Back to basics required at AM.
Discussion
james-witton said:
Now they have the financial backing they wanted I believe AM should stop spending money on all these Ego Projects (Apartments, bikes, helicopters ... it’s a long list) and concentrate on what they do best. Cars.
Hi JamesI’ve just posted this link in the AM Stock Market Listing thread. I think it makes for interesting reading.
https://www.londonstockexchange.com/exchange/news/...
Best Regards
Minglar
james-witton said:
Now they have the financial backing they wanted, I believe AM should stop spending money on all these Ego Projects (Apartments, bikes, helicopters ... it’s a long list) and concentrate on what they do best. Cars.
Or perhaps not James:-
"Stroll’s presence will help steer the company toward its aim of becoming a luxury-goods company", Palmer said.
“It’s going to change the dialogue in the boardroom,” he said. “The dialogue will change from automotive to luxury.”
Is Aston Martin paying to have their name and branding on the ego projects? Or are they being paid? It's a serious question: Does Aston Martin *get paid* to be part of these projects, or is Aston Martin *paying* to be part of these projects?
The "wtf is Aston doing?" comments come up every week or two, just like this, but not a single person has been able to answer this question yet about which direction the money goes.
The "wtf is Aston doing?" comments come up every week or two, just like this, but not a single person has been able to answer this question yet about which direction the money goes.
telum01 said:
Is Aston Martin paying to have their name and branding on the ego projects? Or are they being paid? It's a serious question: Does Aston Martin *get paid* to be part of these projects, or is Aston Martin *paying* to be part of these projects?
The "wtf is Aston doing?" comments come up every week or two, just like this, but not a single person has been able to answer this question yet about which direction the money goes.
The "wtf is Aston doing?" comments come up every week or two, just like this, but not a single person has been able to answer this question yet about which direction the money goes.
I don't think there will be an answer. Rather like how much is spent on sponsoring Red Bull F1. It is not revealed (yet) in the AMLGH accounts. Someone did make a guess though, about £10 million to be a title sponsor.
JPCGT said:
Sounds like they were days, if not hours away from running out of cash. Expect the monthly wage run would have teetered them over the edge, hence the immediate £55m short term cash injection.
Agree - this all looks like a last minute excercise. The fat controller makes it sound like they avoided drawing down on the 100 debt facility - but I think they were much closer to calling in the receivers. Happy that Stroll came along. The next couple of days will reveal his plan and whether AML stays as a listed company. I have my doubts. "2019 was a disappointing year with trading weaker than anticipated, particularly for Vantage "
I am not a car designer or financial wizard..............but, surely the solution to the above problem is fix the front end of the current Vantage.
ie
Vents on the rather plain bonnet
Redesign the headlights
Replace the existing front shark look with an Aston Grille
I am not a car designer or financial wizard..............but, surely the solution to the above problem is fix the front end of the current Vantage.
ie
Vents on the rather plain bonnet
Redesign the headlights
Replace the existing front shark look with an Aston Grille
Manwhoneverwas said:
"2019 was a disappointing year with trading weaker than anticipated, particularly for Vantage "
I am not a car designer or financial wizard..............but, surely the solution to the above problem is fix the front end of the current Vantage.
ie
Vents on the rather plain bonnet
Redesign the headlights
Replace the existing front shark look with an Aston Grille
I am not a car designer or financial wizard..............but, surely the solution to the above problem is fix the front end of the current Vantage.
ie
Vents on the rather plain bonnet
Redesign the headlights
Replace the existing front shark look with an Aston Grille
We were told that the design was aimed at new, younger, wealthy customers. That the car is a predator and production capacity is fully booked for eighteen months.
When there was criticism on here, about the looks of the car immediately after the launch, it was explained that PHers represent such a tiny proportion of AM buyers, and our opinion can be ignored because the Vantage is selling very well.
JPCGT said:
Sounds like they were days, if not hours away from running out of cash. Expect the monthly wage run would have teetered them over the edge, hence the immediate £55m short term cash injection.
They still hadn’t drawn down the $100m second bond (circa £70m). The immediate cash injection is to stop them doing thathornbaek said:
Agree - this all looks like a last minute excercise. The fat controller makes it sound like they avoided drawing down on the 100 debt facility - but I think they were much closer to calling in the receivers. Happy that Stroll came along. The next couple of days will reveal his plan and whether AML stays as a listed company. I have my doubts.
So the majority shareholders who’ve just said they’re going to put in the best part of £250m were on the brink of calling in the receivers? Thank you I needed a laugh after a long week at work 
Jon39 said:
We were told that the design was aimed at new, younger, wealthy customers. That the car is a predator and production capacity is fully booked for eighteen months.
When there was criticism on here, about the looks of the car immediately after the launch, it was explained that PHers represent such a tiny proportion of AM buyers, and our opinion can be ignored because the Vantage is selling very well.
RobDown said:
hornbaek said:
Agree - this all looks like a last minute excercise. The fat controller makes it sound like they avoided drawing down on the 100 debt facility - but I think they were much closer to calling in the receivers. Happy that Stroll came along. The next couple of days will reveal his plan and whether AML stays as a listed company. I have my doubts.
So the majority shareholders who’ve just said they’re going to put in the best part of £250m were on the brink of calling in the receivers? Thank you I needed a laugh after a long week at work Jon39 said:
james-witton said:
Now they have the financial backing they wanted, I believe AM should stop spending money on all these Ego Projects (Apartments, bikes, helicopters ... it’s a long list) and concentrate on what they do best. Cars.
Or perhaps not James:-
"Stroll’s presence will help steer the company toward its aim of becoming a luxury-goods company", Palmer said.
“It’s going to change the dialogue in the boardroom,” he said. “The dialogue will change from automotive to luxury.”
“It’s going to change the dialogue in the boardroom,” he said. “The dialogue will change from automotive to luxury.”
The challenge there is that Stroll's credentials are in fashion brand licensing (Ralph Lauren, Hilfiger, Kors) rather than luxury brands built on intrinsic quality, craftsmanship, heritage and product performance (as would be the case with many LVMH or Richemont Group brands - the two largest luxury goods groups).
All luxury brands have to have a strong core brand proposition before they extend into other categories - and strong brands ensure they do not over-extend into categories where the core brand value is diluted or irrelevant - so you don't see Cartier branded hotels, Louis Vuitton restaurants etc.
Aston Martin has suffered from ill-judged brand extensions such as Miami apartments which do not enhance the brand proposition. Recent models have also shown a lack of confidence in the brand (name on the rear of cars rather than wings).
The focus of new models such as the DBX will be in USA and China. China is a fast developing market and is starting to get to a level of sophistication in luxury goods - a few years ago the most successful brands in China were the obvious choices of expressions of status - Rolex, Mercedes, Louis Vuitton, etc. Now we see as luxury consumers In China want to get to the next level of luxury (as they already have the obvious brands), they look for more sophisticated and less obvious, more subtle brands - Cartier, Hermes, perhaps Aston Martin?
It's a similar story in the USA, but more developed - the market for sophisticated luxury already exists, and heritage, provenance, quality and relevance are core to this market.
Aston Martin needs a "luxury dialogue" that focuses on its core brand/product values and its heritage, proud of its understated branding. It needs someone included in that dialogue who understands luxury brands which succeed in that context and have a detailed understanding of their target customers, especially in China and the USA, as well as in fashion brand licensing.
The challenge there is that Stroll's credentials are in fashion brand licensing (Ralph Lauren, Hilfiger, Kors) rather than luxury brands built on intrinsic quality, craftsmanship, heritage and product performance (as would be the case with many LVMH or Richemont Group brands - the two largest luxury goods groups).
All luxury brands have to have a strong core brand proposition before they extend into other categories - and strong brands ensure they do not over-extend into categories where the core brand value is diluted or irrelevant - so you don't see Cartier branded hotels, Louis Vuitton restaurants etc.
Aston Martin has suffered from ill-judged brand extensions such as Miami apartments which do not enhance the brand proposition. Recent models have also shown a lack of confidence in the brand (name on the rear of cars rather than wings).
The focus of new models such as the DBX will be in USA and China. China is a fast developing market and is starting to get to a level of sophistication in luxury goods - a few years ago the most successful brands in China were the obvious choices of expressions of status - Rolex, Mercedes, Louis Vuitton, etc. Now we see as luxury consumers In China want to get to the next level of luxury (as they already have the obvious brands), they look for more sophisticated and less obvious, more subtle brands - Cartier, Hermes, perhaps Aston Martin?
It's a similar story in the USA, but more developed - the market for sophisticated luxury already exists, and heritage, provenance, quality and relevance are core to this market.
Aston Martin needs a "luxury dialogue" that focuses on its core brand/product values and its heritage, proud of its understated branding. It needs someone included in that dialogue who understands luxury brands which succeed in that context and have a detailed understanding of their target customers, especially in China and the USA, as well as in fashion brand licensing.
Edited by Philip0 on Saturday 1st February 11:21
WonkeyDonkey said:
AstonV said:
Are we to assume younger, wealthier customers have no taste?
Just different taste to the dinosaurs that are likely to die off soon and no longer be customers.A) price point being wrong
B) there aren't as many younger wealthier customers as predicted
C) Younger wealthier customers didn't like the styling either, or in insufficient numbers
D)Combination of all of the above
That's before you get to the existing customers who typically have owned more than one Aston who couldn't get past the price and the styling.
I would be amazed to learn that AML pay anything for all these branding exercises (the apartments, helicopters etc).
I am sure Airbus paid AM a hell of a lot to brand a helo, same with the apartment building deal. It is still the world's coolest brand even if the front of the new Vantage went a bit awry.
If they licence a brand a bit more and there is more AML tat out there but it enables them to make more cars then I for one would be happy. As I keep reminding my Ferrari owning friends they drive a car built by a baseball cap fashion company, doesn't stop the cars being great and probably makes it a lot easier to make investment decisions knowing you are going to make millions out of the brand regardless.
I am sure Airbus paid AM a hell of a lot to brand a helo, same with the apartment building deal. It is still the world's coolest brand even if the front of the new Vantage went a bit awry.
If they licence a brand a bit more and there is more AML tat out there but it enables them to make more cars then I for one would be happy. As I keep reminding my Ferrari owning friends they drive a car built by a baseball cap fashion company, doesn't stop the cars being great and probably makes it a lot easier to make investment decisions knowing you are going to make millions out of the brand regardless.
Jon39 said:
"Stroll’s presence will help steer the company toward its aim of becoming a luxury-goods company", Palmer said.
“It’s going to change the dialogue in the boardroom,” he said. “The dialogue will change from automotive to luxury.”
Personally I think the presence of Stroll, with a proven record of clever and insightful business development will potentially steady the horse, as clearly after years of limited R&D, the ambitious 7 year plan sucked the AML coffers dry and contributed to put the company in the position they are now in. I think a man that looks like a grumpy Anthony Quinn gives of the vibe of someone who will get stuff done.
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