What TB? M Coupe, M3 CSL or E34 M5
Discussion
I'm in the process of selling my TVR Griffith 500, I plan to replace it with a BMW. I have Three Alfa's so need to mix in some different blood to the garage, as tempting as another Alfa is.
My question, what is the best car to buy now. Principal purpose is fun and usability, preferably without haemoraging money on resale.
My budget is 20-25K cash, maybe 40K with finance or loans.
I'm pretty set on an Mcoupe. I've been to look at two and loved the way they drove, love the look, the way they drove, on my mind a lot right now.
Thats top of my list.
I'm happy to go for a higher mileage one and as long as the body is sound do some work here and there. Values seem to have softened (as has my TVR!!!) and prices range from 17-35K.
I'm thinking of a nice S50 that is sound but with a little work to do maybe 22k on a private sale, or stretch to a high mile S54 for about 30k privately.
Far too many garage queen M Coupe's out there IMHO, I looked at a 60K mile MCoupe with 11 year old tyres on it that had done about 2k miles in the last 5 years.
M3 CSL values also seem to have dropped, 42K looks like it might get a usable higher miles car to enjoy?
Has anyone owned both??? Is the CSL worth pushing the boat out for? I think the MCoupe has the crazy looks and most of all manual gearboc going for it, but the CSL is probably something else to drive???
And an E34 M5 is the long shot, I love the looks and the idea that they were the last of the hand assmbled M car, but for sheer laughs and driving involvement I think one would be behind the other two??
BTW daily drive is a Giulia Quad so I want something a bit analogue/old school (but more usable than the TVR), needs to be a manual arguably...
Edited: This post is after the author has had a couple of glasses of wine so please excuse the spelling and or repetative nature of the text.
My question, what is the best car to buy now. Principal purpose is fun and usability, preferably without haemoraging money on resale.
My budget is 20-25K cash, maybe 40K with finance or loans.
I'm pretty set on an Mcoupe. I've been to look at two and loved the way they drove, love the look, the way they drove, on my mind a lot right now.
Thats top of my list.
I'm happy to go for a higher mileage one and as long as the body is sound do some work here and there. Values seem to have softened (as has my TVR!!!) and prices range from 17-35K.
I'm thinking of a nice S50 that is sound but with a little work to do maybe 22k on a private sale, or stretch to a high mile S54 for about 30k privately.
Far too many garage queen M Coupe's out there IMHO, I looked at a 60K mile MCoupe with 11 year old tyres on it that had done about 2k miles in the last 5 years.
M3 CSL values also seem to have dropped, 42K looks like it might get a usable higher miles car to enjoy?
Has anyone owned both??? Is the CSL worth pushing the boat out for? I think the MCoupe has the crazy looks and most of all manual gearboc going for it, but the CSL is probably something else to drive???
And an E34 M5 is the long shot, I love the looks and the idea that they were the last of the hand assmbled M car, but for sheer laughs and driving involvement I think one would be behind the other two??
BTW daily drive is a Giulia Quad so I want something a bit analogue/old school (but more usable than the TVR), needs to be a manual arguably...
Edited: This post is after the author has had a couple of glasses of wine so please excuse the spelling and or repetative nature of the text.
Edited by urquattroGus on Wednesday 16th October 19:33
Edited by urquattroGus on Wednesday 16th October 19:40
For 20-25K you could get yourself behind the wheel of a 2AT, there's a few in the dealers at the mo.. I've had one before but moved back to 'The 1' but still miss that almost-Range Rover feeling of the 2AT.
When I was in catching up with one of the senior sales execs at my local BM brand showroom the other day I was very tempted to move-on 'The 1' and go back to a 2, they were really offering some awesome deals, especially if, like me, you're known to the staff and know the dealer principal is likely to get involved in sealing,the deal
I'd love an M BM but any BM is challenging to drive, so much so that other drivers will always have respect for you, bit like your TIV thing - is a Griff the plastic one with the noisy engine my dad used to rave about? Awesome. Always fancied drawing up alongside one in my BM and seeing who was fastest away from the lights, reckon it could be close if the Griff thing us as good as my old man used to say.
When I was in catching up with one of the senior sales execs at my local BM brand showroom the other day I was very tempted to move-on 'The 1' and go back to a 2, they were really offering some awesome deals, especially if, like me, you're known to the staff and know the dealer principal is likely to get involved in sealing,the deal
I'd love an M BM but any BM is challenging to drive, so much so that other drivers will always have respect for you, bit like your TIV thing - is a Griff the plastic one with the noisy engine my dad used to rave about? Awesome. Always fancied drawing up alongside one in my BM and seeing who was fastest away from the lights, reckon it could be close if the Griff thing us as good as my old man used to say.
Well that's a nice dilemma to have OP!
I'd go for a Z4MC, but as I've got a 3 litre Z4 Coupe I'm obviously biased.
But I did drive an MC earlier this year when I was thinking of changing, and the S54 engine is just fantastic.
I think it would be much closer to your TVR in terms of character than your other options.
I just don't think an M3, even a CSL, would feel quite as special - at the end of the day it's still only a variant of the E46. And I'm sure I read somewhere that the Z4 Roadster has a stiffer shell than an E46 Coupe - the Z4 Coupe shell is even stiffer.
An E34 M5 would be great, but it isn't really the same sort of car.
I suppose at the end of the day it just depends what you really want from the car - good luck anyway.
I'd go for a Z4MC, but as I've got a 3 litre Z4 Coupe I'm obviously biased.
But I did drive an MC earlier this year when I was thinking of changing, and the S54 engine is just fantastic.
I think it would be much closer to your TVR in terms of character than your other options.
I just don't think an M3, even a CSL, would feel quite as special - at the end of the day it's still only a variant of the E46. And I'm sure I read somewhere that the Z4 Roadster has a stiffer shell than an E46 Coupe - the Z4 Coupe shell is even stiffer.
An E34 M5 would be great, but it isn't really the same sort of car.
I suppose at the end of the day it just depends what you really want from the car - good luck anyway.
TarpaTow said:
For 20-25K you could get yourself behind the wheel of a 2AT, there's a few in the dealers at the mo.. I've had one before but moved back to 'The 1' but still miss that almost-Range Rover feeling of the 2AT.
When I was in catching up with one of the senior sales execs at my local BM brand showroom the other day I was very tempted to move-on 'The 1' and go back to a 2, they were really offering some awesome deals, especially if, like me, you're known to the staff and know the dealer principal is likely to get involved in sealing,the deal
I'd love an M BM but any BM is challenging to drive, so much so that other drivers will always have respect for you, bit like your TIV thing - is a Griff the plastic one with the noisy engine my dad used to rave about? Awesome. Always fancied drawing up alongside one in my BM and seeing who was fastest away from the lights, reckon it could be close if the Griff thing us as good as my old man used to say.
You always make my day! When I was in catching up with one of the senior sales execs at my local BM brand showroom the other day I was very tempted to move-on 'The 1' and go back to a 2, they were really offering some awesome deals, especially if, like me, you're known to the staff and know the dealer principal is likely to get involved in sealing,the deal
I'd love an M BM but any BM is challenging to drive, so much so that other drivers will always have respect for you, bit like your TIV thing - is a Griff the plastic one with the noisy engine my dad used to rave about? Awesome. Always fancied drawing up alongside one in my BM and seeing who was fastest away from the lights, reckon it could be close if the Griff thing us as good as my old man used to say.
OP from my experience I'd be a little bit wary of swapping a TVR for a BMW(I do love BMW though). I swapped a TVR Cerbera 4.5 for a Z4M Roadster and they were like chalk and cheese. The TVR was loud and thrilling to drive, whereas the Z4M felt heavy and quiet, and it didn't offer much of a sense of occasion at all for me in comparison.
cerb4.5lee said:
TarpaTow said:
For 20-25K you could get yourself behind the wheel of a 2AT, there's a few in the dealers at the mo.. I've had one before but moved back to 'The 1' but still miss that almost-Range Rover feeling of the 2AT.
When I was in catching up with one of the senior sales execs at my local BM brand showroom the other day I was very tempted to move-on 'The 1' and go back to a 2, they were really offering some awesome deals, especially if, like me, you're known to the staff and know the dealer principal is likely to get involved in sealing,the deal
I'd love an M BM but any BM is challenging to drive, so much so that other drivers will always have respect for you, bit like your TIV thing - is a Griff the plastic one with the noisy engine my dad used to rave about? Awesome. Always fancied drawing up alongside one in my BM and seeing who was fastest away from the lights, reckon it could be close if the Griff thing us as good as my old man used to say.
You always make my day! When I was in catching up with one of the senior sales execs at my local BM brand showroom the other day I was very tempted to move-on 'The 1' and go back to a 2, they were really offering some awesome deals, especially if, like me, you're known to the staff and know the dealer principal is likely to get involved in sealing,the deal
I'd love an M BM but any BM is challenging to drive, so much so that other drivers will always have respect for you, bit like your TIV thing - is a Griff the plastic one with the noisy engine my dad used to rave about? Awesome. Always fancied drawing up alongside one in my BM and seeing who was fastest away from the lights, reckon it could be close if the Griff thing us as good as my old man used to say.
What is a 2AT anyway? I'm Sniffing Petrol....
On a serious note the Z4M Coupe has caught my interest too, great value at the moment, but it's not a breadvan which i do hanker after....
cerb4.5lee said:
OP from my experience I'd be a little bit wary of swapping a TVR for a BMW(I do love BMW though). I swapped a TVR Cerbera 4.5 for a Z4M Roadster and they were like chalk and cheese. The TVR was loud and thrilling to drive, whereas the Z4M felt heavy and quiet, and it didn't offer much of a sense of occasion at all for me in comparison.
You raise a valid point, I stand to lose a lot on the Griff too, but it feels like only a matter of time before it goes...urquattroGus said:
What is a 2AT anyway? I'm Sniffing Petrol....
On a serious note the Z4M Coupe has caught my interest too, great value at the moment, but it's not a breadvan which i do hanker after....
The CSL would pique my interest - I love them. The induction noise alone would get me signing on the dotted line! They're one of my favourite looking M cars of all time; the proportions are perfect to my eyes.
Should you hate the SMG, it's not too hard to convert to manual (well according to the chap I was chatting to at Caffeine & Machine a few weeks ago with a CSL converted to manual).
stevesingo said:
Surprised the E46 M3 CS has not been mentioned. Get one with a manual gearbox and you have some of the benefits of a CSL - Sharper steering - without the god awful gearbox. Should have good residuals also.
Fair point, I've always been a bit sceptical of those though, seems like a big premium over a standard M3 for not much difference. The CSL has the engine and lightness going for it, but surely the CS is a bit over valued? I've seen a few nice ish looking CS for sale, but they are SMG ones!
urquattroGus said:
Fair point, I've always been a bit sceptical of those though, seems like a big premium over a standard M3 for not much difference. The CSL has the engine and lightness going for it, but surely the CS is a bit over valued?
I've seen a few nice ish looking CS for sale, but they are SMG ones!
If you really just want a manual with that engine buy the Z4 and make a few little suspension upgrades maybe I've seen a few nice ish looking CS for sale, but they are SMG ones!
OP, I'd suggest that you think carefully! The Griff and the cars you're suggesting are very different. My experience is that it's very difficult to find a true replacement for a TVR, others are good, some better, depending on the owner's criteria, BUT, there is, in my experience,very little that replaces the TVR, like for like.
That's not to say the ones you suggest aren't superb cars but they're quite different. It all depends on what you actually want. I can't comment on the actual ones you've suggested as I don't have much personal experience of any of them but I just know that TVRs still give me an old-fashioned buzz when I drive them. Newer sports cars (some) are great, some faster, generally better built, better safety equipment (if that's important), etc etc but different. Horses for courses. Of course, if you need four seats, or a fixed roof, that sways the argument.
That's not to say the ones you suggest aren't superb cars but they're quite different. It all depends on what you actually want. I can't comment on the actual ones you've suggested as I don't have much personal experience of any of them but I just know that TVRs still give me an old-fashioned buzz when I drive them. Newer sports cars (some) are great, some faster, generally better built, better safety equipment (if that's important), etc etc but different. Horses for courses. Of course, if you need four seats, or a fixed roof, that sways the argument.
I've owned a griff 500 and a z3m coupe , they are chalk and cheese , both great cars though . This may sound madness but take a look at a slk 55 , v8 noise , convertible or hard top , cheap in the real world and they are good fun once you've got your head around the gearbox! Try one before you dismiss them , I don't have one by the way but I've driven a couple .
Thanks guys, I’m not looking to directly replace the Griff and since I got the Griff I also bought a bargain Alfa 916 Spider, 3.0 Busso 6 speed, a much better car than I ever thought it would be, that will be staying so has the convertible base covered and that Busso sounds so good with a Wizard exhaust. No way a direct replacement for the brutish Griff but at least I can go topless in something.
I’ll window shop the Mercedes bit have never been sure about the looks or image. The 6.2 SL63 was another car that I was interested in but as great as it is it’s big heavy and auto.
The bred van idea is that I can use it in more scenarios that the Griff, say maybe even on a work day/trip out just because I can.
I’ll window shop the Mercedes bit have never been sure about the looks or image. The 6.2 SL63 was another car that I was interested in but as great as it is it’s big heavy and auto.
The bred van idea is that I can use it in more scenarios that the Griff, say maybe even on a work day/trip out just because I can.
Planman said:
Z4m coupe? My current toy car. Very different to the 4 litre TVR I had but more useable and still a raw drive with that s54 straight six.
Yes Tempted, have heard the ride is dire though and it seems a bit too modern almost. Can't ignore what they offer though!
Some days I like the looks, others not at all from the front. The interior also reminds me a bit of a 1 series I had, whereas the breadvan is more retro...
urquattroGus said:
Yes Tempted, have heard the ride is dire though and it seems a bit too modern almost.
Can't ignore what they offer though!
Some days I like the looks, others not at all from the front. The interior also reminds me a bit of a 1 series I had, whereas the breadvan is more retro...
I love the Z4 coupe; it’s aged really well I think. I chap I work with had s Z4 coupe and I was always amazed at how small it looked against modern cars. Can't ignore what they offer though!
Some days I like the looks, others not at all from the front. The interior also reminds me a bit of a 1 series I had, whereas the breadvan is more retro...
I’d want a good drive in one first though given the battering the ride took in reviews.
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