Is this an upgrade?
Discussion
Of course it is, but I was just wondering if anyone here had tried it before...
I have a pre-cat Griff which I adore.
My wife, though, is keen to introduce a bigger boot and PAS to our lives.
So, of course, I will take the oppurtunity to try the 5 litre engine ("yes, dear, this is the only engine they do").
Has anyone done this?
Any noticable changes in the drive of the cars or performance?
Any problems particular to the 5 litre?
Thank you for your help...
I have a pre-cat Griff which I adore.
My wife, though, is keen to introduce a bigger boot and PAS to our lives.
So, of course, I will take the oppurtunity to try the 5 litre engine ("yes, dear, this is the only engine they do").
Has anyone done this?
Any noticable changes in the drive of the cars or performance?
Any problems particular to the 5 litre?
Thank you for your help...
The 500 is totally superior in every respect.
I think that has covered it.
We are talking Griff 500 and not one of the Chimpari things...
Steve
www.tvrbooks.co.uk
>> Edited by shpub on Wednesday 25th September 18:13
I think that has covered it.
We are talking Griff 500 and not one of the Chimpari things...
Steve
www.tvrbooks.co.uk
>> Edited by shpub on Wednesday 25th September 18:13
The 5.0L produces more heat & the original front end of the pre-cat griff has less air-flow, this might cause a problem, you may need to make some minor adjustments to grill area. have you considered a 4.6L? a stage 3 would produce approx the same as the standard 500 motor. you could fit a new unit for the price of a good second hand 500 engine, just a thought
Tim
Tim
quote:
have you considered a 4.6L? a stage 3 would produce approx the same as the standard 500 motor. you could fit a new unit for the price of a good second hand 500 engine, just a thought
Tim
I followed Tim's advice a couple of years ago and his prediction was spot on. Not *quite* the mid-range grunt of a 5.0L, but still generous mid-range torque, and it matches the power at the top end. Obviously, you'll want the ACT induction kit to get the most from your new motor! (Cash will be fine, Tim!
) Cheers,
Peter Humphries (and a green V8S with 4.6)
quote:
Not biting Steve!!
enjoy all the work you'll need to do just to get near a 500 performance let alone anything better!
Back to the original question. Chimaeras are softer than the Griff 500 and very soft compared to a Griff 4.x. They are not the same car in that respect. The Chim 500 brakes are the big ones and you will notice a major improvement there and the PAS is great/essential in my opinion.
To be honest you will need to test drive them and see. The power hike is astonishing with more power up the top end - nearly all the 500 curves I have have the power up at the higher end but more than sufficient at the lower end. Build quality is generally better a they have had a few years to work out how to build them.
However really go and test them. They are different and only you can decide what to do.
Steve
enjoy all the work you'll need to do just to get near a 500 performance let alone anything better!
The stage 3, 4.6 will produce very near to that of the standard 500, 5 less bhp and 10 less torque, if your lucky even closer, thats with stage 3 heads, with stage 4 heads and M404 cam it would piss all over a standard 500. provided all your ancillaries are in good order will still cost the price of a second hand 500 !!! + maybe £500max, i am unbiast as i don't build engines but involved with dyno-ing all the time.
Tim
Yes Tim but we all know that the secret of engine upgrades is upgrading the rest of the car to match. so add the cost of a brake upgrade... add the cost of the suspension upgrades including the wishbones and rear anti-roll bar and it doesn't make economic sense.
Add the money you spend upgrading a 4.X engine onto a 5 and you will easily be in the 300+ league. You would then have to upgrade the brakes and so the spiral continues. As long as everyone realises the full story then fine. I am certainly not one to say don't do it with my record but equally I know all the pain and empty wallets involved.
Just saying as usual, that upgrading if done correctly frequently doen't make economic sense.
Creating a 500 equivalent is more than just gaining horsepower.
Add the money you spend upgrading a 4.X engine onto a 5 and you will easily be in the 300+ league. You would then have to upgrade the brakes and so the spiral continues. As long as everyone realises the full story then fine. I am certainly not one to say don't do it with my record but equally I know all the pain and empty wallets involved.
Just saying as usual, that upgrading if done correctly frequently doen't make economic sense.
Creating a 500 equivalent is more than just gaining horsepower.
Steve, I don't wish to argue about modifying brakes suspension etc on a 4.X against selling and buying a 500 . Nice mr Noisygrff was asking about fitting a 500 lump into his 4.X, maybe he prefers to keep his car, i don't know, i'm suggesting that a 4.6 could be a better option if he wishes to change the engine.
Tim
Tim
Thanks guys.
I'd love to spend the extra money upgrading my existing car as it's a lovely clean car.
I think I have to agree with Steve, having done some research into upgrading the engine etc. I thought about Peninsula's 4.6 off the shelf engine. But then I'd have to upgrade the brakes, then the suspension, then redo all the geometry - the list goes on. Where do you stop? If all you are trying to achieve is a car as impressive as the 5 litre, then TVR (whether by luck or judgement) have got the balance right on a standard car.
Besides, no-one has come up with a boot upgrade for the Griffith yet.
The thrust of the question was whether changing from a Griffith 4.0 to a Chimaera 500 was worth all the extra money. Even the wife appears to be on side!
Thanks again for all the input so far.
I'd love to spend the extra money upgrading my existing car as it's a lovely clean car.
I think I have to agree with Steve, having done some research into upgrading the engine etc. I thought about Peninsula's 4.6 off the shelf engine. But then I'd have to upgrade the brakes, then the suspension, then redo all the geometry - the list goes on. Where do you stop? If all you are trying to achieve is a car as impressive as the 5 litre, then TVR (whether by luck or judgement) have got the balance right on a standard car.
Besides, no-one has come up with a boot upgrade for the Griffith yet.
The thrust of the question was whether changing from a Griffith 4.0 to a Chimaera 500 was worth all the extra money. Even the wife appears to be on side!
Thanks again for all the input so far.
""Iwould have thought a 4.0L Griff will sell very quickly compared to a 500 chimaera, so you would be in a strong position.""
have you actually tried to find a late i.e. (99 onwards
imho) chimaera 500 in a decent colour,there aren't hardley any about, as thats about when the tuscan kicked in. Good luck too us about a year to find a decent one.
But well worth it and yes they are actually the same underneath the final changes came in in late 98 acording to the factory
have you actually tried to find a late i.e. (99 onwards
imho) chimaera 500 in a decent colour,there aren't hardley any about, as thats about when the tuscan kicked in. Good luck too us about a year to find a decent one.
But well worth it and yes they are actually the same underneath the final changes came in in late 98 acording to the factory
quote:
quote:
Not biting Steve!!
enjoy all the work you'll need to do just to get near a 500 performance let alone anything better!
Back to the original question. Chimaeras are softer than the Griff 500 and very soft compared to a Griff 4.x. They are not the same car in that respect. The Chim 500 brakes are the big ones and you will notice a major improvement there and the PAS is great/essential in my opinion.
To be honest you will need to test drive them and see. The power hike is astonishing with more power up the top end - nearly all the 500 curves I have have the power up at the higher end but more than sufficient at the lower end. Build quality is generally better a they have had a few years to work out how to build them.
However really go and test them. They are different and only you can decide what to do.
Steve
Where are the differences between Griff and Chimaera 500s then (apart from the obvious cosmetic ones) They have the same chassis, same suspension, same engine, same brakes and the same performance figures....
Not all Griff 500s are the same as there have been about 10 different suspension changes (springs, shocks etc) so depending on which one you compare to which Chimaera 500 (which has also had a policy of continual refinement) they may be similar or different. Of course some may have the BTR or the GKN or Hydratrak LSD diff which also changes the feel. The tyre sizes have also changed as well.
In addition, I have driven these cars back to back with supposedly the same suspension (first define the standard) and they do handle differently with the Chimaera being softer generally. Many ex Griff owners have asked for Griff spec suspension on a Chim and then found it to be different so I am a little sceptical of claims of compatibility because the standards varied so much. I also think that the body design and aerodynamics may have a bigger effect than people think as well. Then there is the golf bags in the Chim that are obigatory...
The problem is there is no standard only a generalisation: Griff 4.x hard, Griff 500 medium, Chim 500 softer.
It is interesting that many Chim drivers claim Griff 500 suspension but you never here of a Griff 500 owner claiming I have Chim compatible suspension....
Steve
www.tvrbooks.co.uk
In addition, I have driven these cars back to back with supposedly the same suspension (first define the standard) and they do handle differently with the Chimaera being softer generally. Many ex Griff owners have asked for Griff spec suspension on a Chim and then found it to be different so I am a little sceptical of claims of compatibility because the standards varied so much. I also think that the body design and aerodynamics may have a bigger effect than people think as well. Then there is the golf bags in the Chim that are obigatory...
The problem is there is no standard only a generalisation: Griff 4.x hard, Griff 500 medium, Chim 500 softer.
It is interesting that many Chim drivers claim Griff 500 suspension but you never here of a Griff 500 owner claiming I have Chim compatible suspension....
Steve
www.tvrbooks.co.uk
As time goes alot of 4.X griffs have been updated mine included, when something needs replacing anyway why not fit later spec, mine has ( by the previous owner) 500 springs & dampers, it also has the rear anti roll bar , my brakes are coming to the end of there life so naturally i will fit to the front 260mm XR4 parts as per Griff 500. i won't pretend that i know anywhere near as much as Steve about the differences on these cars, but surely there are a lot of 4.X models updated to 500 spec , suspension & brakes i mean.
Tim
Tim
Gassing Station | Chimaera | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff