Which 20k SUV? Volvo XC90 D5 or Land Rover Discovery 4?
Discussion
Phase 3 of our new family car search. We've been looking since March/April and my wife thought that she would like a new/nearly new crossover to replace our MPV. However, having looked at a few, she didn't really like any of them and they weren't as spacious as she thought they would be. I suggested a used "premium" estate, such as a 3-Series Touring/E-Class Estate and we also looked at an E70 X5 for good measure but she didn't like any of them either.
I think that we may have reached a compromise on a larger SUV. I would prefer one of these to a small crossover and she would prefer one to an estate/BMW X5 and having had the extra seats in our MPV, she is reluctant to give them up, as they're useful for grandparents, cousins, taking the kid's friends out etc and regrettably with half an eye on running costs, I think that we'll need to go diesel for respectable fuel economy.
We both like the previous generation Volvo XC90 D5 and Land Rover Discovery 4. Both seem like safe, comfortable, practical and fairly unpretentious vehicles and quite nice places to be and we hope to be able to test them out next weekend. Neither will be that sharp to drive (which is why I favoured the X5) but from brief encounters with both in the past, they should at least be quite pleasant and our budget is 20k.
The drive will of course be subjective and a big part of the decision process but I was wondering how the two compared in terms of performance, real world mpg, reliability etc and which spec is the one to go for (I'm thinking HSE on the Land Rover but not sure on the specs on the Volvo). I would expect the Discovery 4 to be the least reliable because Land Rover but I think the Volvo may have its fair share of issues too? From a practicality and comfort point of view, what are the rearmost seats like for space/comfort and with all seats in place, how much useable luggage space is there? We've done a long road trip 6-up with luggage in our Grand Voyager before and although the rearmost seats aren't super comfortable, the amount of luggage space still on offer is certainly impressive.
I think that we may have reached a compromise on a larger SUV. I would prefer one of these to a small crossover and she would prefer one to an estate/BMW X5 and having had the extra seats in our MPV, she is reluctant to give them up, as they're useful for grandparents, cousins, taking the kid's friends out etc and regrettably with half an eye on running costs, I think that we'll need to go diesel for respectable fuel economy.
We both like the previous generation Volvo XC90 D5 and Land Rover Discovery 4. Both seem like safe, comfortable, practical and fairly unpretentious vehicles and quite nice places to be and we hope to be able to test them out next weekend. Neither will be that sharp to drive (which is why I favoured the X5) but from brief encounters with both in the past, they should at least be quite pleasant and our budget is 20k.
The drive will of course be subjective and a big part of the decision process but I was wondering how the two compared in terms of performance, real world mpg, reliability etc and which spec is the one to go for (I'm thinking HSE on the Land Rover but not sure on the specs on the Volvo). I would expect the Discovery 4 to be the least reliable because Land Rover but I think the Volvo may have its fair share of issues too? From a practicality and comfort point of view, what are the rearmost seats like for space/comfort and with all seats in place, how much useable luggage space is there? We've done a long road trip 6-up with luggage in our Grand Voyager before and although the rearmost seats aren't super comfortable, the amount of luggage space still on offer is certainly impressive.
Both are big inside but they are not MPV big. Considered them both when moving from our old Smax to our current Kia Sorrento. In the end my worries about reliability got the better of me...too many reports of probs with the Disco, and propshaft failure seems to be common along with other issues on the XC90. Also the old model XC90 is, well, a VERY old design now. A new model was totally out of our budget, shame.
We went for a nearly new, new-shape Sorrento as a compromise with plenty of warranty, its not as spacious as our Smax overall, as does not have three separate middle row seats, but the rearmost seats are actually better than the Smax and easier to use. It's an auto and averages 35mpg which I think is fair. My wife is the main driver and likes the raised ride height by comparison with the S-max
We went for a nearly new, new-shape Sorrento as a compromise with plenty of warranty, its not as spacious as our Smax overall, as does not have three separate middle row seats, but the rearmost seats are actually better than the Smax and easier to use. It's an auto and averages 35mpg which I think is fair. My wife is the main driver and likes the raised ride height by comparison with the S-max
white_goodman said:
Phase 3 of our new family car search. We've been looking since March/April and my wife thought that she would like a new/nearly new crossover to replace our MPV. However, having looked at a few, she didn't really like any of them and they weren't as spacious as she thought they would be. I suggested a used "premium" estate, such as a 3-Series Touring/E-Class Estate and we also looked at an E70 X5 for good measure but she didn't like any of them either.
I think that we may have reached a compromise on a larger SUV. I would prefer one of these to a small crossover and she would prefer one to an estate/BMW X5 and having had the extra seats in our MPV, she is reluctant to give them up, as they're useful for grandparents, cousins, taking the kid's friends out etc and regrettably with half an eye on running costs, I think that we'll need to go diesel for respectable fuel economy.
We both like the previous generation Volvo XC90 D5 and Land Rover Discovery 4. Both seem like safe, comfortable, practical and fairly unpretentious vehicles and quite nice places to be and we hope to be able to test them out next weekend. Neither will be that sharp to drive (which is why I favoured the X5) but from brief encounters with both in the past, they should at least be quite pleasant and our budget is 20k.
The drive will of course be subjective and a big part of the decision process but I was wondering how the two compared in terms of performance, real world mpg, reliability etc and which spec is the one to go for (I'm thinking HSE on the Land Rover but not sure on the specs on the Volvo). I would expect the Discovery 4 to be the least reliable because Land Rover but I think the Volvo may have its fair share of issues too? From a practicality and comfort point of view, what are the rearmost seats like for space/comfort and with all seats in place, how much useable luggage space is there? We've done a long road trip 6-up with luggage in our Grand Voyager before and although the rearmost seats aren't super comfortable, the amount of luggage space still on offer is certainly impressive.
Best thing to go from a MPV is to a SUV. We actually went from a XC90 to the X5, space in the back was actually not that different in the X5, marginal differences - both are cramped for people in the 3rd row and leave little space with all seats up - even less so in the D4 as when 7 up the boot space is more or less gone. Saying this, the D4 has much bigger seats with a stadium layout, so in terms of comfort for all the D4 is probably best. X5 has a bumpy ride but 7 seaters have air suspension which does help - standard fit on the D4 unless you have a S trim. XC90 has very boaty suspension, not the best for carsick people, but otherwise also very very comfortable.I think that we may have reached a compromise on a larger SUV. I would prefer one of these to a small crossover and she would prefer one to an estate/BMW X5 and having had the extra seats in our MPV, she is reluctant to give them up, as they're useful for grandparents, cousins, taking the kid's friends out etc and regrettably with half an eye on running costs, I think that we'll need to go diesel for respectable fuel economy.
We both like the previous generation Volvo XC90 D5 and Land Rover Discovery 4. Both seem like safe, comfortable, practical and fairly unpretentious vehicles and quite nice places to be and we hope to be able to test them out next weekend. Neither will be that sharp to drive (which is why I favoured the X5) but from brief encounters with both in the past, they should at least be quite pleasant and our budget is 20k.
The drive will of course be subjective and a big part of the decision process but I was wondering how the two compared in terms of performance, real world mpg, reliability etc and which spec is the one to go for (I'm thinking HSE on the Land Rover but not sure on the specs on the Volvo). I would expect the Discovery 4 to be the least reliable because Land Rover but I think the Volvo may have its fair share of issues too? From a practicality and comfort point of view, what are the rearmost seats like for space/comfort and with all seats in place, how much useable luggage space is there? We've done a long road trip 6-up with luggage in our Grand Voyager before and although the rearmost seats aren't super comfortable, the amount of luggage space still on offer is certainly impressive.
Ill just do a ranking for you,1 being best and 5 being worst in class.
Performance:
X5 - 1
GL - 2
Q7 - 3
D4 - 4
XC90 - 5
Reliability:
X5 - 1
Q7 - 2
XC90 - 3
D4 - 4
GL - 5
MPG:
XC90 - 1
Q7 - 2
X5 - 3
D4 - 4
GL - 5
All have good luggage space, but with all seats up:
Q7 - 1
GL - 2
XC90 - 3
X5 - 4
D4 - 5
3rd Row Comfort:
D4 - 1
GL - 2
Q7 - 3
XC90 - 4
X5 - 5
All the 2010 plus models should have £300 per year tax.
Build quality/material quality/fit and finish:
X5 - 1
GL - 2
Q7 - 3
D4 -4
XC90 - 5
Best Spec:
X5 - M-Sport or Dynamic Pack
GL - SE spec generally well equipped
Q7 - S-Line has nicer seats, better headlights
D4 - At the very least XS trim, some XS have a good options list, but you want a HSE
XC90 - Premium/R-Line
Found the X5 to be best value for money, the budget would often get you the newest with a high spec, many Q7's demanded more for a facelift (2009 ish), the GL was actually very expensive, budget saw a 57 plate, D4 was again edging into XS trim, and XC90 was very good value as would often be the newest (but we didn't want another).
X5 certainly drives the best, sacrifices ride comfort however. For the X5, budget dictates a 40d, which are very powerful cars.
That’s a cracking summary Rayvan, only thing I’d add is a category about general comfort which I think for the front 2 rows is a particularly strong point for the Disco. In fact as a family wagon with no expectations of being a sporty drive (which they are all extremely weak at anyway), the Disco is very strong there, a very relaxing car to use.
rayyan171 said:
Best thing to go from a MPV is to a SUV. We actually went from a XC90 to the X5, space in the back was actually not that different in the X5, marginal differences - both are cramped for people in the 3rd row and leave little space with all seats up - even less so in the D4 as when 7 up the boot space is more or less gone. Saying this, the D4 has much bigger seats with a stadium layout, so in terms of comfort for all the D4 is probably best. X5 has a bumpy ride but 7 seaters have air suspension which does help - standard fit on the D4 unless you have a S trim. XC90 has very boaty suspension, not the best for carsick people, but otherwise also very very comfortable.
Ill just do a ranking for you,1 being best and 5 being worst in class.
Performance:
X5 - 1
GL - 2
Q7 - 3
D4 - 4
XC90 - 5
Reliability:
X5 - 1
Q7 - 2
XC90 - 3
D4 - 4
GL - 5
MPG:
XC90 - 1
Q7 - 2
X5 - 3
D4 - 4
GL - 5
All have good luggage space, but with all seats up:
Q7 - 1
GL - 2
XC90 - 3
X5 - 4
D4 - 5
3rd Row Comfort:
D4 - 1
GL - 2
Q7 - 3
XC90 - 4
X5 - 5
All the 2010 plus models should have £300 per year tax.
Build quality/material quality/fit and finish:
X5 - 1
GL - 2
Q7 - 3
D4 -4
XC90 - 5
Best Spec:
X5 - M-Sport or Dynamic Pack
GL - SE spec generally well equipped
Q7 - S-Line has nicer seats, better headlights
D4 - At the very least XS trim, some XS have a good options list, but you want a HSE
XC90 - Premium/R-Line
Found the X5 to be best value for money, the budget would often get you the newest with a high spec, many Q7's demanded more for a facelift (2009 ish), the GL was actually very expensive, budget saw a 57 plate, D4 was again edging into XS trim, and XC90 was very good value as would often be the newest (but we didn't want another).
X5 certainly drives the best, sacrifices ride comfort however. For the X5, budget dictates a 40d, which are very powerful cars.
Thanks appreciate that. Ill just do a ranking for you,1 being best and 5 being worst in class.
Performance:
X5 - 1
GL - 2
Q7 - 3
D4 - 4
XC90 - 5
Reliability:
X5 - 1
Q7 - 2
XC90 - 3
D4 - 4
GL - 5
MPG:
XC90 - 1
Q7 - 2
X5 - 3
D4 - 4
GL - 5
All have good luggage space, but with all seats up:
Q7 - 1
GL - 2
XC90 - 3
X5 - 4
D4 - 5
3rd Row Comfort:
D4 - 1
GL - 2
Q7 - 3
XC90 - 4
X5 - 5
All the 2010 plus models should have £300 per year tax.
Build quality/material quality/fit and finish:
X5 - 1
GL - 2
Q7 - 3
D4 -4
XC90 - 5
Best Spec:
X5 - M-Sport or Dynamic Pack
GL - SE spec generally well equipped
Q7 - S-Line has nicer seats, better headlights
D4 - At the very least XS trim, some XS have a good options list, but you want a HSE
XC90 - Premium/R-Line
Found the X5 to be best value for money, the budget would often get you the newest with a high spec, many Q7's demanded more for a facelift (2009 ish), the GL was actually very expensive, budget saw a 57 plate, D4 was again edging into XS trim, and XC90 was very good value as would often be the newest (but we didn't want another).
X5 certainly drives the best, sacrifices ride comfort however. For the X5, budget dictates a 40d, which are very powerful cars.
I'm surprised that you ranked the X5 best for reliability. Most nickable though? 20k is on the cusp of E70/F15? We looked at an F15. I have no expectation of a "sporty" drive in this kind of vehicle but as I was leaning more towards an estate, I thought that the X5 might be the quickest/most car-like to drive. My wife didn't like the E70 that we looked at though and the BMW "image", so probably a non-starter! The Grand Voyager isn't lovely to drive or fast or particularly economical, so I think any of these, even the Volvo being the oldest design would be an upgrade in terms of the driving experience.I can only comment on the XC90. I had a 2010 which was the first generation of the 197bhp version.
I am a Volvo man through and through but I’ll keep this balanced..
Yes, remember it is a very old design. Inside it does feel it. Tech is quite low rent - I had a top drawer Executive spec and even that felt a bit low rent. Don’t get me wrong it had all the toys, but the screen was green screen, and pushy buttons rather than touch screen.
The seats are awesome - it is a Volvo after all... it is genuinely a very comfortable place to spend time and long drives.
The rear bench seat is a good size and comfortable, my kids were happy as Larry with the space and comfort.
The 3rd row was ok. Proper seats and some leg room. I’m not sure as an adult I’d want to spend hours in them, but for teenagers, or adults for shorter journeys they are as good as you’ll get.
I am a fan of the D5, so I liked it. I had mine remapped to about 235bhp and it went well. The engine was certainly up to the task of lugging the car about. Mpg was disappointing at an average of 26mpg, and that was with a fair amount of motorway.
However - and here’s the rub - the 6 speed auto was frankly rubbish. It’s a traditional torque converter slush box, so I expected it to the sluggish. But this box is sluggish even by slush box standards. Also, the move off from a stand still is *very* ponderous. It hesitated for a moment, but feels like an age. You have to preempt pulling out into traffic more than I’ve ever had to with any other car. For me, it spoilt the car.
Reliability was good, the only issue I had was a wheel bearing.
Overall for the cash, I think it’s a cracking car. I’d have another, but for me the mpg was a deal breaker.
I am a Volvo man through and through but I’ll keep this balanced..
Yes, remember it is a very old design. Inside it does feel it. Tech is quite low rent - I had a top drawer Executive spec and even that felt a bit low rent. Don’t get me wrong it had all the toys, but the screen was green screen, and pushy buttons rather than touch screen.
The seats are awesome - it is a Volvo after all... it is genuinely a very comfortable place to spend time and long drives.
The rear bench seat is a good size and comfortable, my kids were happy as Larry with the space and comfort.
The 3rd row was ok. Proper seats and some leg room. I’m not sure as an adult I’d want to spend hours in them, but for teenagers, or adults for shorter journeys they are as good as you’ll get.
I am a fan of the D5, so I liked it. I had mine remapped to about 235bhp and it went well. The engine was certainly up to the task of lugging the car about. Mpg was disappointing at an average of 26mpg, and that was with a fair amount of motorway.
However - and here’s the rub - the 6 speed auto was frankly rubbish. It’s a traditional torque converter slush box, so I expected it to the sluggish. But this box is sluggish even by slush box standards. Also, the move off from a stand still is *very* ponderous. It hesitated for a moment, but feels like an age. You have to preempt pulling out into traffic more than I’ve ever had to with any other car. For me, it spoilt the car.
Reliability was good, the only issue I had was a wheel bearing.
Overall for the cash, I think it’s a cracking car. I’d have another, but for me the mpg was a deal breaker.
white_goodman said:
Thanks appreciate that. I'm surprised that you ranked the X5 best for reliability. Most nickable though? 20k is on the cusp of E70/F15? We looked at an F15. I have no expectation of a "sporty" drive in this kind of vehicle but as I was leaning more towards an estate, I thought that the X5 might be the quickest/most car-like to drive. My wife didn't like the E70 that we looked at though and the BMW "image", so probably a non-starter! The Grand Voyager isn't lovely to drive or fast or particularly economical, so I think any of these, even the Volvo being the oldest design would be an upgrade in terms of the driving experience.
No problem. I'm surprised that you ranked the X5 best for reliability. Most nickable though? 20k is on the cusp of E70/F15? We looked at an F15. I have no expectation of a "sporty" drive in this kind of vehicle but as I was leaning more towards an estate, I thought that the X5 might be the quickest/most car-like to drive. My wife didn't like the E70 that we looked at though and the BMW "image", so probably a non-starter! The Grand Voyager isn't lovely to drive or fast or particularly economical, so I think any of these, even the Volvo being the oldest design would be an upgrade in terms of the driving experience.In terms of seat comfort for all, the X5 has sports seats and a smaller middle seat in the rear bench for 7 seat versions, but they often come with rear heated seats which is very nice, sometimes even 4 zone climate which is quite the luxury. Same can be said about the Q7, GL and D4, but the XC90 has zilch in the back. Saying this, the rear seats of the XC90 are nice and big, and the middle seat on the 2nd row is a booster seat. Q7 is almost 3 full size seats, same for the D4 and GL. Front seats are very good in the XC90, not always electrical, X5 has guaranteed half electric function in the most basic of spec, M-Sport always has full electric sports seats. D4 even not always electric seats. GL has standard electric, Q7 sometimes has electric tilting backrest only and optional full electric. GL easiest to get in the back of, electric folding 3rd row. Rest are all mechanical.
I do disagree with some here however. The X5 is a very sporty ride, which shows in the ride comfort, but no doubt the best in the twists. Tempted to say that the X5 handles better than our A6, yes the A6 is lighter and also has S-line suspension but the X5 is very composed at high speed and has really good steering feel, with very little give.
As for the F15 argument, the F15 X5 will hold better value, but the E70 will likely be higher spec. We had the choice of a LCI or pre LCI E70, and went for a high spec pre-LCI, but your choice will be high spec LCI or F15, which is a rather different car with more comfortable suspension (arguably).
I’m biased but it would be a D4 every single time. It’s not the best road car on that list above but it’s the absolute best all rounder.
It’s a very comfortable, wafty ride and the 8-speed cars have bucket-loads of torque for very easy driving. There’s a sense of detachment from the road and a feeling of isolation from other road users. The seating position, coupled with the low window line, is significantly higher than the others and you genuinely do feel like you’re on top of other cars. Couple that with four square corners and it’s remarkably easy to place on the road and when parking. It’s a bit wobbly in the corners though but the level of grip is huge.
The split tailgate is extremely useful for family stuff, but frustratingly annoying when you want to reach something at the back of the boot! The seven seats are all full sized but then you end up with no boot space. The 825w stereo is incredible, but the interface to use it is awful. A perfect car in so many ways but flawed in others.
I’ve got an order in for a new Discovery 5 but if the D4 was still available I’d have chosen another of those without a doubt! Get the D4!
Edit: Seeing as you asked about running costs......23-25mpg absolute maximum. Tyres last 20k ish and are about £180 for Pirellis. Brakes wear fast and aren’t cheap - don’t buy anything other than LR products. LR warranty is excellent but £1000 a year. A service is £600 main dealer or £350ish specialist. Cam belts at 7 years are about £1100 from main dealer. Crankshafts like to snap (apparently), about £10k for that one!
It’s a very comfortable, wafty ride and the 8-speed cars have bucket-loads of torque for very easy driving. There’s a sense of detachment from the road and a feeling of isolation from other road users. The seating position, coupled with the low window line, is significantly higher than the others and you genuinely do feel like you’re on top of other cars. Couple that with four square corners and it’s remarkably easy to place on the road and when parking. It’s a bit wobbly in the corners though but the level of grip is huge.
The split tailgate is extremely useful for family stuff, but frustratingly annoying when you want to reach something at the back of the boot! The seven seats are all full sized but then you end up with no boot space. The 825w stereo is incredible, but the interface to use it is awful. A perfect car in so many ways but flawed in others.
I’ve got an order in for a new Discovery 5 but if the D4 was still available I’d have chosen another of those without a doubt! Get the D4!
Edit: Seeing as you asked about running costs......23-25mpg absolute maximum. Tyres last 20k ish and are about £180 for Pirellis. Brakes wear fast and aren’t cheap - don’t buy anything other than LR products. LR warranty is excellent but £1000 a year. A service is £600 main dealer or £350ish specialist. Cam belts at 7 years are about £1100 from main dealer. Crankshafts like to snap (apparently), about £10k for that one!
Edited by Crumpet on Tuesday 18th June 20:33
As another poster said the auto on the XC90 is a real downside IMO.
Sometimes dangerous if you hadn't anticipated how bloody slow it was to react.
We've had 2 and both were reliable and good at doing the normal duties for a family of 5.
Non remapped D5 should do 30+ mpg.
Ours was the 185 and averaged 33 mpg
It was also superb at towing our 1400kg caravan.
We did think about the Disco but they seemed less reliable and were high 20s for fuel.
Personally I would go for the X5 but that's not 1 of your choices
Drive both and see if you can live with the auto and low tech on the Volvo.
Sometimes dangerous if you hadn't anticipated how bloody slow it was to react.
We've had 2 and both were reliable and good at doing the normal duties for a family of 5.
Non remapped D5 should do 30+ mpg.
Ours was the 185 and averaged 33 mpg
It was also superb at towing our 1400kg caravan.
We did think about the Disco but they seemed less reliable and were high 20s for fuel.
Personally I would go for the X5 but that's not 1 of your choices
Drive both and see if you can live with the auto and low tech on the Volvo.
I can pitch in about the E70 X5 and the D4. I had an X5 for 3 years - it was a good drive but I found that it was less comfortable for passengers. I was also not overly impressed by the build quality - lots of niggles with trim coming loose or feeling flimsy - but overall a good car. I can't really comment on fuel economy as mine was the 4.8 V8 petrol.
I have now got a D4 SE Tech - coming up for 4 years old and bought new. The finance term ends in October and I think I will pay the outstanding balance off and keep the car - I just cannot find anything for the price that I would rather have. It has been totally reliable with the only work needed other than routine servicing being to re-programme the keys to the car after changing the batteries. It does everything - ferrying the kids and their friends to rugby, 10 hours to the south of France to go skiing, tip runs, and has never left me wanting for anything.
Fuel economy is averaging at 27 mpg but that includes lots of short trips in town.
To drive, it is not the sharpest but is surprisingly brisk and responsive for such a big car - I have never felt shortchanged.
The only negative - which is not the fault of the car - is that some scumbags have stolen the rear light clusters in the past. The design means they can simply be unscrewed and removed within a few seconds. Easily fixed by changing the screws for security bolts.
Overall, you can probably tell that I am a bit pleased with the D4 - I may have been lucky and got one of the good ones, but the reliability has been excellent and in my opinion it is the perfect do-it-all family car.
I have now got a D4 SE Tech - coming up for 4 years old and bought new. The finance term ends in October and I think I will pay the outstanding balance off and keep the car - I just cannot find anything for the price that I would rather have. It has been totally reliable with the only work needed other than routine servicing being to re-programme the keys to the car after changing the batteries. It does everything - ferrying the kids and their friends to rugby, 10 hours to the south of France to go skiing, tip runs, and has never left me wanting for anything.
Fuel economy is averaging at 27 mpg but that includes lots of short trips in town.
To drive, it is not the sharpest but is surprisingly brisk and responsive for such a big car - I have never felt shortchanged.
The only negative - which is not the fault of the car - is that some scumbags have stolen the rear light clusters in the past. The design means they can simply be unscrewed and removed within a few seconds. Easily fixed by changing the screws for security bolts.
Overall, you can probably tell that I am a bit pleased with the D4 - I may have been lucky and got one of the good ones, but the reliability has been excellent and in my opinion it is the perfect do-it-all family car.
i have had q7, FFRR, X5, disco 3 and GL......
q7 - nice car, most practical in terms of layout as middle row splits 40:20:40 which is handy, drives like a car, roof line is low so again feels like a car but can be restrictive if you have a lot of stuff, reliable but was quite new when i got it
FFRR - i had a older TD6 made by BMW..... nice place to be, happy at 80mph but not really above as had 5 speed box, bodywork can be an issue, newer versions can have a lot of mechanical issues
disco - quite basic, newer models a lot more bling inside, good car, good off road particularly in snow, again very flexible in terms of boot opening and seat layout. mine was reliable
x5 - car on stilts, good ion road, useless in snow (tyres too big on these things) hard ride (as per all bow's)
gl - current car..... nothing gone wrong so far, can have issue with air struts, enormous inside (largest) very comfortable, technology (satnav etc) old for year
i liked the audi, but wasn't big enough so for us at the moment the merc fits the bill..... cheap to buy 2nd hand
q7 - nice car, most practical in terms of layout as middle row splits 40:20:40 which is handy, drives like a car, roof line is low so again feels like a car but can be restrictive if you have a lot of stuff, reliable but was quite new when i got it
FFRR - i had a older TD6 made by BMW..... nice place to be, happy at 80mph but not really above as had 5 speed box, bodywork can be an issue, newer versions can have a lot of mechanical issues
disco - quite basic, newer models a lot more bling inside, good car, good off road particularly in snow, again very flexible in terms of boot opening and seat layout. mine was reliable
x5 - car on stilts, good ion road, useless in snow (tyres too big on these things) hard ride (as per all bow's)
gl - current car..... nothing gone wrong so far, can have issue with air struts, enormous inside (largest) very comfortable, technology (satnav etc) old for year
i liked the audi, but wasn't big enough so for us at the moment the merc fits the bill..... cheap to buy 2nd hand
Crumpet said:
Crankshafts like to snap (apparently), about £10k for that one!
I mind reading up that the 8 speed box introduced in 2012 could help reduce this issue, any truth in this? Also, I mind the 3.0 V6 engine in the Jaguars were revised in the facelift around 2012 so that the bearing sleeve couldn't rotate and block the oil holes (or something like this) preventing proper lubrication. I'm wondering if the same applies to the Disco4 around the same time?
I'd have to say the X5 will be no more reliable than the D4 all cars have the potential to have issues, one thing I will say is I'm surprised you haven't taken a look at the Jeep Grand Cherokee in Summit/Overland spec:
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
Overland
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
They're a hard car to look past especially at this price point & you can get a fairly low mileage 4/5 year old car.
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
Overland
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
They're a hard car to look past especially at this price point & you can get a fairly low mileage 4/5 year old car.
We have an XC90. My Mrs loves it. It is pretty agricultural and not the best from a driving experience point of view. I have a real soft spot for it though. It's great on fuel for what it is (34mpg average), 4x4 works well on muddy fields and in the snow, the boot is massive and we've used it for house moves and van like things. It's been reliable (2008 model with over 100k on the clock) and I can't fault it for what we use it for. The engine is not the fastest but it's good enough to make progress without feeling under-powered.
She wants to change it soon. The new shape is the only car she wants which is out of budget. I've tried to get her into all sorts but she won't have it. She tried the Sorento but didn't gel with it. We've not looked at the Disco but her mother has had 2 and both were totally unreliable so she won't have any of it.
The X5 is the car I'd plump for personally. A good used example isn't cheap but they've been out a while and they're cheaper than the new Volvo.
Our old Volvo is an old design and it does feel it's age.
She wants to change it soon. The new shape is the only car she wants which is out of budget. I've tried to get her into all sorts but she won't have it. She tried the Sorento but didn't gel with it. We've not looked at the Disco but her mother has had 2 and both were totally unreliable so she won't have any of it.
The X5 is the car I'd plump for personally. A good used example isn't cheap but they've been out a while and they're cheaper than the new Volvo.
Our old Volvo is an old design and it does feel it's age.
ZX10R NIN said:
I'd have to say the X5 will be no more reliable than the D4 all cars have the potential to have issues, one thing I will say is I'm surprised you haven't taken a look at the Jeep Grand Cherokee in Summit/Overland spec:
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
Overland
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
They're a hard car to look past especially at this price point & you can get a fairly low mileage 4/5 year old car.
I may be wrong but these are only 5-seat aren't they!?https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
Overland
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
They're a hard car to look past especially at this price point & you can get a fairly low mileage 4/5 year old car.
I would put comfort, versatility and ride/refinement at the top of my list given the cars usage, for me the Discovery wins on these.
I think all those being considered have the potential to throw you a larger than average bill for something that has failed/expired mechanically.
There are known weak points on all those mentioned.
I had a Discovery and it proved reliable (Monday morning car?!), bought with invoices showing most of the weak points had been addressed, I sold it at 110k and in my ownership I replaced a wheel bearing and a brake light switch over and above routine servicing.
MPG was 32 on the dash, 27 actual.
My brother-in-law had a XC90 D5 and it was forever with his local garage having things diagnosed/replaced. I believe they spent over £6k in repairs in less than 3yrs.
They sold as they lost confidence in the car, now have a £5k E320CDI estate 7-seat and they love it, especially nothing failing in 20k miles since purchasing last year!
Cheers,
Chris
Summit_Detailing said:
I may be wrong but these are only 5-seat aren't they!?
I would put comfort, versatility and ride/refinement at the top of my list given the cars usage, for me the Discovery wins on these.
I think all those being considered have the potential to throw you a larger than average bill for something that has failed/expired mechanically.
There are known weak points on all those mentioned.
I had a Discovery and it proved reliable (Monday morning car?!), bought with invoices showing most of the weak points had been addressed, I sold it at 110k and in my ownership I replaced a wheel bearing and a brake light switch over and above routine servicing.
MPG was 32 on the dash, 27 actual.
My brother-in-law had a XC90 D5 and it was forever with his local garage having things diagnosed/replaced. I believe they spent over £6k in repairs in less than 3yrs.
They sold as they lost confidence in the car, now have a £5k E320CDI estate 7-seat and they love it, especially nothing failing in 20k miles since purchasing last year!
Cheers,
Chris
Correct. I would absolutely consider a Grand Cherokee but my wife really wants the extra seats. I would see not having room for the cousins as a bonus though, LOL!I would put comfort, versatility and ride/refinement at the top of my list given the cars usage, for me the Discovery wins on these.
I think all those being considered have the potential to throw you a larger than average bill for something that has failed/expired mechanically.
There are known weak points on all those mentioned.
I had a Discovery and it proved reliable (Monday morning car?!), bought with invoices showing most of the weak points had been addressed, I sold it at 110k and in my ownership I replaced a wheel bearing and a brake light switch over and above routine servicing.
MPG was 32 on the dash, 27 actual.
My brother-in-law had a XC90 D5 and it was forever with his local garage having things diagnosed/replaced. I believe they spent over £6k in repairs in less than 3yrs.
They sold as they lost confidence in the car, now have a £5k E320CDI estate 7-seat and they love it, especially nothing failing in 20k miles since purchasing last year!
Cheers,
Chris
I have a GL, used to have an ML, temporarily had an X5 3-litre diesel, and different friends and colleagues have a Q7, X5 40D (7-seater), Cayenne, FFRR L322, Disco 4, XC90 and a Pathfinder.
Mine is easily the largest inside. Adults can sit comfortably in all 7-seats. By comparison, the Q7's rear seats are for children only. The D4 and X5 will accommodate adults but you wouldn't want to travel that way for long. The XC90's rear seats are tight for adults - I'd compare them with those in the Q7 but it was a long time between my comparing them so I might not be a reliable witness in this regard.
With all seats deployed. The Q7 has virtually no boot space. The GL has a little more but it really is a little more. The GL's square roof/tailgate line helps if you have something taller but really to compare boot space of either in this configuration means you are looking in the wrong place.
Same applies to the XC90 really. The X5 has zero boot space with the rear seats in place. Similar for the D4.
The Pathfinder is interesting but I've only actually seen this one once and I don't even know if there is a 3rd row of seats or anything other than the 4-cyl engine option which is what's inside my colleague's. But it's huge - it must be as long as my GL and looks pretty tough. It's a more practical alternative to a pick-up with a fibreglass roof over the luggage bed.
There's nothing I can add in regard to the L322 that others haven't already covered.
The best driver's cars are the Cayenne and X5. Some engine variations of each are better than others. By comparison, the Mercs (ML and GL) drive like trucks but the Mercs can tow 3500Kg where only some configurations and ages of the others can.
The Mercs are good off road given decent tyres. They have strong gearboxes and 4WD systems if they are serviced properly. My GL has air suspension. Others do too but it's model dependent. Mine is height adjustable which has proven useful a couple of times but generally it's the plush ride that makes air suspension worthwhile. Yes, it can fail - I've replaced the compressor on mine - but I remain a fan regardless.
Mine also has centre and rear diff lockers, and a low range transfer case. I'm not sure if the newer GLs have any of this stuff. Mine's a 61-reg, so pretty old now.
The X5 and Q7 aren't bad off road either, again given the right tyres. I'm not talking rock crawling. Noone really does this but a practical application of what people use these for is towing 2-tonne horse boxes on slippery grass, mud or in the snow.
My friend's Q7 has rear wheel steering which is incredible. It seems to turn around in half the space my GL can.
I think if I needed to go off road more, I'd opt for the D4. The FFRR doesn't really stack up as a viable option to me - it's expensive to run and really needs an enthusiast's approach to maintenance. Greatest plushest ride of them all though.
The XC90 is my least favourite but that's because I've only tried the 5-cylinder diesel version which I found underpowered. I have not tried the V8 petrol ones and I suspect I might like it however it wouldn't make sense economically for me. I do like the "look" of the new XC90s more than any of the others though - I think Volvo have nailed the styling, especially in regard to the headlights.
A V8 Cayenne is hysterically fun to drive but expensive on the dinosaur juice. The 40D version of the X5 that my friend has pushes out over 300bhp and moves it along at a suitably indecent pace. Overall I think I prefer that over the others including my GL however we once had an X5 but it was stolen off our drive after only 6-weeks and left us with the feeling that BMWs made us vulnerable - they were being targeted and had been proven easy to take thanks to an easy OBD exploit.
Also, the GL... It's a zombie apocalypse vehicle. Goes everywhere. A 450 would be better than my 350 but they are just so rare I couldn't find any.
Mine is easily the largest inside. Adults can sit comfortably in all 7-seats. By comparison, the Q7's rear seats are for children only. The D4 and X5 will accommodate adults but you wouldn't want to travel that way for long. The XC90's rear seats are tight for adults - I'd compare them with those in the Q7 but it was a long time between my comparing them so I might not be a reliable witness in this regard.
With all seats deployed. The Q7 has virtually no boot space. The GL has a little more but it really is a little more. The GL's square roof/tailgate line helps if you have something taller but really to compare boot space of either in this configuration means you are looking in the wrong place.
Same applies to the XC90 really. The X5 has zero boot space with the rear seats in place. Similar for the D4.
The Pathfinder is interesting but I've only actually seen this one once and I don't even know if there is a 3rd row of seats or anything other than the 4-cyl engine option which is what's inside my colleague's. But it's huge - it must be as long as my GL and looks pretty tough. It's a more practical alternative to a pick-up with a fibreglass roof over the luggage bed.
There's nothing I can add in regard to the L322 that others haven't already covered.
The best driver's cars are the Cayenne and X5. Some engine variations of each are better than others. By comparison, the Mercs (ML and GL) drive like trucks but the Mercs can tow 3500Kg where only some configurations and ages of the others can.
The Mercs are good off road given decent tyres. They have strong gearboxes and 4WD systems if they are serviced properly. My GL has air suspension. Others do too but it's model dependent. Mine is height adjustable which has proven useful a couple of times but generally it's the plush ride that makes air suspension worthwhile. Yes, it can fail - I've replaced the compressor on mine - but I remain a fan regardless.
Mine also has centre and rear diff lockers, and a low range transfer case. I'm not sure if the newer GLs have any of this stuff. Mine's a 61-reg, so pretty old now.
The X5 and Q7 aren't bad off road either, again given the right tyres. I'm not talking rock crawling. Noone really does this but a practical application of what people use these for is towing 2-tonne horse boxes on slippery grass, mud or in the snow.
My friend's Q7 has rear wheel steering which is incredible. It seems to turn around in half the space my GL can.
I think if I needed to go off road more, I'd opt for the D4. The FFRR doesn't really stack up as a viable option to me - it's expensive to run and really needs an enthusiast's approach to maintenance. Greatest plushest ride of them all though.
The XC90 is my least favourite but that's because I've only tried the 5-cylinder diesel version which I found underpowered. I have not tried the V8 petrol ones and I suspect I might like it however it wouldn't make sense economically for me. I do like the "look" of the new XC90s more than any of the others though - I think Volvo have nailed the styling, especially in regard to the headlights.
A V8 Cayenne is hysterically fun to drive but expensive on the dinosaur juice. The 40D version of the X5 that my friend has pushes out over 300bhp and moves it along at a suitably indecent pace. Overall I think I prefer that over the others including my GL however we once had an X5 but it was stolen off our drive after only 6-weeks and left us with the feeling that BMWs made us vulnerable - they were being targeted and had been proven easy to take thanks to an easy OBD exploit.
Also, the GL... It's a zombie apocalypse vehicle. Goes everywhere. A 450 would be better than my 350 but they are just so rare I couldn't find any.
Will be brutally honest about the XC90, whilst we had an earlier model it never ever lived up to the famed reliability of Volvo's. Had a huge water leak take out the main electronics, and numerous other electrical issues. Drivetrain was solid however, never really needed anything in that department. Bear in mind it was a 2004, after 2007 the reliability did increase apparently, they changed gearboxes too. What wasn't nice was the torque limiting in 1st and 2nd gear (5-speed auto), only in 3rd gear would you get all the torque, of which there was a good amount. Ultimately a heavily aged design, used from 2002-2013.
As for the X5, take a look at the readers thread I have on ours, self-explanatory really.
As for the X5, take a look at the readers thread I have on ours, self-explanatory really.
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