New Car Wheel Alignment
Discussion
Anyone taken delivery of a new Porsche (sports car) and thought the wheel alignment was incoorect?
My 718 Cayman drifts to the nearside far more than one would expect. My points of reference are the four 718/981 Caysters I had extended test drives in, my previous 996 and previous 997 (once sorted by Center Gravity). Yes I've checked all four tyres pressures.
Just wondering what other have experienced and the supplying OPC's response. Mine is into the dealer this morning - I've asked for the alignment to be checked (and by that I mean an actual four wheel alingment on a Hunter or similar).
My 718 Cayman drifts to the nearside far more than one would expect. My points of reference are the four 718/981 Caysters I had extended test drives in, my previous 996 and previous 997 (once sorted by Center Gravity). Yes I've checked all four tyres pressures.
Just wondering what other have experienced and the supplying OPC's response. Mine is into the dealer this morning - I've asked for the alignment to be checked (and by that I mean an actual four wheel alingment on a Hunter or similar).
churchie2856 said:
Anyone taken delivery of a new Porsche (sports car) and thought the wheel alignment was incoorect?
My 718 Cayman drifts to the nearside far more than one would expect. My points of reference are the four 718/981 Caysters I had extended test drives in, my previous 996 and previous 997 (once sorted by Center Gravity). Yes I've checked all four tyres pressures.
Just wondering what other have experienced and the supplying OPC's response. Mine is into the dealer this morning - I've asked for the alignment to be checked (and by that I mean an actual four wheel alingment on a Hunter or similar).
So dealer put it on their Hunter and voila ... some of the front and rear cambers and toes were out of spec and mis-matched side to side.My 718 Cayman drifts to the nearside far more than one would expect. My points of reference are the four 718/981 Caysters I had extended test drives in, my previous 996 and previous 997 (once sorted by Center Gravity). Yes I've checked all four tyres pressures.
Just wondering what other have experienced and the supplying OPC's response. Mine is into the dealer this morning - I've asked for the alignment to be checked (and by that I mean an actual four wheel alingment on a Hunter or similar).
They adjusted it back to spec and, on the six miles home (dual carriage way, plus country lanes) it drives like a different car - a Cayster in fact.
They gave me lunch too in the showroom - very good roast beef sandwiches. Yum.
overunder12g said:
Had seven caysters and about half needed adjusting. Mainly to get the steering wheel central when going straight
That was another symptom mine exhibited.Obviously adjustments were free of charge, but on a £50K sports car I think there is a case for alignments being checked as part of the PDI. I bet loads of people buy new cars with questionable wheel alignment, but they just don’t know what good feels or performs like. My previous Golf R was a mess day one, but VW did f*ck all about it. At least my local OPC just got on and addressed it and without any flannel (“Sir, they all drive like that ....”).
WG said:
Come on guys , Do you really believe that Porsche would let cars leave the factory with incorrect geometry . I have had 11 Porsches 5 brand new and none have had any geometry issues. I will accept that set up may not be ideal for track but that is a very small part of the market,
you have had 11 porkers and never changed a oem geo to be more driver focused ?as for factory errors that's very common, I have only had 2 new porkers and ones been out so 50% :-) , the other I changed straight away anyway as oem settings are all a bit noob and not driver bias even for the road.
Porsche911R said:
you have had 11 porkers and never changed a oem geo to be more driver focused ?
as for factory errors that's very common, I have only had 2 new porkers and ones been out so 50% :-) , the other I changed straight away anyway as oem settings are all a bit noob and not driver bias even for the road.
I've had some new Porsches delivered with undesirable geos..In particular some Cayennes with oem geo experienced some quite extraordinary front outside tyre wear/scrub..Despite my OPC checking the alignment on a couple of occasions this uneven tyre wear continued.as for factory errors that's very common, I have only had 2 new porkers and ones been out so 50% :-) , the other I changed straight away anyway as oem settings are all a bit noob and not driver bias even for the road.
It was only when i took it to my local garage for another set of tyres as the old ones had worn outsides and they then checked and changed the alignment..Very even tyre wear since.!
Well I can say with some conviction from vast experience that the majority of NEW cars from the majority of car manufacturers do have alignment / geometry issues from the factory. The only exception to this in my experience has been Lotus cars which are usually pretty spot on from the factory.
From my personal ownership this has been the case for cars from Porsche, Honda, Ford, BMW, Mercedes and Toyota. From my business experience (we have a Hunter Hawkeye Elite alignment rig) this also includes cars from all leading manufacturers including many premium brand sports / super cars.
The simple fact of the matter is whilst cars are built very well in the factory the suspension systems are mostly pre-assembled with the correct geometry but this will never be 100% accurate - within tolerances YES, but not exact and many times different side to side. Manufacturers geometry tolerances can be fairly generous (some have much tighter tolerances than others) which can allow camber and toe figures to be quite different side to side (on the same axle) but in the manufacturers eyes still 'within spec'. Within spec isn't good enough for a lot of drivers as this can mean you can have up to 1 degree of camber difference side to side and toe figures equally mis-aligned. In simple terms your new car might have positive camber on the n/s/f wheel, negative camber on the o/s/f and different toe settings on the same axle but still be within manufacturer specifications! These settings will never give your car the opportunity to feel as good as it should or could - other issues are misaligned steering wheels (the most common reason people ask for geometry checks), poor tyre wear, poor handling, car pulling left or right, increased road camber sensitivity, reduced mpg etc.
We (and any reputable other alignment centres) will always aim for exact manufacturer spec and avoid tolerance ranges, we also always look to equal the settings left to right. Obviously a lot of customers are looking to improve the manufacturers settings by maxing out front camber angles etc and this is also very popular with certain vehicles. We set cars up to customer spec including track day cars, fast-road set-ups, competition vehicles and the most peculiar settings on drift cars!
So in conclusion it is absolutely worthwhile getting your new car checked and set up by a reputable garage who knows how to use accurate geometry kit (the key here is accurate as many aren't! Our kit and ramp are calibrated every 6 months) to get the best from your car.
From my personal ownership this has been the case for cars from Porsche, Honda, Ford, BMW, Mercedes and Toyota. From my business experience (we have a Hunter Hawkeye Elite alignment rig) this also includes cars from all leading manufacturers including many premium brand sports / super cars.
The simple fact of the matter is whilst cars are built very well in the factory the suspension systems are mostly pre-assembled with the correct geometry but this will never be 100% accurate - within tolerances YES, but not exact and many times different side to side. Manufacturers geometry tolerances can be fairly generous (some have much tighter tolerances than others) which can allow camber and toe figures to be quite different side to side (on the same axle) but in the manufacturers eyes still 'within spec'. Within spec isn't good enough for a lot of drivers as this can mean you can have up to 1 degree of camber difference side to side and toe figures equally mis-aligned. In simple terms your new car might have positive camber on the n/s/f wheel, negative camber on the o/s/f and different toe settings on the same axle but still be within manufacturer specifications! These settings will never give your car the opportunity to feel as good as it should or could - other issues are misaligned steering wheels (the most common reason people ask for geometry checks), poor tyre wear, poor handling, car pulling left or right, increased road camber sensitivity, reduced mpg etc.
We (and any reputable other alignment centres) will always aim for exact manufacturer spec and avoid tolerance ranges, we also always look to equal the settings left to right. Obviously a lot of customers are looking to improve the manufacturers settings by maxing out front camber angles etc and this is also very popular with certain vehicles. We set cars up to customer spec including track day cars, fast-road set-ups, competition vehicles and the most peculiar settings on drift cars!
So in conclusion it is absolutely worthwhile getting your new car checked and set up by a reputable garage who knows how to use accurate geometry kit (the key here is accurate as many aren't! Our kit and ramp are calibrated every 6 months) to get the best from your car.
Yep SWMBO had to take her brand new 991.2 turbo s straight to indy 9e for a geo last year a few days old after taking delivery. Surprisingly car was oversteering from the factory - it shouldn't be doing that! Also Porsche need to stop supplying cars on Pirellia P Zero tyres - awful in comparison to Michelin.
It's certainly not expensive to do a good geo and particularly if you are learning a new car, why would'n to you want the handling to be at least symmetrical ... ?
As an aside, it used to be the case on the air-cooled Porsche's that a car was in build tolerance if the wheel-arch clearance to tyre difference was less than 6mm one side to the other.
Hence people fitting wheel spacers could have problems ..
Robots are great !!
As an aside, it used to be the case on the air-cooled Porsche's that a car was in build tolerance if the wheel-arch clearance to tyre difference was less than 6mm one side to the other.
Hence people fitting wheel spacers could have problems ..
Robots are great !!
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