "a true likeness of the person described therein".A passport proves that the person is who they claim to be. The person by themselves proves nothing about the passport, except that someone exists who looks a bit like the photo in the passport.
silentbrown said:
Not easily - But I can't see how that would solve the problem of the certifier confirming that the photo is "a true likeness of the person described therein".
A passport proves that the person is who they claim to be. The person by themselves proves nothing about the passport, except that someone exists who looks a bit like the photo in the passport.
The 'looks a bit like the photo' is the important bit. A passport proves that the person is who they claim to be. The person by themselves proves nothing about the passport, except that someone exists who looks a bit like the photo in the passport.
It's very common certification term for photo ID. The person certifying the passport needs to see the passport holder at the same time.
Squiddly Diddly said:
The 'looks a bit like the photo' is the important bit.
It's very common certification term for photo ID. The person certifying the passport needs to see the passport holder at the same time.
Cheers. It does appear more common than I'd first thought. It's very common certification term for photo ID. The person certifying the passport needs to see the passport holder at the same time.
Now my initial rant has cooled I can see it gives reasonable protection against the passport having been stolen - but it still feels strange that a certified photocopy has more "power" than the original document.
It seems you're more at risk of identity theft if a certified copy of your passport is stolen than if the original goes AWOL!
silentbrown said:
Squiddly Diddly said:
The 'looks a bit like the photo' is the important bit.
It's very common certification term for photo ID. The person certifying the passport needs to see the passport holder at the same time.
Cheers. It does appear more common than I'd first thought. It's very common certification term for photo ID. The person certifying the passport needs to see the passport holder at the same time.
Now my initial rant has cooled I can see it gives reasonable protection against the passport having been stolen - but it still feels strange that a certified photocopy has more "power" than the original document.
It seems you're more at risk of identity theft if a certified copy of your passport is stolen than if the original goes AWOL!
If you live near to me then I'll certify it for you.
Edited to add that I've just seen you are nowhere near me!
Could you not go back to the original PO with your daughter and ask them to add the missing wording?
It is crazy, I have to admit.
Edited to add that I've just seen you are nowhere near me!
Could you not go back to the original PO with your daughter and ask them to add the missing wording?
It is crazy, I have to admit.
Edited by JulianPH on Saturday 27th April 11:03
Sarnie said:
The post office have certified to say they've seen the original document.
The bank wants the document to be certified by someone who has seen both the original document and your daughter and confirm the person they've seen is the person on the passport............
^^^ This. I’ve just paid an accountant to certify my ID for a remortgage (one of Sarnies nonetheless!!!). The bank wants the document to be certified by someone who has seen both the original document and your daughter and confirm the person they've seen is the person on the passport............
Doesn’t have to be your own accountant, just phone one up who lives locally. I believe GP’s also offer (and charge for) this service.
It’s not uncommon. They need a professional to say that the passport pic does actually look like the individual.
Sarnie said:
No.......they would be certifying to say that the individual in front of them is the person in the ID............it's got nothing to do with knowing you personally.
It's more than that. They have to certify that J Blogg's passport photo is a "true likeness" of J Bloggs. Unless Mr Bloggs has some other way of proving his identity, they're forced to assume the his passport photo is accurate, in order that they can certify it as being accurate. You see the problem?silentbrown said:
It's more than that. They have to certify that J Blogg's passport photo is a "true likeness" of J Bloggs. Unless Mr Bloggs has some other way of proving his identity, they're forced to assume the his passport photo is accurate, in order that they can certify it as being accurate. You see the problem?
No *face palm*Sarnie said:
No *face palm*
OK, I know I'm probably flogging a dead horse on this one 
Let's say I bring a picture of an apple with the word "Banana" written under it. Would you certify that the picture is a "true likeness of a banana"?
No, because you know what a banana looks like. If I also bring a real apple as well, it doesn't change anything.
Now replace the two fruits with obscure fruits you've never seen or heard of. Does that change anything? How would you certify the picture as a "true likeness" of the fruit it claims to be?
silentbrown said:
OK, I know I'm probably flogging a dead horse on this one
Let's say I bring a picture of an apple with the word "Banana" written under it. Would you certify that the picture is a "true likeness of a banana"?
No, because you know what a banana looks like. If I also bring a real apple as well, it doesn't change anything.
Now replace the two fruits with obscure fruits you've never seen or heard of. Does that change anything? How would you certify the picture as a "true likeness" of the fruit it claims to be?
The fruit has to take in a picture of itself. Then the person certifying can say that the fruit in the picture looks like the fruit holding the picture. Let's say I bring a picture of an apple with the word "Banana" written under it. Would you certify that the picture is a "true likeness of a banana"?
No, because you know what a banana looks like. If I also bring a real apple as well, it doesn't change anything.
Now replace the two fruits with obscure fruits you've never seen or heard of. Does that change anything? How would you certify the picture as a "true likeness" of the fruit it claims to be?
silentbrown said:
OK, I know I'm probably flogging a dead horse on this one
Let's say I bring a picture of an apple with the word "Banana" written under it. Would you certify that the picture is a "true likeness of a banana"?
No, because you know what a banana looks like. If I also bring a real apple as well, it doesn't change anything.
Now replace the two fruits with obscure fruits you've never seen or heard of. Does that change anything? How would you certify the picture as a "true likeness" of the fruit it claims to be?
You are simply not understanding.Let's say I bring a picture of an apple with the word "Banana" written under it. Would you certify that the picture is a "true likeness of a banana"?
No, because you know what a banana looks like. If I also bring a real apple as well, it doesn't change anything.
Now replace the two fruits with obscure fruits you've never seen or heard of. Does that change anything? How would you certify the picture as a "true likeness" of the fruit it claims to be?
A man walks into the post office. He hands his passport over. The nice woman behind the counter takes his passport, looks at his picture, looks at his passport photo...sees that he is the person in the photo and certifies the document to say that shes seen the original document and it represents a true likeness of the person in front of her...........no one is asking her to certify that the document is a true likeness of someone she's not met.........
Sarnie said:
You are simply not understanding.
A man walks into the post office. He hands his passport over. The nice woman behind the counter takes his passport, looks at his picture, looks at his passport photo...sees that he is the person in the photo and certifies the document to say that shes seen the original document and it represents a true likeness of the person in front of her...........no one is asking her to certify that the document is a true likeness of someone she's not met.........
She's has to certify "the photograph therein is a true likeness of that person described therein", which is rather more than "a likeness of the person in front of her." A man walks into the post office. He hands his passport over. The nice woman behind the counter takes his passport, looks at his picture, looks at his passport photo...sees that he is the person in the photo and certifies the document to say that shes seen the original document and it represents a true likeness of the person in front of her...........no one is asking her to certify that the document is a true likeness of someone she's not met.........
This is the specific wording required by the bank in this case.
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