Discussion
My daughter and family rent a place which has about 4 months till end of the current tenancy agreement. For reasons due to poor maintenance in the property by the landlord they do not wish to renew, in fact ideally they'd rather get out asap. I'm not saying the place is inhabitable but lots of corners have been cut and tradesmen are now refusing to work in this landlords properties.
We have a copy of the tenancy agreement obtained recently but the only e signatures are of my daughter and partner, the landlords e signature is not there. Is it possible he had e signed another copy where my daughters signatures are missing or would you expect all to be present 6+ months after it started?
Our best get out is if the landlord hasn't signed it then it's not legally binding but not sure if in electronic documents you'd expect to see all signatures on one doc.
Going down the route of poor maintenance will take months and they've seen a few suitable other places that are bigger than they currently have for similar money so would like out asap.
Not trying to shaft the landlord as originally they'd intended to stay quite a few years but that was before all the maintenance issues started surfacing
We have a copy of the tenancy agreement obtained recently but the only e signatures are of my daughter and partner, the landlords e signature is not there. Is it possible he had e signed another copy where my daughters signatures are missing or would you expect all to be present 6+ months after it started?
Our best get out is if the landlord hasn't signed it then it's not legally binding but not sure if in electronic documents you'd expect to see all signatures on one doc.
Going down the route of poor maintenance will take months and they've seen a few suitable other places that are bigger than they currently have for similar money so would like out asap.
Not trying to shaft the landlord as originally they'd intended to stay quite a few years but that was before all the maintenance issues started surfacing
Doubt you'd get away with having signed diff docs. A contract has been entered into by virtue of them providing a property and being paid. No small claim court is going to faff around with a signAture technicality imo.
Unless you haven't got basics like hot water or have been advised it's unsafe 4 months isn't that long...
Unless you haven't got basics like hot water or have been advised it's unsafe 4 months isn't that long...
meatballs said:
Doubt you'd get away with having signed diff docs. A contract has been entered into by virtue of them providing a property and being paid. No small claim court is going to faff around with a signAture technicality imo.
Unless you haven't got basics like hot water or have been advised it's unsafe 4 months isn't that long...
This is good advice. May well cause problems with previous landlord reference, which is becoming more important in these no fees for the tenant days if you leave with bad feelings.Unless you haven't got basics like hot water or have been advised it's unsafe 4 months isn't that long...
meatballs said:
Unless you haven't got basics like hot water or have been advised it's unsafe 4 months isn't that long...
They didn't when they first moved in. The boiler kept tripping out and in the end the landlord replaced it but they went 6 weeks with little to no heating and hot water when it was minus figures outside. Landlord flatly refused to give them a partial rebate of rent as well. We as a family had to supply them with fan heaters and they'd come to me for showers.That was the start of months of annoying troubles. They still have a leaking roof which they can see daylight through the ridge, not much is happening regards repair. In the meantime moisture is getting in and apart from the tops of walls showing water coming down when it rains there is also mould growing on the walls in places which initially was blamed on them causing too much condensation in the property.
This was a thread I started just after they moved in https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
This is why they just want out.
Edited by solo2 on Wednesday 19th June 11:37
Four months - can they hang on until the tenancy agreement is up then they can go.
One question for everyone; if you have to give two months notice (say), can you give this two months before your agreement ends, or do you have to wait until it has ceased? This will make a difference to the OP as they can start to plan for the next place now, if the answer is the former.
One question for everyone; if you have to give two months notice (say), can you give this two months before your agreement ends, or do you have to wait until it has ceased? This will make a difference to the OP as they can start to plan for the next place now, if the answer is the former.
solo2 said:
They didn't when they first moved in. The boiler kept tripping out and in the end the landlord replaced it but they went 6 weeks with little to no heating and hot water when it was minus figures outside. Landlord flatly refused to give them a partial rebate of rent as well. We as a family had to supply them with fan heaters and they'd come to me for showers.
That was the start of months of annoying troubles. They still have a leaking roof which they can see daylight through the ridge, not much is happening regards repair. In the meantime moisture is getting in and apart from the tops of walls showing water coming down when it rains there is also mould growing on the walls in places which initially was blamed on them causing too much condensation in the property.
This was a thread I started just after they moved in https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
This is why they just want out.
In the interim they could report the issues to the Environmental Health dept of their local council who can force the landlord to do certain things.That was the start of months of annoying troubles. They still have a leaking roof which they can see daylight through the ridge, not much is happening regards repair. In the meantime moisture is getting in and apart from the tops of walls showing water coming down when it rains there is also mould growing on the walls in places which initially was blamed on them causing too much condensation in the property.
This was a thread I started just after they moved in https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
This is why they just want out.
Edited by solo2 on Wednesday 19th June 11:37
selym said:
Four months - can they hang on until the tenancy agreement is up then they can go.
One question for everyone; if you have to give two months notice (say), can you give this two months before your agreement ends, or do you have to wait until it has ceased? This will make a difference to the OP as they can start to plan for the next place now, if the answer is the former.
They can give notice at any point. Nothing to stop them giving notice now effective the date the tenancy ends. One question for everyone; if you have to give two months notice (say), can you give this two months before your agreement ends, or do you have to wait until it has ceased? This will make a difference to the OP as they can start to plan for the next place now, if the answer is the former.
nikaiyo2 said:
They can give notice at any point. Nothing to stop them giving notice now effective the date the tenancy ends.
Yeah, that makes sense - should have though about it before putting finger to keyboard. I'd be doing that then, setting up to be in somewhere else on day 1 after the tenancy agreement ends.We're due to hear if the landlord wishes to renew the tenancy in the next week or two and what he wants to charge. Curiously enough we are keen to hear what he says because we think he will not wish to renew. They've been good tenants but have had to report a lot of issues so feel they think we are trouble.
If only the property had been correctly maintained they'd have not heard from us for the duration and we'd have been happy to renew. Still, I hope we can find them a better place for similar money instead. They viewed a place today which they really liked and was twice the size of their current place but this landlord only wants a year let and they would ideally like to find somewhere they can stay for many years. No one wants to move every year
If only the property had been correctly maintained they'd have not heard from us for the duration and we'd have been happy to renew. Still, I hope we can find them a better place for similar money instead. They viewed a place today which they really liked and was twice the size of their current place but this landlord only wants a year let and they would ideally like to find somewhere they can stay for many years. No one wants to move every year
solo2 said:
They didn't when they first moved in. The boiler kept tripping out and in the end the landlord replaced it but they went 6 weeks with little to no heating and hot water when it was minus figures outside. Landlord flatly refused to give them a partial rebate of rent as well. We as a family had to supply them with fan heaters and they'd come to me for showers.
It does suck, they would have had a few remedies at the time such as fixing it themselves and withholding the cost but landlords can still make life difficult even if you do it all properly. Not sure you can withold it retrospectively such as claiming electricity costs and a rebate for 6 weeks no heating - you'd probably need specialist advice and probably not worth it now.Edited by solo2 on Wednesday 19th June 11:37
You could go that route for the roof, especially if it's affecting their enjoyment of the property but again you really need to make sure you've got evidence of informing he landlord, getting a number of reasonable quotes in writing etc.
Shelter has a lot of good advice on their website covering this
https://england.shelter.org.uk/housing_advice/repa...
About getting compo:
https://england.shelter.org.uk/housing_advice/repa...
I'd definitely leave it till after they have left though.
https://england.shelter.org.uk/housing_advice/repa...
I'd definitely leave it till after they have left though.
solo2 said:
We're due to hear if the landlord wishes to renew the tenancy in the next week or two and what he wants to charge. Curiously enough we are keen to hear what he says because we think he will not wish to renew. They've been good tenants but have had to report a lot of issues so feel they think we are trouble.
The LL might not want to renew as it is FAR easier to sort major dilapidations with an empty property.It’s not necessarily the LL punishing a tenant that is “trouble.”
meatballs said:
About getting compo:
https://england.shelter.org.uk/housing_advice/repa...
I'd definitely leave it till after they have left though.
No longer interested in compo, just want to find them a nice well maintained place that they can stay in for circa the next 3/5 years. Hence starting to look at the sort of thing that is available now at their budget and hoping they can find somewhere that they can move to without major dramas.https://england.shelter.org.uk/housing_advice/repa...
I'd definitely leave it till after they have left though.
I wish I'd won even a fraction of that Euromillions money, I could buy them a 3 bed place and then it would be within our control to keep the place in good order.
you might want to check that the following were attached to the AST
EPC
Gas safety
How to rent Booklet
if any have been left off(i think) you will be awarded 3 x the deposit......no discussions just happens
also he cannot serve a S21 without the extra docs in place
I don't do lettings but remember our lettings manager telling me all this.....do some research with shelter or similar
On it not being signed, as the landlord as long as my copy has tenants signature I can add mine later
EPC
Gas safety
How to rent Booklet
if any have been left off(i think) you will be awarded 3 x the deposit......no discussions just happens
also he cannot serve a S21 without the extra docs in place
I don't do lettings but remember our lettings manager telling me all this.....do some research with shelter or similar
On it not being signed, as the landlord as long as my copy has tenants signature I can add mine later
Rangeroverover said:
you might want to check that the following were attached to the AST
EPC
Gas safety
How to rent Booklet
if any have been left off(i think) you will be awarded 3 x the deposit......no discussions just happens
also he cannot serve a S21 without the extra docs in place
I don't do lettings but remember our lettings manager telling me all this.....do some research with shelter or similar
On it not being signed, as the landlord as long as my copy has tenants signature I can add mine later
Probably just as wellEPC
Gas safety
How to rent Booklet
if any have been left off(i think) you will be awarded 3 x the deposit......no discussions just happens
also he cannot serve a S21 without the extra docs in place
I don't do lettings but remember our lettings manager telling me all this.....do some research with shelter or similar
On it not being signed, as the landlord as long as my copy has tenants signature I can add mine later
selym said:
Four months - can they hang on until the tenancy agreement is up then they can go.
One question for everyone; if you have to give two months notice (say), can you give this two months before your agreement ends, or do you have to wait until it has ceased? This will make a difference to the OP as they can start to plan for the next place now, if the answer is the former.
Tenant/s are required to serve one month Notice, therefore if the fixed term of a tenancy ends on 24 September 2019, then the above Notice must be served on or before 23 August 2019.One question for everyone; if you have to give two months notice (say), can you give this two months before your agreement ends, or do you have to wait until it has ceased? This will make a difference to the OP as they can start to plan for the next place now, if the answer is the former.
A landlord has to serve on a tenant/s two months Notice, so in the above example, the landlord's Notice must be served on or before 23 July 2019.
In the OP's daughter's case, I believe it is rather belated in the day to start complaining via EH about repair issues that took place in October, particularly when the fixed term of the tenancy only has a few months to run, and they are not looking to renew the tenancy.
If you want out earlier there may be a way via a negotiation.
I was in a similar situation with a damp riddled flat a few years ago (thread on here somewhere). I basically gave him an ultimatum, I leave on x date, I get deposit back in full, else I’ll be going to environmental health and claiming for all accommodation fees etc....
He agreed, then took another months rent on the day I left...a DD charge-back saw me get 2 months rent back which near-covered my initial tenancy fees and some damage to personal possessions (mould spread from walls)
I was in a similar situation with a damp riddled flat a few years ago (thread on here somewhere). I basically gave him an ultimatum, I leave on x date, I get deposit back in full, else I’ll be going to environmental health and claiming for all accommodation fees etc....
He agreed, then took another months rent on the day I left...a DD charge-back saw me get 2 months rent back which near-covered my initial tenancy fees and some damage to personal possessions (mould spread from walls)
solo2 said:
They didn't when they first moved in. The boiler kept tripping out and in the end the landlord replaced it but they went 6 weeks with little to no heating and hot water when it was minus figures outside. Landlord flatly refused to give them a partial rebate of rent as well. We as a family had to supply them with fan heaters and they'd come to me for showers.
That was the start of months of annoying troubles. They still have a leaking roof which they can see daylight through the ridge, not much is happening regards repair. In the meantime moisture is getting in and apart from the tops of walls showing water coming down when it rains there is also mould growing on the walls in places which initially was blamed on them causing too much condensation in the property.
This was a thread I started just after they moved in https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
This is why they just want out.
You didn’t mention anything at all about the boiler issues in the other thread. Strange thing to miss out yet complain about a musty smell in the flat. That was the start of months of annoying troubles. They still have a leaking roof which they can see daylight through the ridge, not much is happening regards repair. In the meantime moisture is getting in and apart from the tops of walls showing water coming down when it rains there is also mould growing on the walls in places which initially was blamed on them causing too much condensation in the property.
This was a thread I started just after they moved in https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
This is why they just want out.
Edited by solo2 on Wednesday 19th June 11:37
Lindun said:
solo2 said:
They didn't when they first moved in. The boiler kept tripping out and in the end the landlord replaced it but they went 6 weeks with little to no heating and hot water when it was minus figures outside. Landlord flatly refused to give them a partial rebate of rent as well. We as a family had to supply them with fan heaters and they'd come to me for showers.
That was the start of months of annoying troubles. They still have a leaking roof which they can see daylight through the ridge, not much is happening regards repair. In the meantime moisture is getting in and apart from the tops of walls showing water coming down when it rains there is also mould growing on the walls in places which initially was blamed on them causing too much condensation in the property.
This was a thread I started just after they moved in https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
This is why they just want out.
You didn’t mention anything at all about the boiler issues in the other thread. Strange thing to miss out yet complain about a musty smell in the flat. That was the start of months of annoying troubles. They still have a leaking roof which they can see daylight through the ridge, not much is happening regards repair. In the meantime moisture is getting in and apart from the tops of walls showing water coming down when it rains there is also mould growing on the walls in places which initially was blamed on them causing too much condensation in the property.
This was a thread I started just after they moved in https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
This is why they just want out.
Edited by solo2 on Wednesday 19th June 11:37
Good advice posted by Kiethton, with most reasonable landlords allowing a disgruntle tenant/s to vacate their tenancy early. This landlord has often allowed tenants to surrender their tenancy early, mainly due to tenant's relocation of employment, unemployment or where a relationship between tenants has broken down.
Being a flat, with some of the repair works you describe, being roof works etc. the flat therefore may be leasehold, thereby the landlord might not have control over the repair date for the roof.
If the landlord will not agree to the OP's daughter early surrender of the tenancy, then contacting the local council's Environmental Health and/or the local council Private Housing Officer, the same might help to protect and/or prevent the landlord deducting monies from the tenant's/daughter's Deposit.
Being a flat, with some of the repair works you describe, being roof works etc. the flat therefore may be leasehold, thereby the landlord might not have control over the repair date for the roof.
If the landlord will not agree to the OP's daughter early surrender of the tenancy, then contacting the local council's Environmental Health and/or the local council Private Housing Officer, the same might help to protect and/or prevent the landlord deducting monies from the tenant's/daughter's Deposit.
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