Modern Classics Rule the day at Auction.
Discussion
Interesting day at Ascot Racecourse yesterday as Historics Auctioneers held their spring sale. OK its a nervous market not helped by C19 at present - but there were shed loads of no-sales. What stood out was the strength of the modern classic sector.
Many older or more exotic cars remained unsold even with modest reserve prices. By my reckoning just 2 of 8 Ferraris found new owners, similarly only 3/9 911 derivatives.
However the more recent stuff...especially with a blue oval, a different story. Escort XR3 hammered just short of £18K, RS 2000 at £34K, 3 Litre Capri approached £24K. Pick of the bunch must have been the low mileage P100 pick up that made £23,520. Elsewhere an original and well-restored Mini Clubman Estate for £18K or a Plymouth Prowler with matching trailer (if you really must...) for a scarcely believable £37,520.
One of the casualties was my very straight Lancia Fulvia Coupe in rally spec that stalled way short of lowest estimate at £7K - although a great 100 mile drive home cheered me up and made me realise that it needs to be a "keeper". Must be worth more than 1/3 the value of a Ford pick up surely ??
Many older or more exotic cars remained unsold even with modest reserve prices. By my reckoning just 2 of 8 Ferraris found new owners, similarly only 3/9 911 derivatives.
However the more recent stuff...especially with a blue oval, a different story. Escort XR3 hammered just short of £18K, RS 2000 at £34K, 3 Litre Capri approached £24K. Pick of the bunch must have been the low mileage P100 pick up that made £23,520. Elsewhere an original and well-restored Mini Clubman Estate for £18K or a Plymouth Prowler with matching trailer (if you really must...) for a scarcely believable £37,520.
One of the casualties was my very straight Lancia Fulvia Coupe in rally spec that stalled way short of lowest estimate at £7K - although a great 100 mile drive home cheered me up and made me realise that it needs to be a "keeper". Must be worth more than 1/3 the value of a Ford pick up surely ??
I'll look them up later and post here.
Got to feel sorry for the punter who entered a very tidy Z3 roadster with no reserve. Not necessarily my thing but it presented beautifully in metallic blue with good black leather. 2 owners, 70K warranted miles, factory hard top. Kept in a heated garage, full history and clearly loved. It made £2700 at hammer, so take off entry fee, commission and other transport costs and the owner has probably made just under £2K.
Got to feel sorry for the punter who entered a very tidy Z3 roadster with no reserve. Not necessarily my thing but it presented beautifully in metallic blue with good black leather. 2 owners, 70K warranted miles, factory hard top. Kept in a heated garage, full history and clearly loved. It made £2700 at hammer, so take off entry fee, commission and other transport costs and the owner has probably made just under £2K.
Edited by moffspeed on Monday 9th March 09:32
Mr Tidy said:
I thought most lots struggled to get to decent prices, but then the auctioneer wasn't exactly impressive. 
VBH seemed to do much better.
Agree. Description of my Lancia was very sketchy, "narrow angle V4, twin cam, discs all around, 5 speed box" would have done it a bit of justice but we got "fizzy little engine" - surely you can do better than that.VBH seemed to do much better.
Yes VB-H needs to stick with her day job....
I went to the viewing last Wednesday and followed online on Saturday.
The quality of the presentation of the cars inside was good, outside was pretty poor and the auctioneering was bloody awful.
I grew up on livestock, industrial equipment auctions and BCA in business in the 80’s and as such am used to a level of competence. Having done 2 years now going round occasional Barons, Silverstone and Historics’ Auctions as a hobby, I would have to say that Saturday’s performance was woeful.
Losing track of bids, missing bidders, constantly surprised and irritated by “the computer / the internet people”.
That could have been excusable in a “R4 cricket commentary” sort of way, had they been witty, engaging or even knowledgeable about the cars - but none of that came across. I would not be impressed if I was a selling customer.
That aside, although it can hardly help - the market is definitely coming down - E types in particular. Modern classics (late 80;s/90s) are staying up. Ferraris also appeared to be out of favour. It was tempting to spend some money, but I think I will give it a little further into the summer to see how the economics progress.
I am a hobbyist here, not a professional - I am sure there will be other views.
The quality of the presentation of the cars inside was good, outside was pretty poor and the auctioneering was bloody awful.
I grew up on livestock, industrial equipment auctions and BCA in business in the 80’s and as such am used to a level of competence. Having done 2 years now going round occasional Barons, Silverstone and Historics’ Auctions as a hobby, I would have to say that Saturday’s performance was woeful.
Losing track of bids, missing bidders, constantly surprised and irritated by “the computer / the internet people”.
That could have been excusable in a “R4 cricket commentary” sort of way, had they been witty, engaging or even knowledgeable about the cars - but none of that came across. I would not be impressed if I was a selling customer.
That aside, although it can hardly help - the market is definitely coming down - E types in particular. Modern classics (late 80;s/90s) are staying up. Ferraris also appeared to be out of favour. It was tempting to spend some money, but I think I will give it a little further into the summer to see how the economics progress.
I am a hobbyist here, not a professional - I am sure there will be other views.
classicaholic said:
The estimates looked very low and a lot failed to reach them, I think we are looking at a correction especially things like E Types.
I'll have to hope that XKs come down a bit too, the prices shown seemed well down on previous ones and only the 120 found a new home.Stuart70 said:
I went to the viewing last Wednesday and followed online on Saturday.
...the auctioneering was bloody awful.
I grew up on livestock, industrial equipment auctions and BCA in business in the 80’s and as such am used to a level of competence. Having done 2 years now going round occasional Barons, Silverstone and Historics’ Auctions as a hobby, I would have to say that Saturday’s performance was woeful.
Losing track of bids, missing bidders, constantly surprised and irritated by “the computer / the internet people”.
That could have been excusable in a “R4 cricket commentary” sort of way, had they been witty, engaging or even knowledgeable about the cars - but none of that came across. I would not be impressed if I was a selling customer...
I would agree with all of that. Fortunately my car was one of the few that sold well. ...the auctioneering was bloody awful.
I grew up on livestock, industrial equipment auctions and BCA in business in the 80’s and as such am used to a level of competence. Having done 2 years now going round occasional Barons, Silverstone and Historics’ Auctions as a hobby, I would have to say that Saturday’s performance was woeful.
Losing track of bids, missing bidders, constantly surprised and irritated by “the computer / the internet people”.
That could have been excusable in a “R4 cricket commentary” sort of way, had they been witty, engaging or even knowledgeable about the cars - but none of that came across. I would not be impressed if I was a selling customer...
I was there and attend most Historics auctions as a day out more than intending to buy. On this occasion I was up for a punt on the Fiat Dino and silver Fulvia, both of which were excellent restorations, but neither were bargain prices and I bailed out.
Excluding fast Fords most lots followed last years trend of selling below lower estimate (before commission). Wish I'd taken a look at the Z3M before it went under the hammer as despite the mileage it looked tidy and the best bid was only 7 something.
I think the auctioneers must have been stressed by the slow market. They are usually better than latest performance and don't normally resort to bids in increments of £200 so readily. They let the sellers down imo.
If I'd known VBH was getting on the rostrum I wouldn't have left so early. Did she exhibit that dirty laugh?
Excluding fast Fords most lots followed last years trend of selling below lower estimate (before commission). Wish I'd taken a look at the Z3M before it went under the hammer as despite the mileage it looked tidy and the best bid was only 7 something.
I think the auctioneers must have been stressed by the slow market. They are usually better than latest performance and don't normally resort to bids in increments of £200 so readily. They let the sellers down imo.
If I'd known VBH was getting on the rostrum I wouldn't have left so early. Did she exhibit that dirty laugh?
I too was there for about 3hrs and there were a few striking things. It was my very first car auction!
- The Lambo went for 260k - it was stunning, perfect in every way, and hit the estimate
- I would estimate about 40% of cars didn't sell in the auction, but about a third of them came back as being sold subsequently and these were announced
- There was a very cheap California - I think about 67.5k in the end, but the Ferrari's did struggle
- I got the sense that some owners (presumably on advice) were maybe trying to push the values on the reserve too high. Maybe the market is getting a bit more sense (E-types are all over the place it seems, as an example!).
- I've no particular view on the auctioneer as I hadn't any previous experience. I had, however, expected a few more words on each car even though anyone interested would have presumably looked at the vehicle and read about it.
- VBH was indeed there, but wasn't a great auctioneer. Very little in the way of the trademark laugh! Still lovely though :-)
Oh and I bought a car... The silver Mercedes 190SL. I was pushed to my limit, but very happy with it! It's stunning, beautiful and is what I was after...tainted with the idea of the DB7 Manual - again a stunning car and who can resist a V12 Manual! I think it went for 23-24k.
- The Lambo went for 260k - it was stunning, perfect in every way, and hit the estimate
- I would estimate about 40% of cars didn't sell in the auction, but about a third of them came back as being sold subsequently and these were announced
- There was a very cheap California - I think about 67.5k in the end, but the Ferrari's did struggle
- I got the sense that some owners (presumably on advice) were maybe trying to push the values on the reserve too high. Maybe the market is getting a bit more sense (E-types are all over the place it seems, as an example!).
- I've no particular view on the auctioneer as I hadn't any previous experience. I had, however, expected a few more words on each car even though anyone interested would have presumably looked at the vehicle and read about it.
- VBH was indeed there, but wasn't a great auctioneer. Very little in the way of the trademark laugh! Still lovely though :-)
Oh and I bought a car... The silver Mercedes 190SL. I was pushed to my limit, but very happy with it! It's stunning, beautiful and is what I was after...tainted with the idea of the DB7 Manual - again a stunning car and who can resist a V12 Manual! I think it went for 23-24k.
MauriceFontana said:
Stuart70 said:
I went to the viewing last Wednesday and followed online on Saturday.
...the auctioneering was bloody awful.
I grew up on livestock, industrial equipment auctions and BCA in business in the 80’s and as such am used to a level of competence. Having done 2 years now going round occasional Barons, Silverstone and Historics’ Auctions as a hobby, I would have to say that Saturday’s performance was woeful.
Losing track of bids, missing bidders, constantly surprised and irritated by “the computer / the internet people”.
That could have been excusable in a “R4 cricket commentary” sort of way, had they been witty, engaging or even knowledgeable about the cars - but none of that came across. I would not be impressed if I was a selling customer...
I would agree with all of that. Fortunately my car was one of the few that sold well. ...the auctioneering was bloody awful.
I grew up on livestock, industrial equipment auctions and BCA in business in the 80’s and as such am used to a level of competence. Having done 2 years now going round occasional Barons, Silverstone and Historics’ Auctions as a hobby, I would have to say that Saturday’s performance was woeful.
Losing track of bids, missing bidders, constantly surprised and irritated by “the computer / the internet people”.
That could have been excusable in a “R4 cricket commentary” sort of way, had they been witty, engaging or even knowledgeable about the cars - but none of that came across. I would not be impressed if I was a selling customer...
SFTWend said:
I was there and attend most Historics auctions as a day out more than intending to buy. On this occasion I was up for a punt on the Fiat Dino and silver Fulvia, both of which were excellent restorations, but neither were bargain prices and I bailed out.
Excluding fast Fords most lots followed last years trend of selling below lower estimate (before commission). Wish I'd taken a look at the Z3M before it went under the hammer as despite the mileage it looked tidy and the best bid was only 7 something.
I think the auctioneers must have been stressed by the slow market. They are usually better than latest performance and don't normally resort to bids in increments of £200 so readily. They let the sellers down imo.
If I'd known VBH was getting on the rostrum I wouldn't have left so early. Did she exhibit that dirty laugh?
Agree with you; and yes, VBH was very cute, as she was at the Wednesday preview as well.Excluding fast Fords most lots followed last years trend of selling below lower estimate (before commission). Wish I'd taken a look at the Z3M before it went under the hammer as despite the mileage it looked tidy and the best bid was only 7 something.
I think the auctioneers must have been stressed by the slow market. They are usually better than latest performance and don't normally resort to bids in increments of £200 so readily. They let the sellers down imo.
If I'd known VBH was getting on the rostrum I wouldn't have left so early. Did she exhibit that dirty laugh?
I was after the silver Fulvia, but similar to yourself, it did not feel like a bargain in comparison with some of the other cars going through, so I did not chase it. Ah well, until the next one. Hopefully the auctioneers will have recovered some sense of competence, pace and humour by then.
I was following that auction online for a short time. I have an old Boxster so I was curious, and slightly pleased to see a 2002 model with 108k miles fetch almost £4k, although the description fails to explain its not a 2.5 but a later 2.7:
https://www.historics.co.uk/buying/auctions/2020-0...
And the 2002 Mercedes E500 with 55k miles seemed to sell cheap at £3700:
https://www.historics.co.uk/buying/auctions/2020-0...
Mind you, there's no mention of history in the listing, and the MoT advisories for brake pipes and tyres will need sorting. Still end up under £4k. Was it rusty underneath?
As for some of the Ford prices, just mental....
https://www.historics.co.uk/buying/auctions/2020-0...
And the 2002 Mercedes E500 with 55k miles seemed to sell cheap at £3700:
https://www.historics.co.uk/buying/auctions/2020-0...
Mind you, there's no mention of history in the listing, and the MoT advisories for brake pipes and tyres will need sorting. Still end up under £4k. Was it rusty underneath?
As for some of the Ford prices, just mental....
Edited by V8fan on Monday 9th March 18:46
ASM993 said:
Does anyone who was there remember what the Integrale bid to? It doesnt appear to have sold but looked lovely. Many thanks.
Sorry don't know best bid but I do know it's the second time Historics have failed to sell it. Surprised as it looked great. Maybe the mix of New Zealand and Japan background put buyers off.Stuart70 said:
Agree with you; and yes, VBH was very cute, as she was at the Wednesday preview as well.
I was after the silver Fulvia, but similar to yourself, it did not feel like a bargain in comparison with some of the other cars going through, so I did not chase it. Ah well, until the next one. Hopefully the auctioneers will have recovered some sense of competence, pace and humour by then.
I think that Fulvia had been extremely nicely restored on top and underneath. However there were a couple of paint bubbles on leading edge of the bonnet and I suspected maybe rust coming through rather than stone chips. Wasn't microblistering. So I set myself a £12k limit on the basis a currently immaculate car could soon see rust coming through in the usual places.I was after the silver Fulvia, but similar to yourself, it did not feel like a bargain in comparison with some of the other cars going through, so I did not chase it. Ah well, until the next one. Hopefully the auctioneers will have recovered some sense of competence, pace and humour by then.
Gassing Station | Classic Cars and Yesterday's Heroes | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff