Moving from TVR
Discussion
Howdy all,
After 4 1/2 years of TVR Tuscan ownership I'm thinking of parting with my beast.
I want a slightly quieter car, but something with that 'grin factor' when you get to a good twisty road. And although my Tuscan has never left me stranded at the side of the road, the apprehension at doing so is making me think German.
So, I'm thinking about a Beema M3, or a used 996, probably C2. I'd love a C4S, but my pocket disagrees :(
Anyone here an ex-TVR owner, who's got a story to tell that will pursuade me to just keep mine, or definitely go for a Porsche?
Oh, I've never driven a Porsche either, so currently I haven't even got a clue if I'll like them :)
Cheers!
--Phips
After 4 1/2 years of TVR Tuscan ownership I'm thinking of parting with my beast.
I want a slightly quieter car, but something with that 'grin factor' when you get to a good twisty road. And although my Tuscan has never left me stranded at the side of the road, the apprehension at doing so is making me think German.
So, I'm thinking about a Beema M3, or a used 996, probably C2. I'd love a C4S, but my pocket disagrees :(
Anyone here an ex-TVR owner, who's got a story to tell that will pursuade me to just keep mine, or definitely go for a Porsche?
Oh, I've never driven a Porsche either, so currently I haven't even got a clue if I'll like them :)
Cheers!
--Phips
Im ex-TVR phips and a fellow Suffolkite, you should have no problems adjusting your driving techniques, go to the OPC in Cambridge for a few test drives , drive as many different models as you possibly can then make a decision, you`ll know quickly enough if a Porsche is the right move for you. Good luck.
Do it, you will never regret it and never turn back.
I have to confess I really got on very badly with my Cerbera as a result of many issues which I really could not tolerate in a car of that level of performance and more importantly cost.
However so as to avoid some sort of ‘Bash the TVR’ rant the key areas that tip the balance for me are
• Superior build
• Performance that can be accessed more readily
• Performance in line with the manufacturers quote
• They rarely break
• Easy servicing
• Engineering integrity which is second to none
• Plenty of places to get one looked after
• Servicing costs need not break your arms
I can go on and on and probably have done already but in summary you are either a Porsche type of owner or a TVR type of owner I am most definitely the latter.
Let’s not forget those 16 outright wins at Le Mans either
I have to confess I really got on very badly with my Cerbera as a result of many issues which I really could not tolerate in a car of that level of performance and more importantly cost.
However so as to avoid some sort of ‘Bash the TVR’ rant the key areas that tip the balance for me are
• Superior build
• Performance that can be accessed more readily
• Performance in line with the manufacturers quote
• They rarely break
• Easy servicing
• Engineering integrity which is second to none
• Plenty of places to get one looked after
• Servicing costs need not break your arms
I can go on and on and probably have done already but in summary you are either a Porsche type of owner or a TVR type of owner I am most definitely the latter.
Let’s not forget those 16 outright wins at Le Mans either
Hi
Ex Tamora owner here
I wasn't that impressed the first time I drove a 996 C2, seemed a bit slow and boring.
The second time was on roads I knew well and I gave it some stick. I realised the 911 is a car you can drive normally and potter about in OR you can really drive the wheels off the thing and it’s fast. I couldn’t really get into any sort of rhythm with my Tamora when pushing on, but with the 911 it just sort of flows and is very rewarding to drive when you get it right and you’re in the zone.
The TVR's are seriously quick in a straight line and have great brakes too, but that's about it, bit of a one trick pony really. The suspension setup too hard to make fast progress on all but the smoothest UK roads imo.
The AP brakes on the latest TVR's have eye popping stopping power, this is the area where I noticed the 911 lacking compared to my Tamora in both feel and retardation.
The 911 is a better all-round proposition, I found it just as quick in the real world because the chassis and suspension allow faster progress on all sorts of road and conditions.
Sounds like you sound have a look at the GT3, very similar straight line performance to the Tuscan and the reliability to match.
Good luck
>> Edited by bumcrack on Friday 10th June 16:54
Ex Tamora owner here
I wasn't that impressed the first time I drove a 996 C2, seemed a bit slow and boring.
The second time was on roads I knew well and I gave it some stick. I realised the 911 is a car you can drive normally and potter about in OR you can really drive the wheels off the thing and it’s fast. I couldn’t really get into any sort of rhythm with my Tamora when pushing on, but with the 911 it just sort of flows and is very rewarding to drive when you get it right and you’re in the zone.
The TVR's are seriously quick in a straight line and have great brakes too, but that's about it, bit of a one trick pony really. The suspension setup too hard to make fast progress on all but the smoothest UK roads imo.
The AP brakes on the latest TVR's have eye popping stopping power, this is the area where I noticed the 911 lacking compared to my Tamora in both feel and retardation.
The 911 is a better all-round proposition, I found it just as quick in the real world because the chassis and suspension allow faster progress on all sorts of road and conditions.
Sounds like you sound have a look at the GT3, very similar straight line performance to the Tuscan and the reliability to match.
Good luck
>> Edited by bumcrack on Friday 10th June 16:54
IMHO the Beemer is too boring (i have a 325CISport and its not that much slower than an M3) especially after a TVR. 996C2/C4 very capable also boring unless GT3 or Turbo.
I would seriously look at a 993S4 or Turbo or if you have the balls for it a 964RS - a mans car very much in the mode of TVR, but will not fail apart quite a quickly. Also any of these cars will cost you bugger all in depreciation - allowing more money for mods and servicing and track days.
Happy days are here again
I would seriously look at a 993S4 or Turbo or if you have the balls for it a 964RS - a mans car very much in the mode of TVR, but will not fail apart quite a quickly. Also any of these cars will cost you bugger all in depreciation - allowing more money for mods and servicing and track days.
Happy days are here again
In March I moved from 12 moths of Tuscan ownership to a Boxster S. I wanted a soft top, and a late model 911 was out of my price range.
Initially I was underwhelmed with the Boxster, as you can't help but notice the loss in straight line performance compared to the TVR. The more I drive it though, the more I get to love it, to the degree where I think it is a fabulous car.
Having to commute from Bham to Milton Keynes twice a week, I simply couldn't rely on the TVR, which let me down on numerous occassions.
The Tuscan has better straight line performance and drop dead gorgeous looks (if you squint so you can't see the appauling finish) and an awesome growl. For everything else the Porsche wins hands down. I'm probably an average driver, but feel I could drive the Porsche a lot quicker than the TVR, even without the driver aids. It certainly feels a lot safer and solid at quicker speeds.
I miss the 'thump in the back acceleration', but quite enjoy being more 'anonymous' on the road. My wallet is certainly much happier. Really, there has been no looking back for me.
Phil.
Initially I was underwhelmed with the Boxster, as you can't help but notice the loss in straight line performance compared to the TVR. The more I drive it though, the more I get to love it, to the degree where I think it is a fabulous car.
Having to commute from Bham to Milton Keynes twice a week, I simply couldn't rely on the TVR, which let me down on numerous occassions.
The Tuscan has better straight line performance and drop dead gorgeous looks (if you squint so you can't see the appauling finish) and an awesome growl. For everything else the Porsche wins hands down. I'm probably an average driver, but feel I could drive the Porsche a lot quicker than the TVR, even without the driver aids. It certainly feels a lot safer and solid at quicker speeds.
I miss the 'thump in the back acceleration', but quite enjoy being more 'anonymous' on the road. My wallet is certainly much happier. Really, there has been no looking back for me.
Phil.
Hi Phips
Am not sure a C2 will give you the same grin factor as a Tuscan.. def not sound wise or acceleration wise anyway.!
Having owned TVRs gone to 911s, back to a 350T for 16 days..!!, now a GT3..
My fave TVR was my Cerbie 4.5, sports exhaust gave a superb overun sound of pops and bangs, also extreme performance, few other cars can match..
Only my current GT3 with GT3 cup exhaust can match it for sound and performance, but have had to pay a huge price to match the TVR grin factor..
The benefit of Porsche ownership is reliability and residuals.
I think you will be disappointed moving to a C2 from a Tuscan.. I would wait and save for a more performance orientated 911..(993 turbo, 993 RS/RSR
or Mk1 GT3)
All IMHO
Cheers
Rob
Am not sure a C2 will give you the same grin factor as a Tuscan.. def not sound wise or acceleration wise anyway.!
Having owned TVRs gone to 911s, back to a 350T for 16 days..!!, now a GT3..
My fave TVR was my Cerbie 4.5, sports exhaust gave a superb overun sound of pops and bangs, also extreme performance, few other cars can match..
Only my current GT3 with GT3 cup exhaust can match it for sound and performance, but have had to pay a huge price to match the TVR grin factor..
The benefit of Porsche ownership is reliability and residuals.
I think you will be disappointed moving to a C2 from a Tuscan.. I would wait and save for a more performance orientated 911..(993 turbo, 993 RS/RSR
or Mk1 GT3)
All IMHO
Cheers
Rob
GT3 Rob said:
Hi Phips
Am not sure a C2 will give you the same grin factor as a Tuscan.. def not sound wise or acceleration wise anyway.!
Hi Rob,
TBH, I don't think *anything* will give me the same grin factor as the TVR. I've just enjoyed three weeks of touring around Italy with it, and I guess it was as close to being a film star as I'm ever going to get
Oh, and 7000rpm through tunnels *never* grows boring GT3 Rob said:
Only my current GT3 with GT3 cup exhaust can match it for sound and performance, but have had to pay a huge price to match the TVR grin factor..
But, saying that, this is what I want to move away from, at least for a while - the bloody noise! Since moving to London and parting with my everyday Mini Cooper S (which was the biggest hoot of a 'normal' car I've had since a Ford Puma) I've only got the Tivver, and it just isn't an everyday car, I don't care what TVR-only owners say.
I only have a certain budget, comprising of the sale of the Mini and whatever pittance I can get for the Tiv. I *could* spend more, but then I could be sensible and pay off the mortgage instead...
It appears old age sways me in the latter direction, but simply changing two cars for one (that I still don't really need in London!) sits better in my mind GT3 Rob said:
The benefit of Porsche ownership is reliability and residuals.
And here's another thing I'd like. Reliability. Or percieved reliabilty anyway. My Tuscan, in 4 years and 7 months of ownership, has *never* let me down. I've never had a none-start, I've never had a breakdown. It's done half a dozen track days and two very big trips to Europe, performing faultlessly everytime. I service it religiously, check the oil every time I return from a journey, and pay any money it needs to keep it in tip top condition. But, because of all the talk around TVRs, I still wonder if one day it'll finally let me down, just when I don't need it to.
GT3 Rob said:
I think you will be disappointed moving to a C2 from a Tuscan.. I would wait and save for a more performance orientated 911..(993 turbo, 993 RS/RSR or Mk1 GT3)
I worry that'll I'll be disappointed in whatever I move to, to an extent. But, I used to love driving my Mini, and in fact took it to France on one trip instead of the Tiv. I'm a 'keen' driver and not all that bad behind the wheel. I can make most stuff I drive hustle along quite nicely
So I can afford to drop a few BHP - I mean, for the most part the TVR is just too bloody quick on the roads! There's pro's and con's. What I'd hope will happen when I drive a Porsche is I find all the pro's of the Mini, (built quality, lack-of-intrusive-noise, fun when I want it, quiet cruising when I don't) with a small slice of TVR in there too (tail out hooning
) What's the 0-60 & 0-100 times, typically, on a C2 anyway? And anyone recommend any friendly Porsche garages to go talk to about test drives? I'm in east London, but clearly test driving around here is just a waste of time, so I don't mind driving out of the city to go find a dealership near a decent test drive route.
Cheers folks,
--Phips
I agree with vario-rob about the plus points (having made that same journey 2.5 years ago). I've only got a 993 C2 and, while I appreciate the integrity and engineering of the machine, it has yet to give that broad grin factor that the TVR did.
But then, it also hasn't induced the wilt factor by refusing to start because the starter motor overheated (I went through three in four years), and it's only cost a fraction that the TVR did.
I think I need a 993TT...
>> Edited by manek on Friday 10th June 16:32
But then, it also hasn't induced the wilt factor by refusing to start because the starter motor overheated (I went through three in four years), and it's only cost a fraction that the TVR did.
I think I need a 993TT...
>> Edited by manek on Friday 10th June 16:32
To answer the 'speed' part.. Most mags have the C2 down to 4.8 0-60, and around 11 to 100, which is fast for a 'base' 911...
To put it into perspective though about porca ponies, a friend of mine upgraded his Audi S4 to 325bhp/412lbs and proceeded to chastise me, we managed have a 'small' race a few weeks back and I (2002 C4) was on his tail catching up all the way to 100, then passed him... Driving his, I would say it felt aster, but porca's def. seem to hide the performance and are ALOT faster than you give them credit.
To put it into perspective though about porca ponies, a friend of mine upgraded his Audi S4 to 325bhp/412lbs and proceeded to chastise me, we managed have a 'small' race a few weeks back and I (2002 C4) was on his tail catching up all the way to 100, then passed him... Driving his, I would say it felt aster, but porca's def. seem to hide the performance and are ALOT faster than you give them credit.
I went from a 4.5 cerbie to a 996, got bored, then an early 3.2 911..was happier but wanted more grunt...chnaged to a 964 and was going to upgrade..but then saw the chance for a Viper GTS...and now smitten. Not sure what the moral of the tale is..but you'll never be satisfied, once you have been TVRd, unless you go for some serious exotic / powerful pork.
I had a Griff 4.0, then a Griff 500. I got too pissed off with the reliability and the dealer being a kunt (I'm in London) and so I moved on.
I moved to a '87 3.2 Carrera. I actaully had the Griff 500 and the 3.2 for a while - which was nice.
From the 3.2 (which got left in Italy
) I moved on to a LHD 964RS which I've had ever since.
Since dropping the Tiv's I've never looked back. I did enjoy the TVR's but I do too much "performance" driving for them to be a serious option (your mileage may vary).
Porsche is where it's at - and, I'm sure, always will be.
The Griff 500 did feel fast in straight line - I once had a drag against a friend in a 964RS and while I did get an initial lead I was quickly reeled in.
The Griff brakes were shameful - but I think sinc the Cerbs they're improved by a factor of at least 10.
IMHO TVR's feel *much* faster than they are - but that doesn't mean they're not fun.
I moved to a '87 3.2 Carrera. I actaully had the Griff 500 and the 3.2 for a while - which was nice.
From the 3.2 (which got left in Italy
) I moved on to a LHD 964RS which I've had ever since. Since dropping the Tiv's I've never looked back. I did enjoy the TVR's but I do too much "performance" driving for them to be a serious option (your mileage may vary).
Porsche is where it's at - and, I'm sure, always will be.
The Griff 500 did feel fast in straight line - I once had a drag against a friend in a 964RS and while I did get an initial lead I was quickly reeled in.
The Griff brakes were shameful - but I think sinc the Cerbs they're improved by a factor of at least 10.
IMHO TVR's feel *much* faster than they are - but that doesn't mean they're not fun.
Hi Phips
I moved from a Griffith to a 993 C2 a couple of years ago. Broadly speaking I agree with most of the things that have been said but remember there will be the odd day when you will pine after the TVR, they are such a unique car.
Personally I don’t miss the lost straight-line performance. A regular 911 is still a quick car. Perhaps the 993 feels quicker than the 996 though.
I loved my TVR, wanted one since I can remember and have very happy memories. I love the 911 too but for different reasons. It feels great knowing that I can rely on the car, I don’t spend all summer with on eye on the temperature gauge. Also, as mentioned, the strong residuals are an added bonus.
Good luck
Patrick
I moved from a Griffith to a 993 C2 a couple of years ago. Broadly speaking I agree with most of the things that have been said but remember there will be the odd day when you will pine after the TVR, they are such a unique car.
Personally I don’t miss the lost straight-line performance. A regular 911 is still a quick car. Perhaps the 993 feels quicker than the 996 though.
I loved my TVR, wanted one since I can remember and have very happy memories. I love the 911 too but for different reasons. It feels great knowing that I can rely on the car, I don’t spend all summer with on eye on the temperature gauge. Also, as mentioned, the strong residuals are an added bonus.
Good luck
Patrick
vario-rob said:
Servicing costs need not break your arms
On that note Rob, what are the service intervals on, say, a 3.4 Carrera and what's a typical, basic, cost?
My Tivver is just in for a 'biggie', including the valve clearances (needs doing every other service). At 925 quid before sorting out any 'niggles' I'm sure this will be another 'arm breaking' service cost *groan*
Phips,
I did exactly what you are contemplating about 3 months ago (I went for the C4S). Like you, my Tuscan hadn't caused any problems but I must admit to getting itchy feet given that I hadn't had a rebuild and it was coming up to the mileage where a lot of others had suffered.
I pretty much expected a significant loss of straight line speed but if I'm being honest, this isn't anywhere near as noticeable as I thought it would be - I was very pleasantly surprised. What I do notice is that I have to get into 3rd much earlier than before though.
Unsurprisingly, the handling in the twisties is significantly improved. Also, although it may have been my particular Tuscan, I don't get any of the twitchiness or tramlining I used to experience.
Does it put a grin on my face? Absolutely.
>> Edited by NickD on Friday 10th June 15:12
I did exactly what you are contemplating about 3 months ago (I went for the C4S). Like you, my Tuscan hadn't caused any problems but I must admit to getting itchy feet given that I hadn't had a rebuild and it was coming up to the mileage where a lot of others had suffered.
I pretty much expected a significant loss of straight line speed but if I'm being honest, this isn't anywhere near as noticeable as I thought it would be - I was very pleasantly surprised. What I do notice is that I have to get into 3rd much earlier than before though.
Unsurprisingly, the handling in the twisties is significantly improved. Also, although it may have been my particular Tuscan, I don't get any of the twitchiness or tramlining I used to experience.
Does it put a grin on my face? Absolutely.
>> Edited by NickD on Friday 10th June 15:12
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