CCTV in office toilets? Legal?
Discussion
Hi folks
But if a strange one here. BiL works for a small ish company, run by 3 guys. An MD, SD and FD, built the business up together from scratch, got it to £10m+ validation and currently undergoing due diligence for a possible sale.
They have an annual summer party at their offices every August BH weekend and it was Saturday night. Evidently a couple of the sales staff (1 male 1 female) have been making eyes at each other for a while and decided they couldn’t hold back their lust any longer and got at it in the disabled toilets.
Evidently a few of the drunk crew were ‘overhearing not listening’ outside the window and the FD turned the corner to witness the gathering. He promptly waited outside the toilet door until they emerged and told them both to leave, pending a 9am Tuesday to discuss.
At the party, BiL says the SD was raging. Not happy that this disciplinary might need to be declared during due diligence etc. Anyway, in his own drunken state he declares loudly he will have the cctv company in first thing today to add a camera in the disabled toilets!! His reasoning being that it’s never used by anyone in the office, they NEVER have visitors and it should be out of bounds anyway. So far it’s only been used for this couple and their romantic liaison.
Now I’m certain he can’t legally do that. What say those in the know?
But if a strange one here. BiL works for a small ish company, run by 3 guys. An MD, SD and FD, built the business up together from scratch, got it to £10m+ validation and currently undergoing due diligence for a possible sale.
They have an annual summer party at their offices every August BH weekend and it was Saturday night. Evidently a couple of the sales staff (1 male 1 female) have been making eyes at each other for a while and decided they couldn’t hold back their lust any longer and got at it in the disabled toilets.
Evidently a few of the drunk crew were ‘overhearing not listening’ outside the window and the FD turned the corner to witness the gathering. He promptly waited outside the toilet door until they emerged and told them both to leave, pending a 9am Tuesday to discuss.
At the party, BiL says the SD was raging. Not happy that this disciplinary might need to be declared during due diligence etc. Anyway, in his own drunken state he declares loudly he will have the cctv company in first thing today to add a camera in the disabled toilets!! His reasoning being that it’s never used by anyone in the office, they NEVER have visitors and it should be out of bounds anyway. So far it’s only been used for this couple and their romantic liaison.
Now I’m certain he can’t legally do that. What say those in the know?
It's only an issue if he makes it an issue. Will he declare that he allowed drinking to excess on company property ?
He should be told to grow up and forget the whole thing. he should also be reminded that videoing people in toilets will land him on the sex offenders register.
Sounds like a dick.
He should be told to grow up and forget the whole thing. he should also be reminded that videoing people in toilets will land him on the sex offenders register.
Sounds like a dick.
It might be legal in some parts of the world, but I can't imagine it is in the UK. Pretty sure you have an expectation of privacy in a toilet if if it's hardly ever used. It would be ironic if a site visit from the purchaser was carried out by an individual who needed those facilities (with camera on the wall).
All seems like an over reaction. Surely a quiet word to keep their liaisons off company property would be enough.
All seems like an over reaction. Surely a quiet word to keep their liaisons off company property would be enough.
The short answer is yes - but only as a last resort.
Surveillance Camera Code of Practice states you must only use CCTV in an area which would normally require privacy such as a toilet only if there is a real risk to the public or employees safety or if there may be serious criminality occurring etc.
CCTV used in such locations must be justified and then reviewed on a regular basis. Access to the data must also be restricted.
Given this is a one off event I highly doubt it would be considered reasonable to install a camera. If they did you could make a complaint to the relevant authority and they would then need to justify it. The business would also have to show they have done other things first which have not worked.
Surveillance Camera Code of Practice states you must only use CCTV in an area which would normally require privacy such as a toilet only if there is a real risk to the public or employees safety or if there may be serious criminality occurring etc.
CCTV used in such locations must be justified and then reviewed on a regular basis. Access to the data must also be restricted.
Given this is a one off event I highly doubt it would be considered reasonable to install a camera. If they did you could make a complaint to the relevant authority and they would then need to justify it. The business would also have to show they have done other things first which have not worked.
red_slr said:
The short answer is yes - but only as a last resort.
Surveillance Camera Code of Practice states you must only use CCTV in an area which would normally require privacy such as a toilet only if there is a real risk to the public or employees safety or if there may be serious criminality occurring etc.
CCTV used in such locations must be justified and then reviewed on a regular basis. Access to the data must also be restricted.
Given this is a one off event I highly doubt it would be considered reasonable to install a camera. If they did you could make a complaint to the relevant authority and they would then need to justify it. The business would also have to show they have done other things first which have not worked.
But ‘Code of Practice’ does not equal legality/illegality.Surveillance Camera Code of Practice states you must only use CCTV in an area which would normally require privacy such as a toilet only if there is a real risk to the public or employees safety or if there may be serious criminality occurring etc.
CCTV used in such locations must be justified and then reviewed on a regular basis. Access to the data must also be restricted.
Given this is a one off event I highly doubt it would be considered reasonable to install a camera. If they did you could make a complaint to the relevant authority and they would then need to justify it. The business would also have to show they have done other things first which have not worked.
Pica-Pica said:
red_slr said:
The short answer is yes - but only as a last resort.
Surveillance Camera Code of Practice states you must only use CCTV in an area which would normally require privacy such as a toilet only if there is a real risk to the public or employees safety or if there may be serious criminality occurring etc.
CCTV used in such locations must be justified and then reviewed on a regular basis. Access to the data must also be restricted.
Given this is a one off event I highly doubt it would be considered reasonable to install a camera. If they did you could make a complaint to the relevant authority and they would then need to justify it. The business would also have to show they have done other things first which have not worked.
But ‘Code of Practice’ does not equal legality/illegality.Surveillance Camera Code of Practice states you must only use CCTV in an area which would normally require privacy such as a toilet only if there is a real risk to the public or employees safety or if there may be serious criminality occurring etc.
CCTV used in such locations must be justified and then reviewed on a regular basis. Access to the data must also be restricted.
Given this is a one off event I highly doubt it would be considered reasonable to install a camera. If they did you could make a complaint to the relevant authority and they would then need to justify it. The business would also have to show they have done other things first which have not worked.
Under the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012 public bodies and government MUST adhere to the Surveillance Camera Code of Practice when using overt CCTV equipment. The vast majority of CCTV companies will also do so.
The rules for private use are different.
jshell said:
At my last employer, huge company, 'getting it on' on company property was a swift, irreversible exit move!
Yes I would imagine its a displinary issue, HOWERVER the company provided alcohol on the premesis. The company needs to be careful as that is a defence in a tirbunal. Thanks folks
Saw the brother in law again earlier. The Chap has indeed had the cctv company round immediately, and they were there by lunchtime installing a camera, but only in the stairwell where the door to said toilet is clearly visible.
So, either he calmed down sufficiently to see sense or indeed the cctv people have advised him he can’t actually put it in the toilet.
No official word on the two sales folk. The chap came in and had his sit down and was immediately dispatched back to he sales meetings, the lady didn’t show up in the office. Whether she had her discussion yesterday, or just couldn’t face the embarrassment, nobody knows.
Saw the brother in law again earlier. The Chap has indeed had the cctv company round immediately, and they were there by lunchtime installing a camera, but only in the stairwell where the door to said toilet is clearly visible.
So, either he calmed down sufficiently to see sense or indeed the cctv people have advised him he can’t actually put it in the toilet.
No official word on the two sales folk. The chap came in and had his sit down and was immediately dispatched back to he sales meetings, the lady didn’t show up in the office. Whether she had her discussion yesterday, or just couldn’t face the embarrassment, nobody knows.
Steviesam said:
I might be a bit old fashioned, but whats the issue with someone having a shag in a toilet at work?
They didnt harm anyone (except themselves).
Cant believe its a sackable offence!
SOP where I used to work although a few people took it too far on occasion. (booking meeting rooms, shagging in the fire escape etc)They didnt harm anyone (except themselves).
Cant believe its a sackable offence!
This was late 90s early 2000s though ... I mean you cant just "book" a meeting room these days, you need your cost centre and a purchase order which takes 10-14 days to raise and then management sign off... oh and a risk assessment followed by a "manual handling" course.
MOBB said:
Steviesam said:
I might be a bit old fashioned, but whats the issue with someone having a shag in a toilet at work?
They didnt harm anyone (except themselves).
Cant believe its a sackable offence!
Different times mate, different times......................They didnt harm anyone (except themselves).
Cant believe its a sackable offence!
You are allowed to listen outside like a bunch of voyeuristic schoolboys though.
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