Are Fiat 500 1.2's OK a city cars?
Discussion
My wife wants a small buzzy city car to replace her venerable Clio. Budget 5 - 7k. 2,000 miles a year of very short London hops. Simplicity and low cost are priorities along with a sunroof and decent trim level. Low emissions handy as I'm near the existing ULEZ zone and will be inside the new one. And I already have a V8 Merc for turning money into noise.
I popped into the local car supermarket yesterday and concluded that there are lots of 1.2's about. Are they any good in a bounce-the-valves-off-the-bonnet Italian supermini way?
Or should I be looking at a Twinair? Or a Twinair 105? Or an earlier 1.4?
Any advice or guidance appreciated.
I popped into the local car supermarket yesterday and concluded that there are lots of 1.2's about. Are they any good in a bounce-the-valves-off-the-bonnet Italian supermini way?
Or should I be looking at a Twinair? Or a Twinair 105? Or an earlier 1.4?
Any advice or guidance appreciated.
Stay away from the twin air they like a drink of oil and it has to be the correct type. The 1.2 is pretty bulletproof ( an updated engine all the way from the 80's) and parts if needed are very cheap. Just check the exterior door handle work properly as they have a small clip inside that causes the handle to drop, not the end of the world (about £15 to fit) but a right pita to do.
A500leroy said:
Stay away from the twin air they like a drink of oil and it has to be the correct type. The 1.2 is pretty bulletproof ( an updated engine all the way from the 80's) and parts if needed are very cheap. Just check the exterior door handle work properly as they have a small clip inside that causes the handle to drop, not the end of the world (about £15 to fit) but a right pita to do.
Thanks!I guess I'd better drive a 1.2 then.
I'm vaguely worried it might feel a little underpowered compared to the outgoing (1.6) Clio. In power to weight ratio the 1.4 is closer.
But then again, there's nothing more fun than rowing a zingy little Italian car around. I had a 128 3P back in the day and that went all the way to 7,200 plus a number of Sud's etc etc.
FWIW went to the local car supermarket to initially assess MINI's and 500's. Conclusion; those MINI are bloaters! And it's much easier to get into the back of a 500. 500 wins. Shorter, narrower, lighter, easier to use.
I have recently had a 500 1.2 and a Panda 1.2 as courtesy cars whilst my Abarth was in for a few bits. Chalk and cheese different surprisingly between the two and I much much preferred the Panda which I didn’t expect to.
The Panda seemed nippier (lighter perhaps), better driving position, better gear change and a much more resolved ride. So good I’m on the look out for one for winter. I certainly wouldn’t be paying 1k more for a similar age/spec 500 over one unless you love/loathe the styling of one over the other.
Very plastic inside but much more roomy as well.
Going to try for a 100hp sporting which would be a good match weight and power wise to your Clio? Much less choice available though.
1.2 had a comical amount of body roll, so again I’m hoping a sporting will be tighter.
The Panda seemed nippier (lighter perhaps), better driving position, better gear change and a much more resolved ride. So good I’m on the look out for one for winter. I certainly wouldn’t be paying 1k more for a similar age/spec 500 over one unless you love/loathe the styling of one over the other.
Very plastic inside but much more roomy as well.
Going to try for a 100hp sporting which would be a good match weight and power wise to your Clio? Much less choice available though.
1.2 had a comical amount of body roll, so again I’m hoping a sporting will be tighter.
Edited by Gmlgml on Monday 30th September 15:17
Edited by Gmlgml on Monday 30th September 15:17
A500leroy said:
Also dont discount the panda, its the same as a 500 just with rear doors if thats important to you, and usually a thousand cheaper than the equivalent 500 ( i use a 1200 panda as my daily)
I'd much rather have a Panda! Most mornings my wife me & two others at the tube. But the OH doesn't like the look of them. I do!!Gmlgml said:
I have recently had a 500 1.2 and a Panda 1.2 as courtesy cars whilst my Abarth was in for a few bits. Chalk and cheese different surprisingly between the two and I much much preferred the Panda which I didn’t expect to.
The Panda seemed nippier (lighter perhaps), better driving position, better gear change and a much more resolved ride. So good I’m on the look out for one for winter. I certainly wouldn’t be paying 1k more for a similar age/spec 500 over one unless you love/loathe the styling of one over the other.
Very plastic inside but much more roomy as well.
Going to try for a 100hp sporting which would be a good match weight and power wise to your Clio? Much less choice available though.
1.2 had a comical amount of body roll, so again I’m hoping a sporting will be tighter.
I'd have a 100bhp in a shot.The Panda seemed nippier (lighter perhaps), better driving position, better gear change and a much more resolved ride. So good I’m on the look out for one for winter. I certainly wouldn’t be paying 1k more for a similar age/spec 500 over one unless you love/loathe the styling of one over the other.
Very plastic inside but much more roomy as well.
Going to try for a 100hp sporting which would be a good match weight and power wise to your Clio? Much less choice available though.
1.2 had a comical amount of body roll, so again I’m hoping a sporting will be tighter.
This is also related to the 500 (engine, drivetrain and chassis ) but i dont know anything more about them other than they are also five dr.
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
A500leroy said:
This is also related to the 500 (engine, drivetrain and chassis ) but i dont know anything more about them other than they are also five dr.
https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
LOL leftfield 😀https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201...
I'll suggest it to the Mrs. Bet she still says she wants a 500 though.
AC43 said:
BlackTails said:
We have one of those (the Lounge, with the dualogic gearbox).
Ideal for city nipping around with only one caveat. The ride is a bit harsh.
Ah OK. Will try one. Hopefully not as bad as MINIs. I tried one of them and had to take speedbumps at walking pace. Ideal for city nipping around with only one caveat. The ride is a bit harsh.
I can see your path ending with an Abarth if that's what you're after.
BlackTails said:
AC43 said:
BlackTails said:
We have one of those (the Lounge, with the dualogic gearbox).
Ideal for city nipping around with only one caveat. The ride is a bit harsh.
Ah OK. Will try one. Hopefully not as bad as MINIs. I tried one of them and had to take speedbumps at walking pace. Ideal for city nipping around with only one caveat. The ride is a bit harsh.
I can see your path ending with an Abarth if that's what you're after.
That's why I originally thought of getting a 1.4 500. On paper it's got similar acceleration to the Clio.
The added bonus is that 1.4's are now older and cheaper. For something doing 2,000 miles a year I guess it doesn't really matter. Neither of us are bothered about number plates/status.
The other non-Abarth alternative would be a 105 Twinair but they seem rare. And they're more highly stressed with a turbo to go wrong and so on.
I guess at the end of the day I'm looking for a good old fashioned warm hatch. Kind of like the Fiat equivalent of the non-S MINI Cooper. Or a 306 XS. That sort of thing
Edited by AC43 on Monday 30th September 20:02
Just did a bit more research; the 85bhp Twinair did sound to me like it might be a bit weedy but I didn't realise that it's got 107 lb/ft of torque.
And according to one review low 1st & 2nd gears to launch it off the line. And then a much higher 3rd for the rest of the time in town.
I've just remembered that some friends down the road have one - I must ask if I can give it quick drive round the block.
Clarkson, Evo, everyone was raving about the Twinair when it was launched
https://www.evo.co.uk/fiat/500/6869/fiat-500-twina...
https://www.carmagazine.co.uk/car-reviews/fiat/fia...
https://www.driving.co.uk/car-reviews/the-clarkson...
And according to one review low 1st & 2nd gears to launch it off the line. And then a much higher 3rd for the rest of the time in town.
I've just remembered that some friends down the road have one - I must ask if I can give it quick drive round the block.
Clarkson, Evo, everyone was raving about the Twinair when it was launched
https://www.evo.co.uk/fiat/500/6869/fiat-500-twina...
https://www.carmagazine.co.uk/car-reviews/fiat/fia...
https://www.driving.co.uk/car-reviews/the-clarkson...
AC43 said:
Just did a bit more research; the 85bhp Twinair did sound to me like it might be a bit weedy but I didn't realise that it's got 107 lb/ft of torque.
And according to one review low 1st & 2nd gears to launch it off the line. And then a much higher 3rd for the rest of the time in town.
I've just remembered that some friends down the road have one - I must ask if I can give it quick drive round the block.
Clarkson, Evo, everyone was raving about the Twinair when it was launched
https://www.evo.co.uk/fiat/500/6869/fiat-500-twina...
https://www.carmagazine.co.uk/car-reviews/fiat/fia...
https://www.driving.co.uk/car-reviews/the-clarkson...
youll regret it... They also like to eat spark plugs!And according to one review low 1st & 2nd gears to launch it off the line. And then a much higher 3rd for the rest of the time in town.
I've just remembered that some friends down the road have one - I must ask if I can give it quick drive round the block.
Clarkson, Evo, everyone was raving about the Twinair when it was launched
https://www.evo.co.uk/fiat/500/6869/fiat-500-twina...
https://www.carmagazine.co.uk/car-reviews/fiat/fia...
https://www.driving.co.uk/car-reviews/the-clarkson...
A500leroy said:
AC43 said:
Just did a bit more research; the 85bhp Twinair did sound to me like it might be a bit weedy but I didn't realise that it's got 107 lb/ft of torque.
And according to one review low 1st & 2nd gears to launch it off the line. And then a much higher 3rd for the rest of the time in town.
I've just remembered that some friends down the road have one - I must ask if I can give it quick drive round the block.
Clarkson, Evo, everyone was raving about the Twinair when it was launched
https://www.evo.co.uk/fiat/500/6869/fiat-500-twina...
https://www.carmagazine.co.uk/car-reviews/fiat/fia...
https://www.driving.co.uk/car-reviews/the-clarkson...
youll regret it... They also like to eat spark plugs!And according to one review low 1st & 2nd gears to launch it off the line. And then a much higher 3rd for the rest of the time in town.
I've just remembered that some friends down the road have one - I must ask if I can give it quick drive round the block.
Clarkson, Evo, everyone was raving about the Twinair when it was launched
https://www.evo.co.uk/fiat/500/6869/fiat-500-twina...
https://www.carmagazine.co.uk/car-reviews/fiat/fia...
https://www.driving.co.uk/car-reviews/the-clarkson...
To be fair she chose her Clio and that's been like a cockroach.
But people in the trade since when I mention Minis and 500s......
I had one for 4 years from new, a 1.2 Lounge
I have to say I really liked it .. it was pretty nippy if you drove it Alitalia stylee
As a town runabout it’s ideal and nothing went wrong with it
For what we used it for I’m glad I didn’t pay extra for the twinair
Economy wise it did mid 40’s iirc and combined with cheap tax and a cheap annual service it was painless to own
I’d recommend but it is really only a 2 seater or 2+2 for short journeys
I have to say I really liked it .. it was pretty nippy if you drove it Alitalia stylee

As a town runabout it’s ideal and nothing went wrong with it
For what we used it for I’m glad I didn’t pay extra for the twinair
Economy wise it did mid 40’s iirc and combined with cheap tax and a cheap annual service it was painless to own
I’d recommend but it is really only a 2 seater or 2+2 for short journeys
Earthdweller said:
I had one for 4 years from new, a 1.2 Lounge
I have to say I really liked it .. it was pretty nippy if you drove it Alitalia stylee
As a town runabout it’s ideal and nothing went wrong with it
For what we used it for I’m glad I didn’t pay extra for the twinair
Economy wise it did mid 40’s iirc and combined with cheap tax and a cheap annual service it was painless to own
I’d recommend but it is really only a 2 seater or 2+2 for short journeys
Thanks that's encouraging. Longest regular journey 4 up will be from house to tube station. 4 minutes.I have to say I really liked it .. it was pretty nippy if you drove it Alitalia stylee

As a town runabout it’s ideal and nothing went wrong with it
For what we used it for I’m glad I didn’t pay extra for the twinair
Economy wise it did mid 40’s iirc and combined with cheap tax and a cheap annual service it was painless to own
I’d recommend but it is really only a 2 seater or 2+2 for short journeys
More often it'll be 1 or 2 up.
Like I say for anything more arduous there's an E Class on the drive.
A car that may fit the OP's wife's criteria is the current generation Renault Twingo.
I had one as a hire car last week and completely fell for it. When I picked it up at Toulouse Airport my first reaction before driving it was disappointment but after 6 days of driving mostly flat out through the Pyrenees into Spain I was enchanted.
I hire small hatchbacks fairly regularly and most are very competent but about as interesting as a fridge or washing machine. The Twingo was so different.
Being rear engined RWD the weight distribution 45 / 55 front to rear instead of the normal 70 /30 gave the car a much more neutral handling balance and although the steering is light and low geared it was great fun in the twisty bits.
The engine in mine was the base 69 bhp 1000cc which loved to rev and rev and sounded great with its 3 cylinder thrum coming from behind. The car only weighs around 860kg so performance was adequate. There is a 900cc turbo version with 89bhp or the Renault Sport GT with 109bhp if you need something faster.
As a city car I can think of none better. The Twingo is quite softly sprung so the ride around town is very good. Visibility is excellent and being rear engined the turning circle is hilariously small. My daily driver is an Abarth 595c (which I also love and why I'm on this forum!) but the Twingo is quite a bit more spacious for 4 people plus has 4 doors.
All in all, I found the Twingo full of charm and character and you can't say that about many cars these days. Thinking about it, the Twingo is actually closer in spirit to the original Fiat 500 than the current Fiat 500 is!
I had one as a hire car last week and completely fell for it. When I picked it up at Toulouse Airport my first reaction before driving it was disappointment but after 6 days of driving mostly flat out through the Pyrenees into Spain I was enchanted.
I hire small hatchbacks fairly regularly and most are very competent but about as interesting as a fridge or washing machine. The Twingo was so different.
Being rear engined RWD the weight distribution 45 / 55 front to rear instead of the normal 70 /30 gave the car a much more neutral handling balance and although the steering is light and low geared it was great fun in the twisty bits.
The engine in mine was the base 69 bhp 1000cc which loved to rev and rev and sounded great with its 3 cylinder thrum coming from behind. The car only weighs around 860kg so performance was adequate. There is a 900cc turbo version with 89bhp or the Renault Sport GT with 109bhp if you need something faster.
As a city car I can think of none better. The Twingo is quite softly sprung so the ride around town is very good. Visibility is excellent and being rear engined the turning circle is hilariously small. My daily driver is an Abarth 595c (which I also love and why I'm on this forum!) but the Twingo is quite a bit more spacious for 4 people plus has 4 doors.
All in all, I found the Twingo full of charm and character and you can't say that about many cars these days. Thinking about it, the Twingo is actually closer in spirit to the original Fiat 500 than the current Fiat 500 is!
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