650i v 640D

[Hot Knife]

There is a lot of comparison between the 640i and 640D but very little between the 650i and the 640D.

I've read specs etc and the 650 obviously has a lot more power but is the 640D still nice and a bit of fun to drive?

650 Gran Coupe's are quite rare to find but there's a tonne of 640D's.

Any one can chime on experiences between the two?

Thanks,

[Tea Pot One]

I've thought about a 650i convertible but BMW Magazine rated the reliability fo the 640i more.

I would have thought though both 640d and 650i are heavy the 650i would be much more of an occasion ... thus was looking at a convertible one.

I'm interested to read anyone experiences too.

[Hot Knife]

The problem with the 640i is the performance is relatively down compared with the 650i but the MPG is still up. What you do gain is a better sound over the 640D. From what I read of the 650 reliability it seems OK, albeit maybe a little less than the 640. You gain a lot more power and a very nice sounding V8 too.

[survivalist]

No first hand experience of these, but did a load of research when I was looking at getting a 5-Series.

The V8 petrol is a N63 and seems to it’s fair share of issues, excessive oil consumption, valve issues and misfire/injector issues. Location of the twin turbos also means lots of labour for repairs. If you’re getting one with a warranty this might be less of an issue.

The 640i is the N55 which is a very reliable lump and been in lots of 135, 335 and 535 going back as far as 2009. Makes a nice noise and has plenty of torque. Can also be remapped pretty easily.

Think the 640d is a triple charged version of the 335d engine. Don’t know much about that as I’ve had 2 diesel BMWs and wouldn’t consider another. Might make sense if you’re doing mega mileage though.

[jv021]

I was tempted by a 650i and ended up with a 640i instead...

With the 650i, you would always think why not the M6 instead.

640i was chosen as the n55 has less issues than the 650i and felt nicer than a 640d i tried.

[Hot Knife]

jv021 said:

I was tempted by a 650i and ended up with a 640i instead...

With the 650i, you would always think why not the M6 instead.

640i was chosen as the n55 has less issues than the 650i and felt nicer than a 640d i tried.

I wonder the same too. But then I wonder if I would always wonder why not the 650 instead?

The 650 seems to like a good balance of everything to me. I feel like the 640i you compromise on power and don't benefit that much from MPG.

[cerb4.5lee]

Hot Knife said:

jv021 said:

I was tempted by a 650i and ended up with a 640i instead...

With the 650i, you would always think why not the M6 instead.

640i was chosen as the n55 has less issues than the 650i and felt nicer than a 640d i tried.

I wonder the same too. But then I wonder if I would always wonder why not the 650 instead?

The 650 seems to like a good balance of everything to me. I feel like the 640i you compromise on power and don't benefit that much from MPG.

I think that the 650i is a good balance too, and as lovely as the M6 is you will pay much more in terms of servicing/insurance etc over the 650i.

[KPB1973]

The 640d will give you the opportunity for better MPG on a long run, but they are heavy beasts which blunts performance and urban economy to an extent. I found my Gran Coupe very lethargic at motorway speeds in Comfort mode unless I used the kick down - but even then it didn't stir my soul whatsoever.

I've never driven a 650i but given its a 4.4 twin turbo like the M5 (which I have driven) i'd expect it to have a lot of torque but not a massive amount of noise or character.

So I suppose it depends on what you're looking for from your 6-series? fun? character? noise?

[DanL]

Hot Knife said:

jv021 said:

I was tempted by a 650i and ended up with a 640i instead...

With the 650i, you would always think why not the M6 instead.

640i was chosen as the n55 has less issues than the 650i and felt nicer than a 640d i tried.

I wonder the same too. But then I wonder if I would always wonder why not the 650 instead?

The 650 seems to like a good balance of everything to me. I feel like the 640i you compromise on power and don't benefit that much from MPG.

I have a 650 ('vert, not GC) because it's not an M6... Servicing, etc. on the M6 is significantly more, and while it is a better / faster car, the 650 is more than enough for the road.

Mine does drink oil, mind you - probably a litre every 2,000 miles or so. I suspect lots of short journeys don't help here... No biggie, in that the on board computer pops up a message to tell you when it needs to be topped up by a litre - I just carry a litre of top up oil in the boot as a result, and top up before I start my next journey. There's a cubbyhole in the boot under the boot floor you access by lifting the carpet that holds a litre quite nicely.

I've had mine for a couple of years - full running costs in my profile, should you be interested.

[doc261]

I had a 640d coupe and found it excellent as a long range tourer. Drove to southern France, effortless, relaxing and easy to exceed the speed limit. Great MPG, great interior? I didn’t find the acceleration poor. It’s main cons were it’s size and because it’s heavy it’s not much fun on smaller particularly winding roads. As for comparison with petrol engines can’t really help but the D does have very good low down torque.

[Hot Knife]

cerb4.5lee said:

I think that the 650i is a good balance too, and as lovely as the M6 is you will pay much more in terms of servicing/insurance etc over the 650i.

I agree. I'm still very tempted by the M6 though. I think I can stretch to it but it seems the 650 might answer most things.

The main thing is a 650i Gran Coupe is surprisingly rare. There is a 640i and 640D in every spec and colour you could want to choose from but the 650i is rare as hens teeth and the couple that are there are so plain jane. In the UK at least.

[Hot Knife]

KPB1973 said:

The 640d will give you the opportunity for better MPG on a long run, but they are heavy beasts which blunts performance and urban economy to an extent. I found my Gran Coupe very lethargic at motorway speeds in Comfort mode unless I used the kick down - but even then it didn't stir my soul whatsoever.

I've never driven a 650i but given its a 4.4 twin turbo like the M5 (which I have driven) i'd expect it to have a lot of torque but not a massive amount of noise or character.

So I suppose it depends on what you're looking for from your 6-series? fun? character? noise?

I agree in all ways which is why I'm still considering the M6 which can really drop the hammer.

For me I want performance, noise, fun and character. All the expensive things damn it!

[Hot Knife]

DanL said:

have a 650 ('vert, not GC) because it's not an M6... Servicing, etc. on the M6 is significantly more, and while it is a better / faster car, the 650 is more than enough for the road.

Mine does drink oil, mind you - probably a litre every 2,000 miles or so. I suspect lots of short journeys don't help here... No biggie, in that the on board computer pops up a message to tell you when it needs to be topped up by a litre - I just carry a litre of top up oil in the boot as a result, and top up before I start my next journey. There's a cubbyhole in the boot under the boot floor you access by lifting the carpet that holds a litre quite nicely.

I've had mine for a couple of years - full running costs in my profile, should you be interested.

Thanks, that's interesting and a good tip re the oil. If I went M6 I would only do so with a warranty which really takes the anxiety out of owning them. But I agree that the 650 is probably well and true fast enough for what I need, especially on UK roads if you want to keep you license and stay out of jail.

Will check out your running costs, thanks very much.

[KPB1973]

Hot Knife said:

I agree in all ways which is why I'm still considering the M6 which can really drop the hammer.

For me I want performance, noise, fun and character. All the expensive things damn it!

An M5 or M6 was on my radar before I chose my 640d (head over heart won through).

I don't mean to teach you how to suck eggs, but i'd be careful where you bought one from. I found very few non-franchised dealers offered a warranty that was comprehensive enough to give peace of mind, especially on that engine where total failure isn't unheard of.

I found the typical claims limit to be anything between £500 and £2500 across a lot of aftermarket policies. I rejected a few stunning cars for this very reason.

Also - if you're looking for "noise, fun and character" then I would give one a go before setting your heart on one. I found the equivalent M5 a disappointment in those regards and ended up going old skool and N/A.

[DanL]

Hot Knife said:

Thanks, that's interesting and a good tip re the oil. If I went M6 I would only do so with a warranty which really takes the anxiety out of owning them. But I agree that the 650 is probably well and true fast enough for what I need, especially on UK roads if you want to keep you license and stay out of jail.

Will check out your running costs, thanks very much.

Yes, if you go M6 then I’d certainly be looking for an AUC from BMW - it will take the worry out of it (the warranty is excellent), and you may find once you factor the cost of a worthwhile warranty into the budget that the premium for a car from BMW isn’t as much as you’d think...

I’d buy from BMW regardless, to be honest - their AUC warranty is pretty much the same as the new car warranty, in that is covers everything except trim and wear and tear. In the past I’ve even had a replacement battery from the under it, although this time around I had to pay as it was just old, rather than having failed... I got them to extend it to two years from purchase for £350, which is a bargain - doing it myself later would have been around £1,000 as there’s no excess to pay. When I renewed this year I decided I only needed cover for large items, hence taking a £250 excess and dropping the cost by about £400.

What I would say is that people generally seem to change cars when there are a few niggles. While these should be fixed as part of prep for sale, they aren’t always - as you can see in my history, my last 2 AUC cars have needed things sorting within the first month of purchase. Happily, the warranty and dealer took care of it for me (including new discs on the current car under goodwill). Pretty sure I’d have had a harder time if I’d purchased outside of the dealer network...

[Hot Knife]

KPB1973 said:

An M5 or M6 was on my radar before I chose my 640d (head over heart won through).

I don't mean to teach you how to suck eggs, but i'd be careful where you bought one from. I found very few non-franchised dealers offered a warranty that was comprehensive enough to give peace of mind, especially on that engine where total failure isn't unheard of.

I found the typical claims limit to be anything between £500 and £2500 across a lot of aftermarket policies. I rejected a few stunning cars for this very reason.

Also - if you're looking for "noise, fun and character" then I would give one a go before setting your heart on one. I found the equivalent M5 a disappointment in those regards and ended up going old skool and N/A.

Yeah those 3rd party warranties are worth nothing. I would only get one on the BMW Used warranty which is a legitimate bumper to bumper warranty.

When I see fun noise and character I mean those things plus modern design in a daily driver. So the M6 is a good balance of that over the 640D. I like the Maserati Granturismo too, sound is hard to beat, but I just need that occasional 5th seat for short journeys.

What you say you went old school what did you go with?

Edited by Hot Knife on Tuesday 21st May 16:28

[Hot Knife]

DanL said:

es, if you go M6 then I’d certainly be looking for an AUC from BMW - it will take the worry out of it (the warranty is excellent), and you may find once you factor the cost of a worthwhile warranty into the budget that the premium for a car from BMW isn’t as much as you’d think...

I’d buy from BMW regardless, to be honest - their AUC warranty is pretty much the same as the new car warranty, in that is covers everything except trim and wear and tear. In the past I’ve even had a replacement battery from the under it, although this time around I had to pay as it was just old, rather than having failed... I got them to extend it to two years from purchase for £350, which is a bargain - doing it myself later would have been around £1,000 as there’s no excess to pay. When I renewed this year I decided I only needed cover for large items, hence taking a £250 excess and dropping the cost by about £400.

What I would say is that people generally seem to change cars when there are a few niggles. While these should be fixed as part of prep for sale, they aren’t always - as you can see in my history, my last 2 AUC cars have needed things sorting within the first month of purchase. Happily, the warranty and dealer took care of it for me (including new discs on the current car under goodwill). Pretty sure I’d have had a harder time if I’d purchased outside of the dealer network...

Thanks that is a great account of the warranty and everything I read about it is nothing short of amazing. I agree with everything you say and it really changed the way I looked at these cars.

Amazing you got the extension £350!!! that is really incredible.

[Barga]

640d or 650i is like asking if you want tossed off by a sandpaper glove or a velvet one!

[Hot Knife]

Love a bit sandpaper, don't knock it till you try it. It just depends on who is wearing the glove. LOL

I agree, it's just that 650 Gran coupe is very rare on the UK used market. The only one I can see is a plain jane SE which is dull as hell. There is a 640D in every colour and spec you could want to choose from hence the question. But I'm not going to go there.

If I can't find one I like soon I might just have to go with the M6...oh no!

Edited by Hot Knife on Tuesday 21st May 16:38

[KPB1973]

Hot Knife said:

What you say you went old school what did you go with?

Edited by Hot Knife on Tuesday 21st May 16:28

I was torn between a do-it-all car (e63 estate, m5 or m6 GC) or a more sensible daily plus a weekend car. I really wanted to tick the v8 box either way.

I didn't much like the turbo-powered V8s I tried. I just felt they lacked character and the power delivery was a bit one-dimensional.

So I binned that idea, got a 640d and an e92 M3 for the weekend. The M3 subsequently turned into a nightmare, so I swapped it for another - which was even worse! The engines were masterpieces but both had a huge list of niggles.